Vaccine-triggered CFS linked to nasopharynx inflammation, and 81% cured or improved by treating this nasopharyngitis


Senior Member
SUMMARY: Patients with an ME/CFS-like illness appearing after HPV vaccination were found in a Japanese study to have chronic inflammation in their nasopharynx (nasopharyngitis), an area just above the back of the throat, which is not normally visible.

You may not know if you have nasopharyngitis, because it's painless and has almost no noticeable local symptoms. However, you can easily test for chronic nasopharyngitis at home using a technique that involves a cotton swab (Q-Tip) — see this post below.

For ME/CFS patients with nasopharyngitis, the study found when this is treated topically, simply by dabbing on an zinc chloride solution, the ME/CFS clears up in 6 weeks in 25% of cases, and significantly improves in another 56% of cases.

This zinc chloride treatment seems to work not only for HPV-triggered CFS, but for CFS triggered by other vaccines too: Dr Hotta told me he has treated one patient whose CFS was triggered by hepatitis B vaccination, and another whose trigger was pneumococcal vaccination.

In the 2016 Japanese study (full paper here), Dr Osamu Hotta et al looked at 41 patients who developed a chronic fatigue syndrome-like condition after receiving the human papillomavirus (HPV) vaccine (Gardasil or Cervarix).

All 41 patients were found to have severe chronic nasopharyngitis (also called epipharyngitis), which is an inflammation in the nasopharynx (also called the epipharynx), the area just above the pharynx.

The Nasopharynx

When the chronic inflammation in the nasopharynx area of 16 of these CFS patients was treated with 0.5% zinc chloride solution (ZnCI2) topically applied with cotton swabs, 25% of the 16 patients were completely cured of their CFS-like illness, and another 56% of the 16 patients significantly improved as a result of the treatment (they only treated 16 out of the 41 patients, because only these 16 were willing to regularly attend hospital for the zinc chloride treatment).

In the 19% of the 16 patients who did not respond to treatment, the study authors observed that the zinc chloride unfortunately did not reduce their nasopharygeal inflammation; whereas in the responders, they observed that the application of zinc chloride helped resolve the nasopharyngitis. So this is more evidence that the nasopharygeal inflammation is actually playing a causal role in these cases of CFS.

This study is very interesting, as it perhaps reignites the old idea of a chronic focal infection playing a role in ME/CFS (a focal infection is one that is localized to a specific site in the body). Several people on this forum had ME/CFS symptoms as a result of a chronic focal infection within the jaw bone (osteomyelitis). location

The Hotta 2016 study authors propose that the cures and symptomatic improvements in the CFS patients treated with zinc chloride could be related to hypothalamic pituitary adrenal (HPA) axis normalization, and propose that these improvement may arise from restoration of the immune neuroendocrine system.

The authors think that this nasopharyngitis treatment may also be effective for various other types of functional somatic syndrome, regardless of the initial cause, as well as for some autoimmune diseases. Functional somatic syndromes include: chronic fatigue syndrome, fibromyalgia, multiple chemical sensitivity, the Gulf War syndrome and irritable bowel syndrome.

This video shows the red appearance of a severely inflamed nasopharynx: an endoscope camera is passed through nose to reach the nasopharynx located just beyond the end of the nasal cavity:

Zinc Chloride Solution Treatment Applied to the Nasopharynx

The image below shows how the 0.5% zinc chloride solution is applied to the entire nasopharynx surface, by inserting a cotton swab through the nasal cavity, and by inserting a cotton swab via the back of the throat. The treatment procedure is shown at timecode 6:46 in this video.

Applying 0.5% Zinc Chloride Solution to the Inflamed Nasopharynx Using Swabs

This treatment is named epipharyngeal abrasive therapy (EAT). In one paper, Dr Hotta suggests the mechanism of action of EAT may involve a combination of the anti-inflammatory effects of zinc chloride solution, plus a mechanical abrasion from prodding the cotton swab into the nasopharynx, which promotes blood flow and local bleeding to clean out the nasopharynx.

You can buy the extra long cotton swabs required for this test online, see here.

