The Resistant Starch Challenge: Is It The Key We've Been Looking For?

Sidereal

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My psyllium powder (Source Naturals) says on the packet how much water you have to take with it. I read somewhere that you can get intestinal blockages with it if you don't use enough water. I'm surprised that it's OK to take it dry as a capsule or just in food.
I drink two glasses of water with 1/4 or 1/2 teaspoon of psyllium. It's bulk/matrix forming so of course you must be very careful that you drink it with lots of liquid and not take too much at once to prevent choking, intestinal obstruction etc.
 

Vegas

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This pairing of chemical compounds in plants and prebiotics is something I have discussed, but it really is worth mentioning again because this extends to many different compounds/nutrients. While we could clearly point to many correlations, it is the strength of these correlations that stands out to me. Iodine is just one example.

If the prebiotic potential of a substance is strongly correlated with other properties, as I have observed, then I would posit that the pairing of the prebiotic is with a compound that can be particularly difficult to metabolize (resulting in increased reactive oxygen species). This will include many of the primary offending foods in ME/CFS. Acetaldehyde, cysteine-rich foods, lectins, alkaloid compounds, etc.

Additionally, I think there is a grouping between mineral-dense foods, involved in stimulating energy biosynthesis as appears to be the case with iodine. Algae are rich accumulators of minerals, including iodine. What are some of the world's other richest sources of iodine: (need to look this up, but these are the things I can think of)

shrimp/shellfish: structural polysaccharide; chitin
bannanas/potato: storage polysaccharide: amylopectin/amylose
seaweed/sea vegetables: structural polysaccharide mannan, xylan
cranberries: mannan (hence its application in treating UTI's)

Talk about feeding your colon; lots of acetylated and sulfated compounds here. Am I saying some algae is going to fix your thyroid and make this more tolerable? No, but thyroid hormonal secretion is under control of more fundamental processes, and these have been proven to operate more efficiently with higher concentrations of butyrate.
 

Vegas

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One of the adverse effects of raising the metabolic rate appears to involve the transient increase in serum uric acid; while I doubt this is clinically detectable, these are potentially damaging symptoms if the flare is severe and persists.

Of course, this led me to think a bit about a prebiotic solution, as myopic as this sounds. Still, I think this might offer some clues about what might help reduce these symptoms. Of course there is cherry extract, but the mucilage Plantago genus might be something to consider given its efficacy increasing uric acid excretion, The composition of the different species varies, but this might help.

I had actually been looking at one of things for it's efficacy in treating tumors. Looks like the concentrations of GalA
may convey benefits.

"The new polysaccharide with immunomodulatory activities isolated from Plantago palmata has a very high molecular weight (1200 kDa) and is pectic in nature, with a predominantly unbranched galacturonan domain and with a domain bearing side chains that consist of highly branched arabinan, galactan, and/or arabinogalactan. Comparatively to the well-known Plantago major biologically active polysaccharide (PS), Plantago palmata PS50 contain less arabinogalactan-proteins and has different contents of glucose, galactose, and galacturonic acid. It would be interesting to compare the biological activities of both Plantago."
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Vegas

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I received my weekly Medscape Bulletin this week in which the authors reviewed the most recent evidence (generally studies from 2014) relating to the use of dietary supplement in the treatment of Type II Diabetes. I think it is notable that the entire list included:

B vitamins: folate, B6, & B12
Chromium
Fenugreek
Aloe Vera
Cinnamon

Of course the later three are all dense in resistant prebiotics that stimulate not just organisms, but epithelial-maintaining colonic organisms, and will all theoretically increase the rate at which these methyl donors will become available for metabolic purposes.

Some pretty impressive results ascribed to these compounds, and the mainstream medical community is now starting to legitimize these compounds. There is more to this than converting energy from our foods and inhibiting insulin release, they have demonstrated some efficacy in lipid management and other measures of metabolic efficiency, including weight loss. These prebiotics are most certainly changing the core metabolic expression. I have found that I started losing weight again having found a more appropriate balance/dosage of prebiotics. In part associated with increased activity, but I believe my metabolism has sped up as well. Taking too much has the opposite effect and potato starch alone without some of the anti-inflammatory partners seems to have this effect.
 

Sidereal

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I have found that I started losing weight again having found a more appropriate balance/dosage of prebiotics. In part associated with increased activity, but I believe my metabolism has sped up as well. Taking too much has the opposite effect and potato starch alone without some of the anti-inflammatory partners seems to have this effect.
I gained weight on the potato starch. Recently I started experimenting with XOS and within a day or two I experienced marked reduction in appetite, general lack of interest in food/snacking, and increased energy. Unfortunately I've been hit with agonising gout symptoms so I've had to back off of it until things settle down.
 

Vegas

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So, Cinnamon, a very pertinent compound to ME/CFS.

  • Cinnamic acid is a a caroboxylic acid.
  • it is created as a byproduct of phenylalanine ammonia-lysase acting on phenylalanine and it also creates ammonia. (This is why you need the full complement of organisms that support all metabolic pathways and their byproducts).
  • It is a precursor to everyone's favorite chemical, aspartame.
  • When it accumulates, melanin synthesis in inhibited, so of course this has an effect on your vitamin D status and folate availability, hence your immune response What happens in your gut, and what organisms you possess or lack exerts far-reaching effects over your immune response. Recall that I said 5-MTHF is oxidized by UVB, and more readily depending upon the skin pigmentation. UV rays also participate in the differentiation of T-regulatory cells.
  • Then there is another microbial contribution as microbes produce melanin as a result of oxidation of phenolic compounds. In doing so, our immune response is inhibited.
There is a microoraganism which happens to be among a relatively small number of organisms that maintain the intestinal epithelium and is uniquely qualified to metabolize cinnamic acid, but one cannot magically supplement with this organism because the total environmental/metabolic conditions are what determines the survivability of these species. You have to fix this little by little and find the parts that you are missing...or so it seems.
 

