Histamine
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misskatniss
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Hi I do not know anything about testing in the UK, but about HIT. So, just ask. Regards, misskatniss
You do about HIT?
I'm suspecting I might have a problem with it. I have urticaria and keep getting polyps....I guess thought nasal inflammation. I'm wondering how I can do about finding out about it and what one should do if they have it?
Cheers
Simon
misskatniss
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A little prob is that I use to collect my info on German pages ;-) but I will try my best. Wait a sec....Ha! They exist also in English, great. I recommend you strongly to go through this. There are lots of infos on food, medication, the why and about of HIT and so on. http://www.histaminintoleranz.ch/en/introduction.html
For the very beginning, as a shortcut, I would in your case check if a doc can diagnose you (allergologist?). Urticaria is a strong reaction already and needs to be checked!
And besides that I would reccomend you a diet in which you leave out all the no and maybe no food (list on that site). Plus check on sopas, perfumes, washing powders etc if any of those cuases you symptoms. Avoidance is one of the most important things!! Then, there are natural antihistaminics which can help in case you can´t eliminate all histamine. Some meds too, but that´s a doc´s stuff. Ask if you have questions, if I have the power and knowledge, I´ll answer.
For the very beginning, as a shortcut, I would in your case check if a doc can diagnose you (allergologist?). Urticaria is a strong reaction already and needs to be checked!
And besides that I would reccomend you a diet in which you leave out all the no and maybe no food (list on that site). Plus check on sopas, perfumes, washing powders etc if any of those cuases you symptoms. Avoidance is one of the most important things!! Then, there are natural antihistaminics which can help in case you can´t eliminate all histamine. Some meds too, but that´s a doc´s stuff. Ask if you have questions, if I have the power and knowledge, I´ll answer.
misskatniss
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PS: Not all of the page is in English, but much. I link the food list here below:
http://www.histaminintoleranz.ch/download/SIGHI-FoodCompatibilityList_HIT(EN).pdf
Then, regarding diagnosis, your doc should exclude other possible reasons.
If HIT is very likely, see: http://www.histaminintoleranz.ch/en/therapy.html
http://www.histaminintoleranz.ch/download/SIGHI-FoodCompatibilityList_HIT(EN).pdf
Then, regarding diagnosis, your doc should exclude other possible reasons.
If HIT is very likely, see: http://www.histaminintoleranz.ch/en/therapy.html
Hey, those are some great links, thanks! I am seeing my gp this morning so I'll ask what I can get from him, test wise. I need to know HIT is my issue first (well one of them!)
Do you have HITMiss?
misskatniss
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Yes, I do, Sporty - otherwise I wouldn´t do the research on it but simply eat chocolate...
Yes, I do, Sporty - otherwise I wouldn´t do the research on it but simply eat chocolate...
Are you feeling better now though? What's your story? :0)
Simon, there is some good information on this forum about this. I started this thread with the same name a week or two ago.
Search for keywords like: DAO Enzyme, Luteolin, Rutin, Royal Jelly, Quercetin and Mangosteen. Those were a few things along with Vitamin C recommended to help someone with a Histamine problem.
Also search for Mast Cell Disorder. (Mast cell disorder forum: http://mastcelldisorders.wallack.us/yabb/YaBB.pl?num=1294200058
Also to help diagnosis I've read it's best to try antihistamines for a week and see if you are feeling much better on them. There was a post mentioning H1, H2, H3 and H4 blockers. You would want to address as many of those as you can. H1 and H2 blockers are easily found.
Cheers
Hi! Hey thanks for emailing for me.
Goodness, there are so many different opinions about this! :0/ I was just told to avoid antihistamines as they can make things worse!
What are Hi etc blockers?
Do you have histamine intolerance then?
Many thanks
misskatniss
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Hey @Sporty don´t get confused, ;-) it´s not as contradictory as it seems. It´s as follows, as far as I get it:
If you have a prob with histamine (there are different kinds: the one you eat in food or take through chemicals or stuff like that into your body, then the one your body itself releases inside (gut bacteria and so on do, that´s normal) and the histamine that is released in your body because you eat sth that doesn´t contain histamine but acts as a histamine liberator inside the body, thus causes your body to release histamine.
You can see in this distinction, that you can never completely avoid histamine. So both is true:
You should definitely avoid histamine in food and chemicals. And see if you get better. That might take a couple of weeks though. After two, I noticed the first remarkable differences (which is less belly probs and flatulence, less panicking, less restless legs, less headaches, less sinusitis)
.