Testing for Nasopharynx Inflammation

Chronic nasopharynx inflammation is diagnosed by observing the amount of blood collected on the cotton swab, and by observing if there is any pain while rubbing the cotton swabs on the nasopharynx area.

The authors used the amount of blood found on the cotton swab as a rough gauge of the degree of nasopharyngeal inflammation (the more blood, the worse the inflammation).

Blood on the Cotton Swabs Used to Apply Zinc Chloride Solution to the Inflamed Nasopharynx
Cotton Swabs.png

In the Hotta 2016 study, they found that all 41 patients with HPV vaccine-induced CFS had the 2+ severe level of bleeding on the cotton swab applicator, as shown at the far left of the above image. This indicates they have severe chronic nasopharyngitis.

By contrast, in 39 female healthy controls, 39% had no bleeding, 56% had 1+ moderate to mild level bleeding, and 5% had the 2+ severe level bleeding, as determined by the amount of blood on the cotton swab. Ref: 1

As treatment continues over the weeks, the severity of the pain and the amount of blood on the swab is found to gradually reduce in response to treatment with zinc chloride.

More details about how to test for chronic nasopharyngitis given in this post below.

Chronic Nasopharyngitis May Be Linked to Autoimmunity, HPA-Axis Dysfunction, Autonomic Nervous System Dysfunction, and Various Diseases

The authors think chronic nasopharyngitis (epipharyngitis) may play an important role in the development of autoimmune diseases. They say that because of its anatomical location, chronic inflammation in the nasopharynx could have systemic effects through autoimmunity, and also via the autonomic nervous system. More info can be found at timecode 13:27 of this video.

The Hotta 2016 study authors point out that:
  • Chronic nasopharyngitis is present in a significant proportion of the population.
  • Although it may cause significant symptoms, nasopharyngitis is rarely observed on routine otolaryngologic observation by ENT specialists.
  • Diagnosis of nasopharyngeal inflammation can only be made by direct surface abrasion of the nasopharyngeal mucous membrane (with a swab); pain during and after the abrasion of the nasopharyngeal mucosa with local hemorrhage confirms the presence of nasopharyngitis. In other words, if it hurts and it bleeds when a cotton swab is rubbed on your nasopharyngeal mucous membranes, then that indicates nasopharyngitis.
  • In the nasopharynx, there is an abundance of lymphocytes in the submucosal area, with a large number of lymphocytes colocating with the nasopharyngeal epithelial cells; there are more B-lymphocytes (B-cells) than T-lymphocytes (T-cells).
  • In the nasopharynx, both the T-lymphocytes and B-lymphocytes are highly activated, even in normal healthy individuals. So the nasopharynx site seems to be of immunological significance.
  • It is conceivable that latent, pre-existing inflammation of the nasopharynx may be prone to exacerbation by the immune stimulating effects of the adjuvants found in most vaccinations.
The Hotta 2016 study authors say that the various symptoms related to chronic nasopharyngitis can be divided into three categories:

(1) Direct or radiated symptoms caused by nasopharyngitis, including: headache, shoulder stiffness, neck stiffness, sore throat, throat discomfort including globus sensation (feeling of a lump in the throat that is not actually there), tinnitus, post-nasal drip, persistent cough, and low-grade fever are included in this category.

(2) The second category is symptoms that arise because of dysfunction of the hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis (HPA axis) and alterations in the limbic system. Symptoms associated with dysfunction of the autonomic nervous system include: orthostatic dysregulation, dizziness, gastrointestinal symptoms, general fatigue, and generalized pain.

(3) The third category is an associated immune-mediated mechanism caused by focal inflammation of the nasopharynx, and symptoms or conditions associated with this include: glomerulonephritis / inflammation of the kidneys (such as immunoglobulin A nephropathy), dermatitis (such as chronic urticaria and pustulosis palmoplantaris), arthritis (such as reactive arthritis and sternocostoclavicular hyperostosis), and some other autoimmune diseases.

In Japan, the discovery of chronic nasopharyngitis, and the proposal that chronic nasopharyngitis could be linked to autoimmunity, originates with Professor Shinsaku Horiguchi 50 years ago (ref: 1). However, unfortunately the concept of chronic nasopharyngitis got lost in medicine, and was forgotten. Until now.

