The Resistant Starch Challenge: Is It The Key We've Been Looking For?

[adreno]

@whodathunkit, I don't think you meant to be condescending, I'm just reading into the implications of what you're saying.

Have you ever raised children? We can probably agree that setting reasonable limits, as well as giving them healthy challenges is conducive of personal growth. However, giving them pain, abuse and unsurmountable tasks that break their confidence isn't.

It's true that some people seem to rise above being traumatized, and go on to be better persons, but they are the exception, not the rule. We can speculate why this is, my guess would be genetics.

PTSD is not a personal choice. Choices are made in the brain, a biological organ that follows the laws of physics. You cannot rise above your biology. Frankly, the idea that you can smells too much of dualism, or mind over matter to me.

And the implications of this is that since recovery hinges upon being able to rise above your biology, the patients who are not able to rise above their biology are then at fault for not being able to recover.

Recovery from this disease is not a question of hanging in there, of having the guts to soldier on through adversity and side effects. It is not about discovering some hidden, personal path to health. It is simply a question of biology.

What we need are not patients like Victor Frankl or Nelson Mandela, but support, funding and research.

 

[jepps]

My CFS friend takes RS and fibres+probiotics since October, and Sanum since 1 month. The stool before starting RS+fibres did not show candida, the newest test shows highest excretion. I made the same experience. No one doctor ever treated candida, they said, stooltest shows nothing, but in reality fungi is so deep in the tissues, that it does not show in the stooltest.

Myself, I experience stomach pain, brain fog (taking supplements is a challenge - which one is to take), arthritis, problems, which were solved with RS+fibres.
Monitoring still excreting shows coxsackie virus of the nerv cells. As viruses attack bacterias, they attack the gut flora, when excreted of the cells, in searching a new host. Immunity stimulation via the gut can result in excreting viruses, which then should be treated, when the symptoms strong.

 

[Sidereal]

And the implications of this is that since recovery hinges upon being able to rise above your biology, the patients who are not able to rise above their biology are then at fault for not being able to recover.

Recovery from this disease is not a question of hanging in there, of having the guts to soldier on through adversity and side effects. It is not about discovering some hidden, personal path to health. It is simply a question of biology.

What we need are not patients like Victor Frankl or Nelson Mandela, but support, funding and research.

It's a cruel twist really that a patient with such a serious illness is expected to not only cope emotionally and practically with life-destroying symptoms but also become superhuman in terms of attitude, personality and medical knowledge. People with other serious diseases have doctors and researchers doing the thinking for them, are offered treatments (limited as they are), and are not expected to become saint-like in their attitude and pick up MD/PhD level knowledge of physiology in order to help themselves. These psychosocial factors just add insult to injury IMO.

 

[Sidereal]

The stool before starting RS+fibres did not show candida, the newest test shows highest excretion.

Could this test result also be interpreted as your friend not having much candida in her gut before RS+fibers (hence the negative stool test at baseline) whereas now candida is proliferating and thus shows up on a stool test?

 

[jepps]

Could this test result also be interpreted as your friend not having much candida in her gut before RS+fibers (hence the negative stool test at baseline) whereas now candida is proliferating and thus shows up on a stool test?

She says, she has lifelong candida problems, and always wondered, that it does not show at a stool test, same as me.

I had the same thought of proliferating candida, as my stooltest shows never ending excreting candida. But monitoring shows the background of the processes, and shows, what processes are definitely going on: this is a huge detoxing process, which were not possible without treating Candida, and without RS+fibres. Since this package detoxing process is going on, and I do this testing since 4 years.

. My CFS-girlfried (she is 30 years, not able to work since 6 years) also does this monitoring, it shows the same: better immunity, but more excretion.

A German researcher, Dr. Bach, Karlsruhe, treated patients with Fluconazol. Before he treated them, he made the candida visible with a special procedure. Candida was so deep in the tissue, that after 4 months of treatment more than half of the candida was in the mucosa. And the patients were so ill after 4 months of treating with Fluconazol. I realize, that, when Th1 is lacking, we can have fungi everywhere, as it grows more than it is excreted, Fungi not only overgrows the body, but other microbes and toxins. To detox viruses, we must first treat fungi.

 

[Maia]

As viruses attack bacterias, they attack the gut flora, when excreted of the cells, in searching a new host. Immunity stimulation via the gut can result in excreting viruses, which then should be treated, when the symptoms strong.

