Clonazepam (Klonopin) stops my symptoms almost completely

YippeeKi YOW !!

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Studies have shown Clonzepam has a long half life anywhere from 20-40 hours depending on source. That’s just what a quick Google search says.
That's so blatantly inaccurate that it should be pulled from searches.

Even Roche, who developed it, recommended 2 to 3 times a day dosing BECAUSE of its short action. It's metabolic half life is indeed very long, as is that of all benzos (Valium's is over 200 hours), but the metabolite half-life has nothing to do with its effectiveness, which is pretty much moot after at most 9 to 10 hours. And that's AT MOST.....


If you have studies that state otherwise, I'd sincerely love to see them .....
 

frozenborderline

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Genuinely debating if a very low dose of Clonazepam every other day or so might be the lesser of two evils given it helps reduce my symptoms massively and it's the only thing that seems to stop me feeling like utter crap every day.
Trying benzos can be good bc you can get a sense sense what it is like to turn off some of the glutamate excitotoxicity that contributes contributes ME/CFS.

But that's only worth it at trying it once in awhile, in fact doing bigger doses once a month or something is better than doing smaller doses regularly. Regular usage even at every other day will eventually put you in a bad situation.

Even though I don't agree with everything Yipeeki YOW says on benzos, like we disagree with many of the details, I do agree that regular usage at that level is bad.

Opioids would genuinely be far less harmful, not that they would be harmless.

Daily ketamine usage, which can be prescribed and usedsafely, would be FAR less harmful. Doesn't almost ever cause physical dependence. Has similar pharmacological targets.

J wanted to respond to this earlier but just woke up and there's already so many comments you probably got your answer

There are other gabaergics or drugs targeting gaba and glutamate somehow you can try. I listed some of them in a previous post. Everything from memanrine and ketamine to imidazenil to progesterone. Do u have the saved post of me listing all those drugs?

Occasional use (not regular) of phenibut cause less cognitive issues and better effects than benzos anyway
 

frozenborderline

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It's strange because as you say, Clonazepam is short acting, but for me it's effects can seem to last up to 48 hours. Even if I am not feeling the obvious benzo type reduction in stress/anxiety which is obvious and prominent for the 4 or 5 hours after dosing, I still seem to generally feel calmer, and have less severe M.E. type symptoms for a day or two and that can just be form one 0.5mg Clonazepam tablet.
Is clonazepam short lasting ? It's the second longest lasting benzo to diazepam I believe. It's longer lasting than Xanax for sure and pretty sure it's longer lasting than Ativan/lorazepam. Those are all of the common ones, although of course there's been other benzos manufactured like phenazepam but those aren't used medically usually. Phenazepam can last for weeks or something crazy
 

YippeeKi YOW !!

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There are other sources saying 20-80 hours on pubmed.
They're referring, as I stated above to the METABOLIC HALF LIFE, i.e., the length of time it takes for all traces of the drug to leave your system, the point at which you could, say, pass a drug test.

The active half life of clonazepam, that period during which it has and actual, active, effect on your brain and CNS, is as I stated, approximately6 to 9 hours max.
 

SlamDancin

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They're referring, as I stated above to the METABOLIC HALF LIFE, i.e., the length of time it takes for all traces of the drug to leave your system, the point at which you could, say, pass a drug test.

The active half life of clonazepam, that period during which it has and actual, active, effect on your brain and CNS, is as I stated, approximately6 to 9 hours max.
Can I have a source on that? I’m genuinely curious
 

YippeeKi YOW !!

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Is clonazepam short lasting
Yes. It's one of the three short acting benzos, and you've stated the other two in your post.
It's the second longest lasting benzo to diazepam I believe.
That's not saying a lot. Valium has a half life about 5 times longer than clonazepam, probably more. That's why it's used so extensively in tapering patients off the short-acting benzos, like clonazepam, and of course, Ativan and Xanax, among others ....
It's longer lasting than Xanax for sure and pretty sure it's longer lasting than Ativan/lorazepam.
Anything is longer lasting that either Xanax or Ativan, probably the two most dangerous benzos known to man.

But clonazepam/Klonopin deserves a place on that list, too, partly because of its innate destructiveness, and partly because it's so vastly underestimated and over-prescribed, and there's SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO much disinformation about it on Google. I just did a quick search, and I swear, my hair is on fire. If you look closely, you'll see that some of that incredibly wrong info is posted by detox/rehab centers, places like Harmony House, who make quite a nice living detoxing the drug-dependent , and many of the others are hard-core Pharma backers, and largely financially supported by Pharma, bought and paid for.