Further Info

An editorial commentary of the Dr Osamu Hotta 2016 study is found here: Is the immune neuroendocrine system the connection between epipharyngitis and chronic fatigue syndrome induced by HPV vaccine?

The Dr Osamu Hotta et al 2016 study is here (full paper here).

A good article about this study is found on the ME research UK website here.

Dr Osamu Hotta details his findings in this video presentation.

Another paper by Osamu Hotta: Chronic epipharyngitis: A missing trigger in chronic fatigue syndrome

Dr Hotta's paper examining the possible mechanisms of epipharyngeal abrasive therapy (EAT) with zinc chloride as a treatment for nasopharyngitis: Possible Mechanisms Underlying Epipharyngeal Abrasive Therapy (EAT) with ZnCl2 Solution for the Treatment of Autoimmune Diseases and Functional Somatic Syndrome.
  • In this paper Dr Hotta points out that one possible mechanism of EAT is the anti-inflammatory affect of zinc chloride: the epithelial cells in the nasopharynx have MHC class II receptors, as do a large number of lymphocytes which are located directly adjacent to these epithelial cells. So it is hypothesized the zinc chloride may quell inflammation in these cells.
  • A second possible mechanism is based on a hypothesized blood-letting effect of EAT: the bleeding in the nasopharynx caused by abrasive rubbing may drain excessive interstitial fluid, which contains the tissue’s waste products, harmful antigens, immune cells, and inflammatory cytokines and mediators.
  • A third possible mechanism is a hypothesized stimulation of the vagus nerve via EAT. This stimulation might occur chemically, or via the mechanical prodding of the cotton swab.
Professor Shinsaku Horiguchi's 1975 book: The Discovery of the Nasopharyngitis and Its Influence on General Diseases.

Professor Horiguchi's 1958 paper: Subjective Symptoms due to Epipharyngitis.

A review of the various subjective symptoms which may appear in acute and chronic epipharyngitis is given, based upon the author's clinical experience of 20 years. Symptoms such as headache, postnasal drip, nasal congestion, mild fever, dizziness, hyposmia, allergic rhinitis, snoring and nasal voice, etc., are frequently encountered, patients with this disease are therefore apt to undergo medical treatment without obtaining any relief. If otolaryngologists would be more careful and concerned with examination of the epipharynx, it might be possible to relieve many patients of troublesome symptoms of undetermined causes.

Possible Connection to Dr Shoemaker's Nasopharyngeal Infection With MARCoNS?

Dr Ritchie Shoemaker found infections of MARCoNS (multiple antibiotic-resistant coagulase-negative staphylococcus) on the nasopharyngeal mucous membranes of patients with mold-induced illness (an illness Dr Shoemaker calls CIRS, or chronic inflammatory response syndrome).

Dr Shoemaker explains MARCoN infection of the nasopharynx is a major factor behind the pathogenesis of mold and biotoxin-induced illness:
Reduced MSH also allows resistant staph (MARCoNS) to survive in biofilm on the mucous membranes. These bacteria further compound MSH deficiency and the problem by producing exotoxins A and B that cleave MSH, further decreasing the MSH levels. At this point, the downward spiral starts to perpetuate itself.

Source: 1

When MARCoN bacteria are detected in a nasopharyngeal swab, Dr Shoemaker treats MARCoNS using the BEG nasal spray (two sprays 2 to 3 times a day, for 30 days). Ref: 1 The BEG nasal spray consists of Bactroban, EDTA and gentamicin.

Another possible parallel to the idea that chronic nasopharyngitis may be a causal factor in autoimmune disease is the link between jawbone cavitation osteonecrosis / infection and ME/CFS.
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Senior Member
This sounds an awful lot like me as I have severe sinusitis but ENTs usually only find mild symptoms I have orthostatic intolerance, headache, neuromuscular problems in the neck.

Is there any idea how many applications they required? Not sure I'm comfortable sticking something that far up my nose, I'd be scared i'd mess something up. Also, why zinc chloride?

