WARNING - LOW POTASSIUM IS DANGEROUS

[rydra_wong]

With respect to potassium deficiency, John Johnson at ithyroid.com listed not only stiffness as a symptom (as we have found at this board) but also edema (water retention). I wondered if anyone else found this to be true? Is water retention an early warning symptom of potassium deficiency? I would especially like to hear from MadieTodd since she bought a potassium monitor. Thanks

Rydra

 

[maddietod]

Rydra, I answered this on another thread....of course, I forget which one!

I don't have water retention, related to low potassium or for any other reason.

Madie

 

[Pea]

My friend started a different program with naturopath on Monday, and went from +800mg of potassium and +500 mg. of magnesium to 99mg Potassium and 75mg of magnesium. Brain fog & anxiety returned, and he started getting cramps in his arms. I have to think it's these electrolytes, and not start-up symptoms, so I already had him increase.

that's interesting about the B1, I was noticing there is no B1 in the revised B formula supplement.

 

[rydra_wong]

Rydra, I answered this on another thread....of course, I forget which one!

I don't have water retention, related to low potassium or for any other reason.

Madie

Thanks, Madie. I have water retention issues pretty much all the time...used to be only at PMS but menopause is PMS forever for me. I didn't realise it until I tried DMSO and found it took inflammation (or whatever makes your socks make a ring on your legs) right down. DMSO also causes potassium drop like mfolate does, fyi (at least I noticed it once). I have had electrolyte problems my whole life and never knew there was a dietary cause. It would be great to be able to identify all the causes so I could be prepared, you know?

Pea, I take Thorne Basic B which has all the active B's plus folinic acid, and I use one of Thorne's Multis which also has the basic B formula in it. If folinic is not an issue for you, this is a good one. I was raised in the 60's when nutritionist Adele Davis was popular and she said to never take the B vitamins separately since they work synergistically. So I never would. However even taking B1 may not be enough as I understand it only stays in the body for a matter of hours and many things destroy it That is why the interest in an oil soluble form of B1 -- benfotiamine.
Take care
Rydra

 

[Pea]

Ah, the Bs my friend is on has benfotiamine, so there is his B1.
His new dr. didn't want him on the Bs or the Thorne Multi, so I take those now.

Rydra, in another post I can't find you mentioned something about magnesium causing excitability in muscles if a person has NADH(?) problems. I thought magnesium helped muscles calm down?

 

[aquariusgirl]

hi folks, i'm still circling this potassium deficiency thing. I just reviewed regular labs going back to 2007, which is when i first started supplementing folate and b12. the labs show potassium in range. 4.1 or 4.4 range 3.5-5.? (5.5 I think). Would you expect a potassium deficiency to show up in regular bloodwork ?

I recently did that exatest intracellular elements test & my potassium was very healthy BUT I had been supplementing big dosages the days before because I didn't realise the test only reflected the previous 4 days levels so it doesnt' tell me anything about my baseline off supps!! $280 not well spent...

 

[maddietod]

Aquarius, you might have already seen this information - I can't remember where I've posted it. My labs going back 10+ years showed potassium usually at 3.7, once at 3.9. So you're starting out higher than my normal.

When taking 2000mcg hb12 and 500mcg mb12 daily, and not supplementing potassium, my level drops below the normal range. My normal diet provides less than half of the RDA for potassium.

When I supplement and eat so that I reach the RDA daily, I can stay in the normal range, but I have yet to get to 4.0.

Madie

 

[Sallysblooms]

Benfotiamine is wonderful. My doc and I added it to my supplements about three months ago. Since then, my POTS has improved even faster. It is fat and water soluble.

 

[snowathlete]

With respect to potassium deficiency, John Johnson at ithyroid.com listed not only stiffness as a symptom (as we have found at this board) but also edema (water retention). I wondered if anyone else found this to be true? Is water retention an early warning symptom of potassium deficiency?

Ive been dieting a while as im trying to lose weight. Ive had some sucess, and the first 16+ pounds came off quickly when i dropped my intake to about 1400 calories.
Anyway, about ten days ago, I stopped losing weight. Even though my intake had not increased. After about 4 days i thought, this is odd.
Ive also been tracking my potasium intake, including food, and even with 600mg a day supplements, it was still way low. Like half the RDA.
So, i thought to increase my potasium, which i have to about 1600mg a day. At the same time i wondered if that might be a factor in my weight loss stopping. Maybe i was retaining water.
At the same time, i also had thai red curry (Which i seem to always lose weight on) and the last three days i have lost weight. Back to normal, about half a pound a day.