But you can also, if symptoms stay bad, search for an antihistaminic susbstance (there are supplements as well as meds, I would be careful with meds, see below) which you tolerate, so you can help yourself if you feel too bad (but please continue avoiding intake of histamine via food!) and help yur body getting off that alarm situation. Also because, if you don´t eat histamine, your body still got its own inside, as I explained, and you can´t avoid that. And some people react more on histamine from outside, others more on the bodily one.
What I want to tell you about meds: I would definitely only take them if you feel very bad (and ask a doctor first). Because they only block histamine receptors, but the histamine still stays in your body. And some antihistaminics also release histamine themselves! I myslef do with supplements like turmeric, seasalt, water, VitC (the latter very effective in me). So, the clue stays: Start with lowering histamine in your body, and mostly via voiding it in foods etc.
A last info: To get rid of too much histamine you ate, you can take Histame / Daosin, an enzyme which actually helps reducing histamine. That doesn´t work in all of us, but I myself can report I probably have a shortage of DAO (the body produces that itself normally, I have too few, if you ask me), and therefore taking it before eating helps me.
I have been to the doc today and he checks my DAO and histamine in the lab. I´ll keep you posted if that helped
Hope this was understandable. I am very tired from the doctor´s appointment and thus not so clear in thought.
All the best, missk
If you have a prob with histamine (there are different kinds: the one you eat in food or take through chemicals or stuff like that into your body, then the one your body itself releases inside (gut bacteria and so on do, that´s normal) and the histamine that is released in your body because you eat sth that doesn´t contain histamine but acts as a histamine liberator inside the body, thus causes your body to release histamine.
You can see in this distinction, that you can never completely avoid histamine. So both is true:
You should definitely avoid histamine in food and chemicals. And see if you get better. That might take a couple of weeks though. After two, I noticed the first remarkable differences (which is less belly probs and flatulence, less panicking, less restless legs, less headaches, less sinusitis)
.
But you can also, if symptoms stay bad, search for an antihistaminic susbstance (there are supplements as well as meds, I would be careful with meds, see below) which you tolerate, so you can help yourself if you feel too bad (but please continue avoiding intake of histamine via food!) and help yur body getting off that alarm situation. Also because, if you don´t eat histamine, your body still got its own inside, as I explained, and you can´t avoid that. And some people react more on histamine from outside, others more on the bodily one.
What I want to tell you about meds: I would definitely only take them if you feel very bad (and ask a doctor first). Because they only block histamine receptors, but the histamine still stays in your body. And some antihistaminics also release histamine themselves! I myslef do with supplements like turmeric, seasalt, water, VitC (the latter very effective in me). So, the clue stays: Start with lowering histamine in your body, and mostly via voiding it in foods etc.
A last info: To get rid of too much histamine you ate, you can take Histame / Daosin, an enzyme which actually helps reducing histamine. That doesn´t work in all of us, but I myself can report I probably have a shortage of DAO (the body produces that itself normally, I have too few, if you ask me), and therefore taking it before eating helps me.
I have been to the doc today and he checks my DAO and histamine in the lab. I´ll keep you posted if that helped
Hope this was understandable. I am very tired from the doctor´s appointment and thus not so clear in thought.
All the best, missk
Hey @Sporty don´t get confused, ;-) it´s not as contradictory as it seems. It´s as follows, as far as I get it:
If you have a prob with histamine (there are different kinds: the one you eat in food or take through chemicals or stuff like that into your body, then the one your body itself releases inside (gut bacteria and so on do, that´s normal) and the histamine that is released in your body because you eat sth that doesn´t contain histamine but acts as a histamine liberator inside the body, thus causes your body to release histamine.
You can see in this distinction, that you can never completely avoid histamine. So both is true:
You should definitely avoid histamine in food and chemicals. And see if you get better. That might take a couple of weeks though. After two, I noticed the first remarkable differences (which is less belly probs and flatulence, less panicking, less restless legs, less headaches, less sinusitis)
.
But you can also, if symptoms stay bad, search for an antihistaminic susbstance (there are supplements as well as meds, I would be careful with meds, see below) which you tolerate, so you can help yourself if you feel too bad (but please continue avoiding intake of histamine via food!) and help yur body getting off that alarm situation. Also because, if you don´t eat histamine, your body still got its own inside, as I explained, and you can´t avoid that. And some people react more on histamine from outside, others more on the bodily one.