I'm a little skeptical of the cured, because it doesn't have a length of follow up so they could've relapsed a week later.
Did they measure the prevalence of severe chronic nasopharyngitis in people whose CFS did not develop following an HPV vaccine? (/in men with CFS?)

... might the study results be relevant to people whose CFS did not develop following an HPV vaccine?

Do they have any idea whether the nasopharyngitis was there before the vaccine was administered (in which case maybe treating nasopharyngitis before giving HPV would be a good idea)?


Senior Member
Zinc popped up on my profile as one to try,can you tell if you need zinc by looking for ridges on fingernails?
If you took zinc via nose would it make its way into the brain and could that be helpful I wonder
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Senior Member
Is there any idea how many applications they required?

When I was going through the literature and video, I thought I saw somewhere that they applied the 0.5% zinc chloride solution with swabs three times a week; but I can't seem to find that statement now, so don't quote me on that.

EDIT: in this post later in this thread, it says the treatment was performed twice a day for patients in hospital, and once or twice a week for outpatients.

The length of treatment is around 6 or 7 weeks (46 days), judging by the following patient case study:

At timecode 10:31 in the Dr Osamu Hotta video, he details a case study of one of the 16 CFS patients treated with 0.5% zinc chloride solution. This young girl could not stand up on her own, could barely move her legs, and needed a wheelchair. She had severe nasopharyngitis.

By day 19 of the zinc chloride treatment, her nasopharyngitis had significantly improved, and she was able to stand up for the first time in six months.

By day 41 of the treatment, the swabs used to apply the zinc chloride no longer came back blood stained, indicating that the nasopharyngitis had resolved; and by this stage she could now stand up with ease.

By day 46 of the treatment, this smiling young girl appeared fully healthy.

Is there any idea how many applications they required? Not sure I'm comfortable sticking something that far up my nose, I'd be scared i'd mess something up. Also, why zinc chloride?

As Alex mentions above, I wonder if a 0.5% zinc chloride spray would work just as well as cotton swabs? If you fixed a spray nozzle at the end of a short thin stick (eg, a pencil), and placed this nozzle in your windpipe pharynx area, with the nozzle facing upwards, you might be able to spray the whole of the nasopharynx area.

However, perhaps a mucous coating on the nasopharynx mucous membranes might prevent the zinc chloride from reaching the mucous membrane cells. Perhaps that's why the mechanical pressure from a swab might work better. But it would certainly be worth trying such a spray, if someone does have chronic nasopharyngitis.

A further issue with the spray idea is that at timecode 20:50 in the Dr Osamu Hotta video, he says that one of the healing mechanisms of the zinc chloride treatment is ablation of the damaged epithelial cells in the nasopharynx (via scrubbing with the zinc chloride-soaked cotton swab). Ablation in medicine means the destruction or removal of tissue.

By ablation of these damaged epithelial cells, new healthy epithelial cells can grow. So that is one of the likely healing mechanisms of the zinc chloride treatment applied with a cotton swab.

Note though this post which details how intranasal zinc products can sometimes cause a loss of smell.

The reason zinc is used as a treatment for nasopharyngitis may be because zinc has anti-inflammatory effects, and promotes wound healing. But since Dr Hotta proposes that mechanical ablation with the cotton swab may also be one of the healing mechanisms, it's not clear how much of the healing is due to the zinc, and how much is due to the ablation.

(The nasopharynx, incidentally, is the area where the nasal symptoms of a common cold manifest; the common cold is referred to as nasopharyngitis.)
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Senior Member
Did they measure the prevalence of severe chronic nasopharyngitis in people whose CFS did not develop following an HPV vaccine? (/in men with CFS?)

... might the study results be relevant to people whose CFS did not develop following an HPV vaccine?

That's what I would like to know.

Testing For Nasopharyngitis

I guess the first thing to do would be to test for nasopharyngitis, to see if ME/CFS patients might have this condition of chronic inflammation in their nasopharynx area. If any ME/CFS patient has this chronic nasopharyngitis, then this simple zinc chloride swab treatment might be the answer for those patients.

