A report about anti-glycation supps Carnosine Beta-Alanine (=methylation?)

[Gondwanaland]

If we are getting increased sulfation by carcinine, then this could be leading to lower T3 levels and increased TSH

http://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/neuroscience/glucuronidation
The transfer of a sulfonate group from the donor compound 3′-phosphoadenosine 5′-phosphosulfate (PAPS) to an acceptor compound (such as TH, steroids, … but also xenobiotics) is catalyzed by a large family of enzymes called sulfotransferases, located in the cytoplasmic fraction of, e.g., liver cells. Unlike glucuronidation, sulfation does not facilitate the excretion of TH, but interferes with the deiodination process. Sulfated THs strongly facilitate the IRD activity of D1 while they inhibit the D2, D3 activity, and the ORD of D1 (Moreno et al., 1994; Visser T. J., 1990).

 

[Isaiah 58:11]

www.supersmart.eu is where u can find carcinine..

Has anyone here tried this particular product? It contains fillers, etc. and I have no idea if I would be buying the real thing.

@Gondwanaland, if you are ok with it, would you PM me with the pharmacy you used and price? Did it need an actual prescription? If so, I may just have my doctor call it in for me.

 

[Gondwanaland]

if you are ok with it, would you PM me with the pharmacy you used and price? Did it need an actual prescription? If so, I may just have my doctor call it in for me.

I am ok with it, but I am in South America and bought it locally under dr's prescription

 

[Gondwanaland]

From the book Carnosine and Oxidative Stress in Cells and Tissues

Biochem Mol Biol Int. 1997 Sep;43(1):99-106.
Evidence for a direct interaction of superoxide anion radical with carnosine.

Abstract
Using photochemiluminescence, the interaction between carnosine and superoxide anion was measured directly. Carnosine at physiological concentrations decreased the amplitude of luminol chemiluminescence like superoxide dismutase (SOD) did, and prolonged the lag-period of the chemiluminescence similar to the effect of ascorbic acid. From the interaction of nitro blue tetrazolium with superoxide anion generated by the xanthine oxidase system, the constant for interaction of carnosine with 02-. was calculated to be 10(5) M-1.sec-1. The possible biological significance of the quenching of superoxide anion by carnosine is discussed.

Membr Cell Biol. 1998;12(1):89-99.
Effect of carnosine and its components on free-radical reactions.

Abstract
The antioxidant properties of carnosine and its components histidine and beta-alanine were compared using several model systems: glutathione-horseradish peroxidase-luminol (GSH-HRP-luminol), xanthine-xanthine oxidase (X-XO), stimulated human blood polymorphonuclear leukocytes (PML), and egg yolk phospholipid liposomes in the presence of Fe2+ ions. Carnosine and histidine (30-40 mM) were shown to cause 50% suppression of free radical reactions in the GSH-HRP-luminol system, whereas beta-alanine displayed no activity. The O(2-)-scavenging activity of carnosine in the X-XO system was demonstrated; 50% inhibition was achieved at 7.1 x 10(-5) M. Suppression of the luminol-dependent PML chemiluminescence by carnosine and reduction of the latent period of the Fe(2+)-induced chemiluminescence of the liposome suspension was suggested to demonstrate its ability to interact with Ca2+ and Fe2+ ions. This was confirmed by the o-phenanthroline test. The results obtained demonstrate that carnosine is capable of scavenging different radicals and binding divalent metal ions. The antioxidant activity of carnosine was observed in all the systems studied, and carnosine effective concentrations corresponded to those found in the brain and muscles. The universal effects of carnosine and its high concentration in excitable tissues suggest this dipeptide to be an inhibitor of free radical reactions in vivo.

 

[Gondwanaland]

My friend has some blood work done and TSH is very high.

Another reason for TSH to be high is blockage of xanthine oxidase. Elevated TSH is a known side effect of Allopurinol for instance.

 

[NotThisGuy]

Another reason for TSH to be high is blockage of xanthine oxidase. Elevated TSH is a known side effect of Allopurinol for instance.

his uric acid is fine.
I guess it's because all of the carnitine he takes and he might have been hypo before carcinine. But carcinine did it worse I guess.

 

[Gondwanaland]

his uric acid is fine.

Even if his UA is fine, if blocking xanthine oxidase is one of the supplement's properties it will happen anyway and have the consequences.

he might have been hypo before carcinine

Also a possibility

 

[Gondwanaland]

On page 15 of the same book linked above

 

[Gondwanaland]

I was thinking, mTOR inhibitors shouldn't be taken when doing exercise, right? Exercise activates mTOR and GH so it is best paired with BCAAs / Whey protein powder...

 

[Gondwanaland]

My experience with carcinine pointed me more precisely to how I should direction my research energy to find my core issues and how to address them.

My blood results and bad and good reactions to foods and supplements can be mainly explained by the need to

• Block 5α-reductase to reduce DHT
• Unblock aromatase to increase estrogen
• Block xanthine oxidase to reduce uric acid
• Block Beta-glucuronidase to increase glucuronidation

The above imply dietary changes and addition of pivotal supplements which I am currently testing. Unfortunately I can't currently cope with carcinine side effects (see opening post).

Additionally I identifyied the need to take small amounts of biotin (warning: Biotin Supplementation Modifies Hepatic Morphology) to overcome inefficient biotinidase enzyme.

I also need vit D but haven't found out how to clear VDRs from pathogens (I am under the impression that a potent antiox like carcinine did something there because for the 1st time since 2013 I saw my vit D 25-OH levels budge significantly).

Pathogens That Inhibit The Vitamin D Receptor

Many pathogens inhibit some aspect of the vitamin D system – either the VDR, the ability of molecules to bind to it or the ability of VDR to cause gene expression.
....