What I want to tell you about meds: I would definitely only take them if you feel very bad (and ask a doctor first). Because they only block histamine receptors, but the histamine still stays in your body. And some antihistaminics also release histamine themselves! I myslef do with supplements like turmeric, seasalt, water, VitC (the latter very effective in me). So, the clue stays: Start with lowering histamine in your body, and mostly via voiding it in foods etc.
A last info: To get rid of too much histamine you ate, you can take Histame / Daosin, an enzyme which actually helps reducing histamine. That doesn´t work in all of us, but I myself can report I probably have a shortage of DAO (the body produces that itself normally, I have too few, if you ask me), and therefore taking it before eating helps me.
I have been to the doc today and he checks my DAO and histamine in the lab. I´ll keep you posted if that helped
Hope this was understandable. I am very tired from the doctor´s appointment and thus not so clear in thought.
All the best, missk
No that's great Hun! Very informative for me. I much appreciate your time and effort :0)
So from what info I got.....
Don't bother with a histamine intolerance test?
Definitely give the diet two weeks and see how you feel?
Don't take antihistamines? Well, unless I'm desperate. I'm not sure what those other supplements are you mentioned. Are they natural supplements?
Many thanks
Simon x
misskatniss
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Hey @Sporty this answer comes "quick and dirty" as I am strung out from the doc´s visit with aches in all my muscles and light sensitivity. You can test for histamine in the blood and for DAO, there´s nothing wrong with that, but the most reliable test imho is your elimination diet plus elimination of other sources of hsitamine intake and how you feel after that elimination. And as long as you haven´t got an allergic reaction that requires strong antihistamines, I´d go slow with meds and rely on (yes they are natural supplements first. Best wishes, Simon. Now I gotta rest again.
natural supplements first. Best wishes, Simon. Now I gotta rest again.Hey @Sporty this answer comes "quick and dirty" as I am strung out from the doc´s visit with aches in all my muscles and light sensitivity. You can test for histamine in the blood and for DAO, there´s nothing wrong with that, but the most reliable test imho is your elimination diet plus elimination of other sources of hsitamine intake and how you feel after that elimination. And as long as you haven´t got an allergic reaction that requires strong antihistamines, I´d go slow with meds and rely on (yes they are
Ok you rest honey. Thank you for the info! I'll start with the diet. I don't react strongly to any foods really. I do to beer though.
Why do you ache? What's your diagnosis?
Cheers
Simon
@misskatniss - how did the tests go, did they show up any histamine / DAO issues?
@sregan
I recently discovered from my 23andme results that I have a double-mutation in the DAO enzyme, which suggests I may have higher histamine levels than 'normal'. Also, I see that a few articles suggest that restarting methylation can increase histamine production, and this quote in particular caught my eye:
"The point is that some nutrients actually raise histamine so these supplements should actually be avoided by a person with high histamine levels (histadelic). Naicin, in the form that causes the flush is one. That naicin flush is actually the basophil and mast cells filling up with histamine. And both folic acid and vitamin b12 raise histamine levels. Folic acid is actually something for high histamine types to avoid completely."
(from the 'orthomolecular' contributer in this post: http://latitudes.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=985)
Anyone else found any links with histamine and methylation / B12 / folic acid?
I did find when I increased my 5-MTHF from 400ug to 800ug my skin got poorer, which can be an indication of higher histamine levels (but could also be caused by other changes), hmm...
@sregan
I recently discovered from my 23andme results that I have a double-mutation in the DAO enzyme, which suggests I may have higher histamine levels than 'normal'. Also, I see that a few articles suggest that restarting methylation can increase histamine production, and this quote in particular caught my eye:
"The point is that some nutrients actually raise histamine so these supplements should actually be avoided by a person with high histamine levels (histadelic). Naicin, in the form that causes the flush is one. That naicin flush is actually the basophil and mast cells filling up with histamine. And both folic acid and vitamin b12 raise histamine levels. Folic acid is actually something for high histamine types to avoid completely."
(from the 'orthomolecular' contributer in this post: http://latitudes.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=985)
Anyone else found any links with histamine and methylation / B12 / folic acid?
I did find when I increased my 5-MTHF from 400ug to 800ug my skin got poorer, which can be an indication of higher histamine levels (but could also be caused by other changes), hmm...
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@Valentijn and @Gandalf - I think you'd spoken about HNMT gene/enzyme previously, do you know what the #rsid references are to try and help me find this info in the 23andme results? And what the 'risk' values are?