So, although its far from conclusive, maybe the i was getting low in potassium again, and having increased the dose, it may have helped me lose fluid. It seems likely to me that i was losing fat as per normal when dieting, but retaining increased fluid, so i seemed to not be losing weight.

 

[triffid113]

Ive been dieting a while as im trying to lose weight. Ive had some sucess, and the first 16+ pounds came off quickly when i dropped my intake to about 1400 calories.
Anyway, about ten days ago, I stopped losing weight. Even though my intake had not increased. After about 4 days i thought, this is odd.
Ive also been tracking my potasium intake, including food, and even with 600mg a day supplements, it was still way low. Like half the RDA.
So, i thought to increase my potasium, which i have to about 1600mg a day. At the same time i wondered if that might be a factor in my weight loss stopping. Maybe i was retaining water.
At the same time, i also had thai red curry (Which i seem to always lose weight on) and the last three days i have lost weight. Back to normal, about half a pound a day.

So, although its far from conclusive, maybe the i was getting low in potassium again, and having increased the dose, it may have helped me lose fluid. It seems likely to me that i was losing fat as per normal when dieting, but retaining increased fluid, so i seemed to not be losing weight.

Brilliant! Thank you! That is EXACTLY what I am experiencing! And I KNOW FOR A FACT I weigh less because I know how few calories I have been taking in but I can feel I am retaining water. Thank you, Snowathlete!!!

Triffid (formerly R y d r a)

 

[triffid113]

hi folks, i'm still circling this potassium deficiency thing. I just reviewed regular labs going back to 2007, which is when i first started supplementing folate and b12. the labs show potassium in range. 4.1 or 4.4 range 3.5-5.? (5.5 I think). Would you expect a potassium deficiency to show up in regular bloodwork ?

I recently did that exatest intracellular elements test & my potassium was very healthy BUT I had been supplementing big dosages the days before because I didn't realise the test only reflected the previous 4 days levels so it doesnt' tell me anything about my baseline off supps!! $280 not well spent...

Aquarius you might talk to Freddd. He says you can experience potassium shortage at 4.1 It is best to aim for high 4, like 4.5 or higher. Anything like 4.0 or lower will cause real potassium shortage symptoms and to be reasonably sure to keep above that you need to aim for 4.5 because it won't stay steady you know.

Triffid

 

[maddietod]

Aquarius you might talk to Freddd. He says you can experience potassium shortage at 4.1 It is best to aim for high 4, like 4.5 or higher. Anything like 4.0 or lower will cause real potassium shortage symptoms and to be reasonably sure to keep above that you need to aim for 4.5 because it won't stay steady you know.

Triffid

I can't get up to 4. At the moment I'm happy to keep myself above the bottom of normal.

 

[triffid113]

Really? Do you get low blood sugar attacks? Each low blood sugar attack will cause you to lose 1.8g potassium. Do you exercise a lot and lose it via sweat? How much mfolate are you taking? How much potassium? I keep dried apricots o hand and eat them for potassium as well as supplementing potassium gluconate .5-1g/day (I just pour an appx amount in my hand and then into my drink). Do you drink coffee? For Americans, coffee is one of our top 5 sources of potassium. (I know it's terribly unhealthy to rely on coffee for potassium, but it helps me get my levels up. I am at about 4.5). I think probably the healthiest way to get extra potassium is by juicing raw vegetables. My brother-in-law juices and his doctor thought his potassium was a little too high! (He is young and healthy and has no kidney problems).

Triffid

 

[triffid113]

I just want to get in here to say that it's spring and if any of you are dieting, you can bet you need more potassium (to make up for what you are not getting via food). If you do not take more potassium and you are doing serious dieting it will cause symptoms like water retention (so you stop losing weight even though you know you are taking in fewer calories), and it will also cause muscle fatigue and depression. This is aside from any other need for potassium due to common conditions causing it's loss, such as low blood sugar attacks (you lose 1.8g), sweating such as due to exercise, etc, or being used up due to improved methylation. It happened to me, I read up, it's true.

