High-Dose Selenium Significantly Improves My Fatigue and Brain Fog

[Aerowallah]

Selenium is definitely a co-factor for iodine supplementation. Why don't you take a low maintenance dose of both, say 200-250 mcg of each daily, and then give them time to balance out function while you work on other pieces of the puzzle? Sometimes, as is often said here, clearing one pathway leads you headlong into another blocked pathway, or rate-limiting factor. What you initially took may be on the right track and a supportive dose for now...

 

[sometexan84]

400mcg is too high. I take 200 daily

 

[sapie]

I took Se 300mcg last night and feel less fatigued today. I haven't taken the supplement in few months now. So it seems I could cycle it on and off every month. But, I read articles that say high Se levels correlate with high fasting blood glucose. My fasting blood sugar which was 85 before supplementing Se raised to 95 (tested thrice so far in a span of 4 months) in the last 6 months. I am afraid if I keep supplementing Se, I would develop diabetes or develop toxicity.

Has anyone who has been taking it for a few years got tested for Se as well glucose, especially HIP who I see have been on Se for a few years now.

 

[sapie]

Selenium is definitely a co-factor for iodine supplementation. Why don't you take a low maintenance dose of both, say 200-250 mcg of each daily, and then give them time to balance out function while you work on other pieces of the puzzle? Sometimes, as is often said here, clearing one pathway leads you headlong into another blocked pathway, or rate-limiting factor. What you initially took may be on the right track and a supportive dose for now...

I would definitely like to supplement a maintenance dose daily, but I am just worried about developing toxicity or diabetes in the long run.

 

[Hip]

400mcg is too high. I take 200 daily

I found that I only started to get really substantial improvements in my ME/CFS fatigue and brain fog once I pushed the dose up to 400 mcg daily (must be on an empty stomach for best absorption).

Lower doses like 100 mcg daily did not do much.

I don't think this about selenium deficiency, because daily selenium requirements are about 50 mcg. So 100 mcg of highly bioavailable selenomethionine would easily cover that.

Rather, I think that high-dose selenium does something over and above what fulfilling daily requirements achieves.

 

[sapie]

I found that I only started to get really substantial improvements in my ME/CFS fatigue and brain fog once I pushed the dose up to 400 mcg daily (must be on an empty stomach for best absorption).

Lower doses like 100 mcg daily did not do much.

I don't think this about selenium deficiency, because daily selenium requirements are about 50 mcg. So 100 mcg of highly bioavailable selenomethionine would easily cover that.

Rather, I think that high-dose selenium does something over and above what fulfilling daily requirements achieves.

Hip, Did your ever get your Se levels tested? Was there a change in the fasting glucose levels since you started Se? I would like to take the 300mcg dose on a daily basis if possible but worried about toxicity.

 

[Hip]

Hip, Did your ever get your Se levels tested? Was there a change in the fasting glucose levels since you started Se? I would like to take the 300mcg dose on a daily basis if possible but worried about toxicity.

The maximum recommended daily dose of selenium is 600 mcg (ref: here), so I don't think doses up to that level should be a concern.

I have never been tested for selenium levels. Interestingly, I actually know someone who takes a super-massive 5,000 mcg of selenium daily for anti-cancer purposes (it saved his life after being diagnosed with an incurable cancer); after 2 years taking this incredibly high dose, when he measured his blood selenium levels, they were justly slightly above the normal maximum range.

 

[pamojja]

After taking in average 300 mcg per day of different forms of selenium for 12 years, in the meantime monitoring it somehow with cheaper selenium-dependent Glutathion-peroxidase tests (thereby seeing it recently comming up to optimal levels), finally I did test selenium in serum too. Came back at 121 ug/l, 60-140 normal range. All that on selenium-depleted soils in Central Europe.

I'm however prediabetic, somehow controled with diet. Though worsening a bit last 2 years again. On the other hand experienced remission of a walking-disabilty from PAD, COPD1 and remaining ME/CFS symptoms (PEMs).

after 2 years taking this incredibly high dose, when he measured his blood selenium levels, they were justly slightly above the normal maximum range.

Against cancer in such high doses as far as I know usually only sodium-selenite is taken, which alledgedly doesn't raise serum levels much.

 

[sometexan84]

The maximum recommended daily dose of selenium is 600 mcg (ref: here), so I don't think doses up to that level should be a concern.

But that is from 1994.

I think right now, the documented "safe upper limit" is 400mcg. In addition, I've seen multiple physician websites recommending Selenium supp at 200mcg daily and "not to exceed".

I'd definitely suggest double and triple checking recommended safe dosage, especially in regards to what you're using it for (e.g. cancer, deficiency, thyroid, general supp, etc)

 

[Hip]

I think right now, the documented "safe upper limit" is 400mcg. In addition, I've seen multiple physician websites recommending Selenium supp at 200mcg daily and "not to exceed".

It depends where you look. The NIH for example say 400 mcg is the daily upper limit.

Safe dose level is an academic discussion, however, unless high-dose selenium actually improves your ME/CFS. Not many ME/CFS patients benefited from this high-dose protocol unfortunately, and if you don't benefit, the max safe dose is not something you have to concern yourself with.