Many thanks!
Many thanks!
I noticed comments from Rich, @TheMoonIsBlue, @Sushi, @UM MAN on this in a previous thread - "Do B12 and Folate increase Histamine?" (http://forums.phoenixrising.me/index.php?threads/do-b12-and-folate-increase-histamine.10748/)
Just wondered if anyone had any successes from taking Daosin / Diasin / Histame ? (from Rich's comments it looks like they're all just different brand names of the same thing).
Just wondered if anyone had any successes from taking Daosin / Diasin / Histame ? (from Rich's comments it looks like they're all just different brand names of the same thing).
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Critterina
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Hi. I'm in the middle of a 3-day fast to try to reset my immune system from my histamine intolerances. My pulmonologist said fasting is the only thing that resets the immune system in terms of allergies and sensitivities. Has anyone tried it? He said it has to be water only. Although I am taking my prescriptions and vitamins; I hope that will be OK.
I've tried DAOsin, and didn't get as bad a reaction from the foods I ate, but still it was no cure-all. I found that digestive enzymes helped, too. So, for Christmas when I thought that there was probably some ingredient that someone forgot to tell me about, I used both and did fine.
Histame is the same as DAOsin; I don't know about the other one. I would avoid D-Hist because it has NAC in it, something that you need to avoid if you are HI.
I've tried DAOsin, and didn't get as bad a reaction from the foods I ate, but still it was no cure-all. I found that digestive enzymes helped, too. So, for Christmas when I thought that there was probably some ingredient that someone forgot to tell me about, I used both and did fine.
Histame is the same as DAOsin; I don't know about the other one. I would avoid D-Hist because it has NAC in it, something that you need to avoid if you are HI.
I haven't looked into histamine yet.
ahmo
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@Sporty I've had excellent resultes w/, as mentioned by sregan, natural anti-histamines. Rutin works almost immediately for me. Also mangosteen. Royal jelly is more related to mast cell responses, it seems, than directly to histamines.
Folate can, indeed, increase histamine levels. but I successfully raised my folate to the levels I need, w/o histamine issues. Once in awhile as I increaed the dosage I'd get an immediate histamine response, and taking a MB12 sublingual would balance it out, eliminate the symptoms.
Before I understood that I have a predisposition to histamine intolerance, pharmaceuticals would inevitably lead to urticaria within a short time. I used to get acupuncture , clearing liver, at those times. Now I use coffee enemas to clear liver.
My favorite histamine resources:
The Many Faces of Histamine Intolerance http://healthypixels.com/?p=1044
http://thelowhistaminechef.com/wondering-why-you-react-to-everything-you-eat/
Histamine food list http://forums.phoenixrising.me/index.php?attachments/allowed-restricted-foods-pdf.6408/
http://www.histaminintoleranz.ch/download/SIGHI-FoodCompatibilityList_HIT(EN).pdf
http://thelowhistaminechef.com/these-probiotic-strains-lower-histamine-rather-than-raising-it/
http://peelingbacktheonionlayers.com/could-histamine-be-sabotaging-your-digestive-health/
Video talk, incl. supps for histamine http://thelowhistaminechef.com/dr-janice-joneja-histamine-intolerance-interview-pt2/
Folate can, indeed, increase histamine levels. but I successfully raised my folate to the levels I need, w/o histamine issues. Once in awhile as I increaed the dosage I'd get an immediate histamine response, and taking a MB12 sublingual would balance it out, eliminate the symptoms.
Before I understood that I have a predisposition to histamine intolerance, pharmaceuticals would inevitably lead to urticaria within a short time. I used to get acupuncture , clearing liver, at those times. Now I use coffee enemas to clear liver.
My favorite histamine resources:
The Many Faces of Histamine Intolerance http://healthypixels.com/?p=1044
http://thelowhistaminechef.com/wondering-why-you-react-to-everything-you-eat/
Histamine food list http://forums.phoenixrising.me/index.php?attachments/allowed-restricted-foods-pdf.6408/
http://www.histaminintoleranz.ch/download/SIGHI-FoodCompatibilityList_HIT(EN).pdf
http://thelowhistaminechef.com/these-probiotic-strains-lower-histamine-rather-than-raising-it/
http://peelingbacktheonionlayers.com/could-histamine-be-sabotaging-your-digestive-health/
Video talk, incl. supps for histamine http://thelowhistaminechef.com/dr-janice-joneja-histamine-intolerance-interview-pt2/