I take this - 1 ts in a bottle of vitamin water: http://www.iherb.com/Now-Foods-Potassium-Gluconate-100-Pure-Powder-1-lb-454-g/13939?at=0

I also love this vegetable drink and think it is a good source of potassium: http://www.iherb.com/Eclectic-Insti...nstant-Health-Support-3-17-oz-90-g/18652?at=0

Lastly, I keep dried apricots on hand. I can slip a few in a zip lock bag as a travelling source of potassium.

 

[Hanna]

Supplementing potassium in an efficient way should include avoiding taking potassium inhibitors at the same time.
K inhibitors : Manganese (for the "B2 protocole"), Magnesium, Sodium, Chromium, Sulfur, vit.B3, B12, folate and lecithin.

 

[triffid113]

Hanna, that is brutal. On your list of K inhibitors are much needed nutrients. Where do you get this information? Thanks

Trif

 

[Hanna]

Hanna, that is brutal. On your list of K inhibitors are much needed nutrients. Where do you get this information? Thanks

Trif

Hi Trif,

I got this info from the site acu-cell nutrition :
http://www.acu-cell.com

I can't verify it but thought that if this is right, one should take the supplements at different times in the day. That is what I am doing for the moment.
The site is very informative, gives for each nutrient of course RDA, deficiency signs etc... but also the other substances that inhibit it or on the contrary enhance its effects on body.
Hope that it will help.

 

[dannybex]

Hi Triffid,

I'm curious if you have a link for the low blood sugar/potassium loss of 1.8 grams? I had heard somewhere that sugar lowers potassium...but maybe I just dreamt that!

That Twango powder looks interesting...I wish they listed the amount of potassium in each serving.

I just wanted to mention that 2 of the foods highest in potassium -- tomatoes and potatoes -- also contain solanine, which inhibits calcium (and/or vitamin d), and so in some people these nightshade vegetables can cause severe joint problems and even fibromyalgia-type muscle pain. It IS extremely frustrating to find things that everyone or even most of us can tolerate! :0

Also...yes, dried fruits are great sources of potassium, but can be a problem for folks with salicylate intolerances and also who need to avoid sulfur or more specifically sulfites (due to methylation problems and/or genetic SNPs.). I used to eat dates, raisins, figs, etc., but found out I have the CBS mutation, so have to avoid them until I get the sulfite/sulfur/ammonia issue under control.

Complicated and frustrating! In the meantime, I'm stuck with sweet potatoes (not as high in sals) and various beans, which are quite high in potassium, and also some supplemental potassium chloride as you mention above. Hoping it will help decrease the pain in my feet.

Just my two cents.

Dan

p.s. There's always bananas...but only if one can stomach them.

I just want to get in here to say that it's spring and if any of you are dieting, you can bet you need more potassium (to make up for what you are not getting via food). If you do not take more potassium and you are doing serious dieting it will cause symptoms like water retention (so you stop losing weight even though you know you are taking in fewer calories), and it will also cause muscle fatigue and depression. This is aside from any other need for potassium due to common conditions causing it's loss, such as low blood sugar attacks (you lose 1.8g), sweating such as due to exercise, etc, or being used up due to improved methylation. It happened to me, I read up, it's true.

I take this - 1 ts in a bottle of vitamin water: http://www.iherb.com/Now-Foods-Potassium-Gluconate-100-Pure-Powder-1-lb-454-g/13939?at=0

I also love this vegetable drink and think it is a good source of potassium: http://www.iherb.com/Eclectic-Insti...nstant-Health-Support-3-17-oz-90-g/18652?at=0

Lastly, I keep dried apricots on hand. I can slip a few in a zip lock bag as a travelling source of potassium.

 

[Hanna]

Hi Triffid,


Also...yes, dried fruits are great sources of potassium, but can be a problem for folks with salicylate intolerances and also who need to avoid sulfur or more specifically sulfites (due to methylation problems and/or genetic SNPs.). I used to eat dates, raisins, figs, etc., but found out I have the CBS mutation, so have to avoid them until I get the sulfite/sulfur/ammonia issue under control.

Hi Danny,
Do dates,figs etc.. include sulfites when organicaly grown?

 

[dannybex]

Hi Danny,
Do dates,figs etc.. include sulfites when organicaly grown?

Not sure Hanna...am trying to get an answer on that, but just want to say too that the salicylates/phenols in dried (or undried) fruits and veggies can be a just as bad for some of us, as they can mess with methylation issues as well.