In my case, 400 mcg of selenium daily brought me from moderate to severe ME/CFS, to moderate to mild. So I would rate that as a ½-level improvement on the ME/CFS scale of mild, moderate, severe.

I do not want to go back to bordering on severe ME/CFS. As soon as I stop selenium, I start getting worse again with 5 days. I have tried stopping several times, and getting worse is always the result.

So whatever the risks of high dose selenium (and I don't think there are any), those have to be balanced against the substantial improvement I have made.

 

[jstefl]

I am very late to the party, I just recently found this thread and started on 200 micrograms a week ago. I checked the first box of your survey, I have been tested by ARUP and noticed an immediate improvement in my brain.

I took the first dose at night and felt an immediate reduction in my headache, but had difficulty sleeping, even though I felt very calm. I have not felt wired at all. After switching to morning dosing, I have slept very well. Since I have had trouble with many supplements, I started with a single capsule per day. I will soon switch to a 400 dose, not sure if I will take that all at once or split it between morning and evening.

I feel slightly less tired and am hoping that a higher dose will help with that. I have purchased several versions of the selenium to try in the interest of finding what works best for me.

I am very thankful to have discovered this thread.

 

[Studi]

Hei guys

I now take 400mcg of Se-Methyl-L-Selenocystein for three days.

My lympf nodes are now extremely swolen and painfull. And I have strong flu like symptoms.

Dos anybody else expirienced something similar?

Bye

 

[Hip]

I now take 400mcg of Se-Methyl-L-Selenocystein for three days.

My lympf nodes are now extremely swolen and painfull. And I have strong flu like symptoms.

I have not seen that response reported from anyone who took selenium on this thread.

Hard to know what's happening, but it could be your immune system fighting the virus.

You can consider lowing the dose of selenium, or stopping altogether and then restarting with a lower dose.

 

[jstefl]

After an initial improvement on selenium I am very disappointed to report that it has stopped helping and is possibly making things worse.

I started with a 200 mcg dose and noticed immediately that the wired but tired feelings had changed to not as wired, but possibly more tired, or at least a more peaceful feeling. I noticed a big reduction in my headache and was able to reduce my daily Tylenol intake.

I tried upping the dose to 400 mcg, and that didn't go well, so I went back to 200.

The improvements lasted a few weeks for which I was very thankful. Unfortunately as time went by the improvements disappeared and then taking the selenium led to a worsening of the symptoms. At this point I have given up taking it. I find it really strange that after feeling so much better at first this now makes me feel worse. I guess it was worth a try.

 

[Hip]

Unfortunately as time went by the improvements disappeared and then taking the selenium led to a worsening of the symptoms.

Since you found selenium helped initially, you might consider at some point trying it again, but at a lower dose, like say 50 mcg daily.

 

[seamyb]

Since you found selenium helped initially, you might consider at some point trying it again, but at a lower dose, like say 50 mcg daily.

@Hip I saw that you're a skeptic of the whole methylation approach, but the guy who does the oils, Greg, has selenium as a vital component of his methylation/B12 protocol. It activates B2, which acts as the cofactor for the B12 and folate enzymes. He seems to think inactivation of B2 is the problem in some PWME.

 

[Hip]

@Hip I saw that you're a skeptic of the whole methylation approach, but the guy who does the oils, Greg, has selenium as a vital component of his methylation/B12 protocol. It activates B2, which acts as the cofactor for the B12 and folate enzymes. He seems to think inactivation of B2 is the problem in some PWME.

A PR poll suggested that the methylation protocol was not doing a great deal for ME/CFS patients.

I had some email exchanges with Greg (which I summarized in this post), and he did not focus on methylation at all, but offered his personal theory that people do not recover from ME/CFS because of a lack of B12 and a functional B2 deficiency.

 

[seamyb]

A PR poll suggested that the methylation protocol was not doing a great deal for ME/CFS patients.

I had some email exchanges with Greg (which I summarized in this post), and he did not focus on methylation at all, but offered his personal theory that people do not recover from ME/CFS because of a lack of B12 and a functional B2 deficiency.

Indeed, it is a change of emphasis, but I still believe it's heavily involved with methylation. The functional B2 deficiency is related to its role as a coenzyme in MTHFR and MTRR, both of which are methylation enzymes.

I think Rich gave a good account of the downstream effects of this, but not a great deal on why the supplementation protocol would work. I think Greg's account of his protocol does the latter better. Freddd's is pretty out there and highly tailored to his own unique needs.

So far, and it's early, I've seen anecdotal evidence in myself that they are really onto something. Haven't done it quite right yet, but B12 on its own did wonders for fatigue while causing air hunger and pain. mFolate seems to be taking the air hunger and pain away. I'm only at very small doses of the latter.

 

[seamyb]

From Greg:

https://b12oils.com/paradoxical.htm

 

[Hip]

I still believe it's heavily involved with methylation.

It could relate to methylation, but high-dose methylcobalamin is shown to promote nerve regeneration, shown to protect against glutamate-induced neurotoxicity, and is known to boost natural killer cell and CD8 cell immunity (which would help fight viral infections). So there are other possible explanations for its mild benefits in ME/CFS.