I communicated with Dr Osamu Hotta by email, and he kindly explained the nasopharyngitis testing procedure to me. Dr Hotta said that if you prod a cotton swab (such as a Q-Tip) approximately 20 times into the mucous membranes of your nasopharynx, if you find blood on the cotton swab after this prodding, it is a reliable diagnostic sign of chronic nasopharyngitis. People with chronic nasopharyngitis will often experience pain when they prod the cotton swab into the nasopharynx.

So to test for chronic nasopharyngitis, you can place a cotton swab (Q-Tip) into the back of your throat (oropharynx), and then gently push the swab upwards into the hidden nasopharynx area just above the back of the throat (as shown in the ② pharyngeal swab image below), and prod the nasopharyngeal mucous membranes with your swab 20 times, blood on the swab indicates chronic nasopharyngitis. (You may need to do this slowly, as prodding the lower nasopharynx too quickly can trigger the gag response.)

The back of the soft palate (roof of your mouth) is stretchy and flexible, so when you stick the cotton swab into your mouth, and then upwards into the nasopharynx area, the soft palate will stretch, to allow you to push the cotton swab quite a good way up into the nasopharynx.

You can buy the extra long cotton swabs required for this test online, see here.

I tried this myself, but saw no blood on the Q-Tip. So that means I do not have chronic nasopharyngitis.

Testing for Chronic Nasopharyngitis With a Q-Tip Cotton Swab


The amount of blood you have on your cotton swab after 20 prods is a measure of the severity of the chronic nasopharyngitis, as the image below indicates.

If you have blood over most of the cotton, that indicates severe chronic nasopharyngitis. If only one third of the cotton has blood on it, that indicates moderate chronic nasopharyngitis. If only the tip of the cotton has blood on it, that indicates mild chronic nasopharyngitis. If there is no blood, that indicates you do not have chronic nasopharyngitis.

After Prodding Your nasopharynx 20 Times With a Cotton Swab, the Amount
of Blood on the Cotton Indicates the Severity of Your Nasopharyngitis

Cotton Swabs.png

In terms of being more thorough in testing for chronic nasopharyngitis, it occurred to me that although my above test showed I had no nasopharyngitis in the lower part of my nasopharynx (the part reached by inserting the cotton swab via the back of the mouth), perhaps I may have some chronic nasopharyngitis further up, in the higher part of the nasopharynx, in the area which can only be reached by pushing a swab through the nasal cavity, as shown in the ① nasal swab image in the first post.

So I decided to sticky tape two Q-Tip together to make an extra long Q-Tip cotton swab, I wetted the cotton swab with some water (actually, I used physiological saline to wet it, as this is less irritating to the nasal membranes than water), and I carefully pushed this extra long cotton swab into my nose, as shown in the ① nasal swab image in the first post, and then prodded my nasopharynx.

The extra long Q-Tip was incredibly itchy when in my nose, and made me sneeze a lot afterwards, but there was no pain as the cotton end of the swab touched what I hope was the mucous membranes of my nasopharyngeal area at the far end of my nasal cavity, and still no blood on the swab when I removed it from my nose.

My ME/CFS, however, appeared to be triggered by viral infection. But I wonder if patients whose ME/CFS seemed to be triggered by vaccination are more likely to have chronic nasopharyngitis? Dr Osamu Hotta found that all his cohort of 41 patients who developed CFS after HPV vaccination had severe chronic nasopharyngitis. So it looks like severe chronic nasopharyngitis is extremely common in this post-HPV vaccination CFS-like syndrome.

But what about other types of post-vaccination ME/CFS, such ME/CFS after the hepatitis B vaccine, which is thought to be the most common vaccine trigger for ME/CFS? It would certainly be interesting to know whether any patients on this forum whose ME/CFS seemed to be vaccination-triggered have chronic nasopharyngitis, as tested via the Q-Tip into the back of the mouth and up into the nasopharynx method that I just mentioned above.

Furthermore, I would be interested to know whether those who developed narcolepsy after the Pandemrix H1N1 flu vaccine have severe chronic nasopharyngitis.

If so, this simple zinc chloride treatment of the nasopharyngitis could cure or improve some of these narcolepsy cases as well, which would be wonderful.

Do they have any idea whether the nasopharyngitis was there before the vaccine was administered (in which case maybe treating nasopharyngitis before giving HPV would be a good idea)?