But I think and hope that an improvement in vit D status will naturally follow from addressing my 4 core issues.

 

[Gondwanaland]

Hair becomes curly and unmanageable

I am getting this same effect from taking MSM. Also hair and nails are growing faster and feel thicker. Sulfur metabolism.

 

[NotThisGuy]

Interestingly Carcinine makes my thinning inguinal ligaments worse (just like omega3 caps do). However the supplement for joints I am taking now seems to be really effective.

what supplement for joints are you taking?

 

[NotThisGuy]

another update:
friend who tried and failed carcinine started with carnosine:
while carcinine made him "normal" carnosine made him shizophrenic and manic.
It also boosted dopamine and he became a little paranoid, but not as bad as with manganese.

also his drinking volume went down (which is too high, so a good thing)
I think this is due copper utilization @Thewonders92 talked in his thread about.
At least I experienced the same effects with copper like my friend did with carnosine in regard to drinking volume.

 

[Gondwanaland]

what supplement for joints are you taking?

I took Glucosamine Hyaluronic Acid Chondroitin MSM for a while with good results, but then had problems. Now I am on MSM only and loving it.

 

[Gondwanaland]

Interesting research matching my experience

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27777064
Peptides. 2016 Dec;86:102-111. doi: 10.1016/j.peptides.2016.10.008. Epub 2016 Oct 21.
Carnosine ameliorates cognitive deficits in streptozotocin-induced diabetic rats: Possible involved mechanisms.

Abstract
Diabetic patients are at increased risk to develop cognitive deficit and senile dementia. This study was planned to assess the benefits of chronic carnosine administration on prevention of learning and memory deterioration in streptozotocin (STZ)-diabetic rats and to explore some of the involved mechanisms. Rats were divided into 5 groups: i.e., control, carnosine100-treated control, diabetic, and carnosine-treated diabetics (50 and 100mg/kg). Carnosine was injected i.p. at doses of 50 or 100mg/kg for 7 weeks, started 1 week after induction of diabetes using streptozotocin. Treatment of diabetic rats with carnosine at a dose of 100mg/kg at the end of the study lowered serum glucose, improved spatial recognition memory in Y maze, improved retention and recall in elevated plus maze, and prevented reduction of step-through latency in passive avoidance task. Furthermore, carnosine at a dose of 100mg/kg reduced hippocampal acetylcholinesterase (AChE) activity, lowered lipid peroxidation, and improved superoxide dismutase (SOD) activity and non-enzymatic antioxidant defense element glutathione (GSH), but not activity of catalase. Meanwhile, hippocampal level of nuclear factor-kappaB (NF-κB), tumor necrosis factor α (TNF-α), and glial fibrillary acidic protein (GFAP) decreased and level of nuclear factor (erythroid-derived 2)-like 2 (Nrf2) and heme oxygenase 1 (HO-1) increased upon treatment of diabetic group with carnosine at a dose of 100mg/kg. Taken together, chronic carnosine treatment could ameliorate learning and memory disturbances in STZ-diabetic rats through intonation of NF-κB/Nrf2/HO-1 signaling cascade, attenuation of astrogliosis, possible improvement of cholinergic function, and amelioration of oxidative stress and neuroinflammation.

 

[JasonUT]

I am trying to navigate this thread and am currently on page 4, but wanted to add a nugget as I continue to read. It's extremely likely I am repeating info.

1. Carnosine (beta-alanyl-L-histidine), featuring the characteristic Imidazole-ring, is a dipeptide molecule, made up of the amino acids beta-alanine and histidine. It is highly concentrated in muscle and brain tissues [Source].
2. Upon digestion, carnosine is broken down in the gastrointestinal tract into its constituents.... In other words, after consuming meat, all of the carnosine that was ingested is converted to beta-alanine and histidine. Then, oddly enough, the amino acids are converted back to carnosine in the muscles and used or transported where needed... [Source].
3. This sounds very similar to the debate on oral glutathione supplementation.
4. Collagen protein powder contains both alanine 1.2g and histidine 110 mg in 12 grams of collagen powder [Source].

My body seems to crave Collagen powder. Strange coincidence?
So what is the difference in Carnosine and Carcinine?

 

[Gondwanaland]

1. Collagen protein powder contains both alanine 1.2g and histidine 110 mg in 12 grams of collagen powder [Source].

My body seems to crave Collagen powder. Strange coincidence?

I can't tolerate collagen, but need it badly.

So what is the difference in Carnosine and Carcinine?

Carcinine escapes carnosinase enzyme. It feels like it cleanses receptors while in circulation. I never tried carnosine, but I have read that it has to be taken in very high doses to inhibit carnosinase.

 

[Gondwanaland]

I think some of my unwanted side effects from carcinine are due to vit A depletion (eye pain, weak enamel).

 

[Asklipia]

Our only unwanted side effect for the moment : nails get soft at the tip, which leads to tearing. This is definitely from carcinine, But if we take just a little glycine in the form of marine collagen, and a little biotin, it stops for about five days.

A nice effect is that it seems to increase alpha MSH. We both are starting to have a subtle tan, just as when we used to take cold baths!!! And it has been raining cats and dogs for ages, so nothing to do with outside exposure.
As a result we look younger, none of that sad pallor of older people.

 

[Gondwanaland]

Carnosine May Mimic Rapamycin
… and provide some of the same benefits of the mTOR inhibitor

Rapamycin increases the risk for diabetes and it is recommended to take metformin with it.

I wonder if this applies to all mTOR inhibitors. If it does, then Thiamine is indeed the best companion nutrient to take with carnosine/carcinine.

From my personal experience carcinine indeed accelerates the breakdown of sulfury substances, so both Thiamine and Biotin would be recommended, plus B6 which is the tool used in sulfur metabolism (+molybdenum?).