Gondwanaland

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I don't think I would soak the psyllium. I'm assuming you are suggesting that this would increase their tolerability, similar to how lectin-concentrated foods like nuts or legumes are prepared.
No, b/c it is not possible to discard the water it is soaked in. I had been taking 1/2 teaspoon in one glass of water/juice with breakfast and dinner for a few days, apparently with no problems. But I was concerned with it binding nutrients.

In the meanwhile I started taking silymarin which fixed my temperature swings but caused detox reactions, and I took 1/2 teaspoon of psyllium husks in one glass of water about 45 min after the silymarin to bind toxins. But I didn't wait the usual 15 soaking minutes, it was still a little dry and I had a blockage for 3 days, until I precipitated things by taking lots of magnesium.

My problems really begun when I started taking my new psyllium husks delivered by iHerb, which seemed to be goitrogen, blocking the use of iodine to convert T4 into T3 - confirmed by a blood test that showed low T3. For now I have been avoiding iodine sources due to autoimmune thyroiditis. I hope to get antibodies down with hormone replacement and possibly by starting LDN as well. When antibodies are low enough it is my intention to go on an iodine protocol.

With this in mind I tried taking it before bed to avoid hypothyroid symptoms during the day. I have had bad nights before, but that one was really awful, I felt a weight pressure on my head and my chest against the bed, general autoimmune pain like I get from warfarin, gluten, potato starch, flaxseeds, etc., heart arritmia, increased urination. At least in the following morning I had a rare good bowel movement.

Now I backed off and am taking just a pinch in a glass of liquid and will try to build it up to 1/2 teaspoon daily slowly. Unfortunately this technique didn't work with potato starch (autoimmune pains), but then it wasn't worth it since it did close to nothing to my bowel movements.

@Vegas thank you so much for the information you posted on the subject, it will take me a while to process it all!
 

adreno

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Xylitol has prebiotic properties (increase bifido and SCFAs). Any consensus on the use of it? Good or bad?

I'm thinking about making rice flour brownies, with xylitol as the sweetener.
 

shah78

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Where are you guys getting aloe vera mannan, chitin and xylan from? They are not exactly your run of the mill prebiotics.
Chitan is easy: eat the shells with the shrimp. The smallest shrimp are the cheapest and have the thinnest shells. Also is a source of glucosamine. Essentially eating very healthy compose! what could be better!:)
 

adreno

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Chitan is easy: eat the shells with the shrimp. The smallest shrimp are the cheapest and have the thinnest shells. Also is a source of glucosamine. Essentially eating very healthy compose! what could be better!:)
Good idea, I never thought you could digest them, but apparently they turn crispy when fried.
 
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To the OP: Maybe this is a lame question, but how would this affect someone with chronic low blood sugar?
Would it correct and balance things out or make things worse?
 

ariel

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Recently I started experimenting with XOS and within a day or two I experienced marked reduction in appetite, general lack of interest in food/snacking, and increased energy.
Sidereal, would you mind letting me know which XOS you are trying.
The increased energy is interesting. Thank you.
 

Sidereal

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Sidereal, would you mind letting me know which XOS you are trying.
The increased energy is interesting. Thank you.
Hi Ariel, like I mentioned in my post, the XOS also gave me a huge gout attack which actually lasted two weeks and is only resolving now. If you're ever experienced it, you'll know that the pain can be excruciating. I am reluctant to post what product I took as I don't want anyone to harm themselves.
 

ariel

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Thank you :) and no problem. That sounds intense. Two weeks is a long time.
This process isn't exactly easy. I'm still astounded by just how much my body is affected by these various powders. Shows just how out of balance my gut and other systems actually are. After six months I can still only take a fraction of what others can, and if I rush it everything goes haywire. Still, I can take a lot more than the smidgen I began with.
I believe that some XOS is in spirulina, might be a less concentrated way to start.
Be well.
 

Sidereal

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Thank you :) and no problem. That sounds intense. Two weeks is a long time.
This process isn't exactly easy. I'm still astounded by just how much my body is affected by these various powders. Shows just how out of balance my gut and other systems actually are. After six months I can still only take a fraction of what others can, and if I rush it everything goes haywire. Still, I can take a lot more than the smidgen I began with.
I believe that some XOS is in spirulina, might be a less concentrated way to start.
Be well.
It really is astonishing how powerful these prebiotics are. Same here, after 10 months of doing this diligently I can only tolerate small doses. I am just shocked by the mega potency of XOS. I took a smidgen (maybe 100 mg per day tops) for a week and the backlash has been extreme. Nonetheless, in the first few days of taking it it was addressing essentially all my symptoms and at times I felt practically normal so I think this is something to revisit once the uric acid issue has cleared up.

I think spirulina may be a good idea. I recenly got a product that contains a mix of red algae + spirulina to try but have been unable to do so yet due to gout. I see that people use it for treatment of herpes virus outbreaks. XOS definitely caused varicella zoster shedding for me, still ongoing. It has been an interesting and perturbing journey.
 

ariel

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'Interesting and perturbing journey' just about sums it up!
Who would have thunk that XOS would have so many effects. My limited understanding is that it actually feeds the various bacteria that the other prebiotics help to specifically grow. I guess all those bifido etc that you've been growing were hungry and gobbled up the little bits of XOS you gave them! Though who knows what is going on!
Interesting re the herpes virus too. I've been using lysine for that, but more than happy to start adding in spirulina.
Your new product sounds perfect for when you are ready.