Could it be that coxsackie virus attacks some of the fungi when searching a new host too, some get killed and that's why they show up in the test?
Or by killing the fungi the virus get released from them, and not only your own cells?

 

[jepps]

Could it be that coxsackie virus attacks some of the fungi when searching a new host too, some get killed and that's why they show up in the test?, Or by killing the fungi the virus get released from them, and not only your own cells?

@Maia I wondered the last week since the coxsackie is active, why I again have gut cramps and inflammation pain, what was solved with taking RS+fibres. Today I read in research, that viruses attack bacteria, and now I assume, that coxsackie that is mobilized from the cells atacks the gut bacterias.
Monitoring shows, that there happens something in the brain and in cells. It will both happen, releasing viruses from the excreting fungi, and from the cells. Increasing immune system begins to grapple with chronic infections.

This is a link about two very important gut bacterias: Faecalibacterium prausnitzii (lowers inflammation very strong) and Clostridial clusters (leading player in the gut, important for defending microbes, create mucus for the gut lining, and therefore reduce leaky gut), both are only fed with fibres.

 

[South]

Th1 is lacking, we can have fungi everywhere

@jepps I'm curious: did you or your girlfriend have any test result showing unbalanced th1 / th2 at any point?

I'm wondering if resistant starch + fiber +probiotics might be enough (for some people) to reduce candida load even if no other supplements to balance th1 and th2 are taken?

 

[jepps]

@jepps I'm curious: did you or your girlfriend have any test result showing unbalanced th1 / th2 at any point?

@South there are no tests available in Austria, my doctor tried to do one for me and my girlfriend, but we must go to Germany to do one. The blood test must sent by express within 24 hours, and this is not possible. It´s at the back of my head to search a doctor in Germany, it would be interesting, if Th1/Th2 is modifying during the fungi therapy.

@jepps
I'm wondering if resistant starch + fiber +probiotics might be enough (for some people) to reduce candida load even if no other supplements to balance th1 and th2 are taken?

I took 40 mg fibres+probiotics (higher dosage) for 3 months, the stool tests showed no candida. Then I did PHD, took 3 tsp (24 g) RS, 3 tsp (18 g) LAG and pectine, oligofructose, inulin, psyllium, acacia fibre, glucomannan, each 1 tsp., and since this time the stool test shows candida excretion.
I take S-acetyl-Glutathion since 2 years, what promotes Th1, but it did nothing for candida, also colostrum and other Th1 promoting supplements did nothing for candida. All changed with taking RS+prebiotics+probiotics at higher dosages.

My girlfriend had a very bad start in August with RS (1 tsp for 2 months) alone: she had pain, nutrition passed undigested, lab showed SIBO. After 2 months with 1 tsp RS she took 2 tsp RS+same fibres as I do (without inulin+oligofructuse because of FODMAP´s). Since January she is better, digestion has much improved, and she is searching for a work for 8-10 hours a week, SIBO has improved, candida is excreted.
She will start with methylation supps in April.

 

[adreno]

After 2 months with 1 tsp RS she took 2 tsp RS+same fibres as I do (without inulin+oligofructuse because of FODMAP´s).

So that leaves LAG, pectin, psyllium, acacia and glucomannan. Which of these fibres do you think is more effective against candida?

 

[jepps]

So that leaves LAG, pectin, psyllium, acacia and glucomannan. Which of these fibres do you think is more effective against candida?

I do not know, if there is a special fibre, which promotes candida excretion. For me and for the girlfriend the higher dosage, the diversity of several fibres, and including potatoe starch changed digestion, and promoted candida excretion.

 

[jstefl]

I am beginning to believe that the key to RS is patience. It has been over 14 months for me, and I am feeling noticeably better than when I started.

I started with PS and have added LAG, and pretty much everything else mentioned here.

When I started I was having continuous diarrhea. Today, that problem is probably 75% gone.

This has been an extremely slow process for me, but I am finally noticing some benefits to my efforts.

I am curious if anyone has any experience with the new drug designed for gram negative bacteria called Tol/Taz, or ceftolozane/tazobactam? This is a drug that was very recently approved and brought to market by Cubist Pharmaceuticals, which was then bought out by Merck. It sure would be wonderful if we could kill off the bad bacteria with a drug, rather than wait for nature to take its course.