Some days the world disgusts me so much that Earth spinning off its axis ad out into the furthest reaches of space starts sounding like a good idea, swear to God ....:hug::hug:
Yeah, as wretchedly bad as opioids are, given my druthers, I think I'd go for an opioid problem. If I really had to make a choice. With a gun to my head. And a biiiiiig bag of cash in the hand that wasnt holding the gun.
 

frozenborderline

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Clonazepam is a long lasting benzo as far as i can tell
https://www.arkbh.com/benzodiazepines/long-acting/
This link puts it third after librium and diazepam, says half life is about 20-50 hours
This link https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/1687613/
Says 20-80 hours

I've found plenty of other sources saying clonazepam has a half life in that ball park. None that day it's shorter than 20 hours. And these things always vary so I think the average is what's important. I believe the fda had it at about 40 hours , but it varies

I had always heard it considered the second longest acting benzo after diazepam in common use, which makes sense bc i haven't heard of librium being used commonly.

So yeah, klonopin has a fairly long half life and also from personal experience, long acting subjective effects
 

frozenborderline

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From the FDA: "The elimination half-life of clonazepam is typically 30 to 40 hours. Clonazepam pharmacokinetics are dose-independent throughout the dosing range. There is no evidence that clonazepam induces its own metabolism or that of other drugs in humans."
 

YippeeKi YOW !!

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Can I have a source on that? I’m genuinely curious
Then do a quick google. I've pretty much exhausted my febrile mental and physical energy and focus in this Quixotic battle.


If you're genuinely curious, start by learning the diff between the active, 'therapeutic' half life of a drug and the METABOLIC half life, which I pretty much described above. It shouldn't be too hard to find a source for that on Google.

I'm not being an asshole, I'm just exhausted and depressed, and sooooooooooooo flucking tired of fighting this battle.

So the bottom line is, everyone's going to do, believe, and act based on what they want at that moment, or what they need to defend. Its human nature, and more power to it ....
 

YippeeKi YOW !!

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says half life is about 20-50 hours
GOD, HOW OFTEN DO I HAVE TO SAY THIS .... they're quoting the metabolic half life, which is based on the length of time it takes for the drug to clear your system entirely.

The length of time that it's active in your system is a whole different thing.

"The elimination half-life of clonazepam is typically 30 to 40 hours."
https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/drugsatfda_docs/label/2013/017533s053,020813s009lbl.pdf

The peak effects of clonazepam are reached in 1-4 hours, which means it's all downhill from there. Do the math. Or not. Whatever ....:pem::pem::pem: :sleep:
 

YippeeKi YOW !!

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I believe the fda had it at about 40 hours , but it varies
Not by that much. See my post above. See all my posts for a really clear picture, and a short lesson in diff between active, peak half life, and METABOLIC half life ....

If the FDA had it 40 hours, they were talking about the metabolic half life. The only benzo that has that kind of active longevity is Valium ....
 

frozenborderline

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Can I have a source on that? I’m genuinely curious
Just so you know , I researched this and also from what I've heard from doctors. I don't think there is a source on that. Clonazepam is fairly long lasting. I believe the half-life of lorazepam (ativan), for comparison, is 12 hours, meaning that it decreases in concentration in the body by half every 12 hours., which makes it less long lasting than clonazepam, which Is the second least long acting benzo to diazepam, apart from very uncommonly prescribed ones like librium or the weird never prescribed ones like phenazepam, puts it up there as the second longest acting benzo. Certainly can't find any source saying it's half life is only 9 hours , every source I can find says it's at least 20 hours, but some estimate it up to 60 , 20 is the low end , not the mean! There's a range. From the fda it seems like the mean for clonazepam may be 40 hours . Less thsn diazepam but pretty long.
 

YippeeKi YOW !!

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From the FDA: "The elimination half-life of clonazepam is typically 30 to 40 hours. Clonazepam pharmacokinetics are dose-independent throughout the dosing range. There is no evidence that clonazepam induces its own metabolism or that of other drugs in humans."
Do you know what any of that means? Cause I do. And it's not what you think.

I'm really done here, just too wring out to keep this up. I know from experience that you'll keep fighting your corner long after it's been rolled up and carted away.

Actually, it's one of the various things that I like about you ..... but you'll have to keep fighting this one out with someone else, cause I'm running on fumes and a 32 hr day with no sleep so far .... :hug::hug:
 
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