John

 

[ariel]

took 3 tsp (24 g) RS, 3 tsp (18 g) LAG and pectine, oligofructose, inulin, psyllium, acacia fibre, glucomannan, each 1 tsp., and since this time the stool test shows candida excretion.

Jepps, would you mind clarifying for me what you took.
The 3tsp of RS - is that potato starch? Plus 3tsp of Larch. Plus 1tsp of each of the others?
Did you try S. boulardii? (Or any other probiotics useful for candida)
At what stage did you take the homeopathics? And do you think they were essential, or do you think the various fibres would have eventually sorted out the candida?

Thanks for all the information you have shared, and apologies if you have already gone over this, just trying to get it straight.

 

[jepps]

Jepps, would you mind clarifying for me what you took.
The 3tsp of RS - is that potato starch? Plus 3tsp of Larch. Plus 1tsp of each of the others?
Did you try S. boulardii? (Or any other probiotics useful for candida)
At what stage did you take the homeopathics? And do you think they were essential, or do you think the various fibres would have eventually sorted out the candida

@ariel 3 tsp potato starch, 3 tsp LAG, 2 tsp psyllium, pectine+inuline+FOS+glucomannan+baobab+oat bran+acacia fibre each 1 tsp. I started in April with psyllium+probiotics, after 1 month I added baobab+oat bran+glucomannan, after 2 months I added potato starch (1 tsp, after 3 weeks 3 tsp)+pectine+inuline+FOS+acacia fibre+LAG. This full programme lead to full candida excretion.
Since adding the homoepathic remedies I additionally excrete mold. This can only be from Sanum, because Nigersan is homoepathic Aspergillus niger, and from MO-FR I take Nigersan, each weekend I have mold in the stool, this lasts since 3 months, and probably this procedure goes on for the next 1-2 years.
I find it very useful to add Pleo-Sanum. Fungi as everywhere in the body, above all in the liver, and homoepathic remedies work in the whole body, the suppositories work efficient in the liver, and therefore in the gall bladder.
As fungi excretion lasts so long, it must be effordable. The ratio potato starch/fibres is important: I would maximal take 1/4 potato starch proportionable to the fibres. And I would take a the most possible diversity of fibres, mix them, and take them together, the fibres are not so expensive compared what other supplements often cost (except LAG, but my girlfriend takes LAG only with tiny dosage, but takes slippery elm, and also has success).

I believe, that the therapy lasts so long, because, with systemic fungi infection fungi overgrows everything, each toxin (heavy metals) and each virus. But when candida dies, free heavy metals and viruses (which were bound to fungi) are released in the intestine. Released heavy metals again promote candida overgrows, viruses attack bacterias. So we need a strong programme, to build up the gut again, and this is a strong programme for the gut.

 

[Abha]

@ariel 3 tsp potato starch, 3 tsp LAG, 2 tsp psyllium, pectine+inuline+FOS+glucomannan+baobab+oat bran+acacia fibre each 1 tsp. I started in April with psyllium+probiotics, after 1 month I added baobab+oat bran+glucomannan, after 2 months I added potato starch (1 tsp, after 3 weeks 3 tsp)+pectine+inuline+FOS+acacia fibre+LAG. This full programme lead to full candida excretion.
Since adding the homoepathic remedies I additionally excrete mold. This can only be from Sanum, because Nigersan is homoepathic Aspergillus niger, and from MO-FR I take Nigersan, each weekend I have mold in the stool, this lasts since 3 months, and probably this procedure goes on for the next 1-2 years.
I find it very useful to add Pleo-Sanum. Fungi as everywhere in the body, above all in the liver, and homoepathic remedies work in the whole body, the suppositories work efficient in the liver, and therefore in the gall bladder.
As fungi excretion lasts so long, it must be effordable. The ratio potato starch/fibres is important: I would maximal take 1/4 potato starch proportionable to the fibres. And I would take a the most possible diversity of fibres, mix them, and take them together, the fibres are not so expensive compared what other supplements often cost (except LAG, but my girlfriend takes LAG only with tiny dosage, but takes slippery elm, and also has success).

I believe, that the therapy lasts so long, because, with systemic fungi infection fungi overgrows everything, each toxin (heavy metals) and each virus. But when candida dies, free heavy metals and viruses (which were bound to fungi) are released in the intestine. Released heavy metals again promote candida overgrows, viruses attack bacterias. So we need a strong programme, to build up the gut again, and this is a strong programme for the gut.

Hi Jepps,

Thanks for all your information re your own treatment on this thread.Many people on this site will have gut/brain issues and those relating to candida,fungi,mold etc.I see you live in Austria and that you use Sanum products.In Austria does one have to have a prescription to obtain such products?In the UK recently I tried to obtain a product from Ainsworth's Chemists(Homeopathic)/London but I was told I would have to go to a Homeopathic doctor first and then presumably get a prescription from the homeopath for the medicines I required.It seems as though big Pharma/Govt has tightened up on such medicine.

 

[jepps]

Hi Jepps,

Thanks for all your information re your own treatment on this thread.Many people on this site will have gut/brain issues and those relating to candida,fungi,mold etc.I see you live in Austria and that you use Sanum products.In Austria does one have to have a prescription to obtain such products?In the UK recently I tried to obtain a product from Ainsworth's Chemists(Homeopathic)/London but I was told I would have to go to a Homeopathic doctor first and then presumably get a prescription from the homeopath for the medicines I required.It seems as though big Pharma/Govt has tightened up on such medicine.

And the homoepathic doctor costs money only for a prescription. Maybe you find a way, that you receive one, or I can help you otherwise, than let me know it via conversation.

 

[Asklipia]

In the UK recently I tried to obtain a product from Ainsworth's Chemists(Homeopathic)/London but I was told I would have to go to a Homeopathic doctor first and then presumably get a prescription from the homeopath for the medicines I required.It seems as though big Pharma/Govt has tightened up on such medicine.

@Abha,
I ordered mine from amazon.de, I used Curavendi shop and everything came no problem. If you do not understand German, it is easy to translate the pages with Google Translate.
Good luck!
I finished the second 10 days of the beginning ( Fortakehl). Fine. Then I had a couple of days with Mucokehl and Nigersan and felt good. Then this week-end back on Exmykehl and that is not very nice. Must be because it is attacking the candida. Mood is dark. Fortunately tomorrow is Monday and I go back to the mould cure.

My husband has started on his first 10 days (Exmykehl) and the effect on him is so strong he has decided to take only one a day for the moment.
Good luck to all!

 

[jepps]

@Abha,

I finished the second 10 days of the beginning ( Fortakehl). Fine. Then I had a couple of days with Mucokehl and Nigersan and felt good. Then this week-end back on Exmykehl and that is not very nice. Must be because it is attacking the candida. Mood is dark. Fortunately tomorrow is Monday and I go back to the mould cure.

My husband has started on his first 10 days (Exmykehl) and the effect on him is so strong he has decided to take only one a day for the moment.
Good luck to all!

Thank you, Asklipia, for reporting this. Sanum has not only detoxing, but strong immunomodulatory effects, it completes well with the immunomodulatory effects of RS and fibres.
Interestingly I make the same experience: Monday to Friday I realize nothing, but the weekend, when mould is in the stool, I react with inflammation, but tolerable. I believe, this is from dying mould, MO-FR it is mould stimulating time, SA-SO mould detoxing time. Mould detoxing might be harder than candida detoxing.

But my therapist put me and my husband on Sanum a few years ago: my husband took it only with good effects (his gut inflammation were healed, no side effects, he is very healthy), and I had to stop because of untolerable side effects.
Now, since taking RS+prebiotics since months, I only have slightly and temporary symptoms, and I am detoxing candida and mould and viruses, that´s amazing.

 

[South]

@jepps Do you take your resistant starch and fibers on an empty stomach, or with meals?
(and I'll repeat what someone else just said: your posts are very helpful to people with suspected candida / yeast / mold issues, thank you for your posts)

 

[ariel]

Thank you Jepps!
And Asklipia!

I think I need to more seriously look into these Sarum products. Should we start a new topic?

Jepps and Asklipia, how did you pick and choose the products to take? I did look at some of the material a couple of weeks ago, but I don't remember coming across a detailed programme. It sounds as though you are rotating between 4 products, and are aware of how long to cycle each one for.
Jepps, you are under the guidance of a homeopath, yes?
And Asklipia, you must have a good nose for figuring it out!