Yes, in the Hotta 2016 study (full paper here), they say that chronic nasopharyngitis is common in the general healthy population, and in their own tests on female healthy controls, they found that 56% of them had mild to moderate chronic nasopharyngitis, and 5% had severe nasopharyngitis.

What the study authors suggest is that, with chronic nasopharyngitis being such a common pre-existing condition in the general healthy population, it is conceivable that this pre-existing chronic nasopharyngitis may be prone to exacerbation by the immune stimulating effects of the adjuvants found in many vaccines.

In other words, a healthy individual may have some degree of chronic nasopharyngitis already, but when their immune system is stimulated and ramped up by the adjuvant in the vaccine, this may make the pre-existing nasopharyngitis inflammatory immune response worse, and this is when the nasopharyngitis becomes severe, may then start to cause major problems, such as triggering autoimmunity.
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Senior Member
I wonder if they considered a zinc chloride spray?

I'm with you! I'm definitely not a fan of sticking hard-ish objects that far up my nose. It would be great to have a spray to see if one derives any benefit from this.The only issue I can think of is I wonder if the spray would be able to get far enough into the nose?

I doubt that this would cure me but if it would fix my drug-resistant non-allergic rhinitis then that would still be much appreciated haha. I'm all for anything that can help even 1 symptom


Senior Member
looks like a spray form is available through rx. I wonder how to get a dr to do the nasal swap to check for blood? my lyme dr did a swab for marcoons it felt like it went pretty deep, i survived but i didnt see any blood- then again i wasn't looing.


Senior Member
I would think that you don't need to stick a Q-Tip into your nose for chronic nasopharyngitis diagnosis: if you place a Q-Tip swab head into your mouth and into the back of your pharynx, and then gently push the cotton swab head upwards into your nasopharynx mucous membranes, that may be enough to check if the Q-Tip comes back with blood on it or not.

I am talking about the ② pharyngeal swab method, going through the mouth, shown in this image in the first post.

If there is no blood on the Q-Tip, you probably do not have chronic nasopharyngitis, so zinc chloride solution is unlikely to help you (unless the inflammation is further up in your nasopharynx, as so did not show on the Q-Tip swab test).

But if you find blood, then perhaps you are in luck, because then this simple zinc chloride treatment might just cure or improve your ME/CFS.

Note though that you would expect many people to have some bleeding in the swab test, because as mentioned, in the study even in healthy controls they found 56% had 1+ mild to moderate level bleeding in the swab test, and 5% had the 2+ severe level bleeding.
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Alone & Wandering
Zogor-Ndreaj, Shkodër, Albania
Zinc is much more than anti-inflammatory.

I first started looking at the antiviral properties of zinc when Pridgen hypothesised HSV1 as the causative factor in ME/CFS. Zinc is a very effective antiviral and this could be another potential reason it has worked in the patients in study quoted by @Hip

Above link gives a great overview on zinc and it's antiviral properties.

Anyone who does try the swab test, please report back with findings.

I think studies like these are extremely useful in furthering our understanding on the mechanism of CFS and more importantly provide us with direct treatment options and skips the years of studies needed to find out questions such as "why?" and takes us straight to "here is how you fix it".


Senior Member
@Hip This made me think of what was discussed in this thread, I think these is a good population to try this on.

Yes, in ME/CFS patients who have a chronic sore throat and/or crimson crescents, I was wondering whether gargling with 0.5% zinc chloride solution daily to target the sore throat might be worth trying.

In the Hotta 2016 study, they say that the nasopharyngeal area is rich with B-lymphocytes (B-cells), and also with T-lymphocytes (T-cells), and that these lymphocytes are found to be highly activated, even in normal healthy individuals.

So the nasopharynx site seems to be pretty active immunologically, and in the study they suggest this immunological activity could play a role in autoimmunity, or could affect the HPA axis (since the nasopharynx lies close to the pituitary gland), or could affect autonomic function.

I just wonder whether the crimson crescents and chronic sore throat often found in ME/CFS might also be one of these active immunological areas, and in which case, there might be benefits obtained from the anti-inflammatory or antiviral effects of gargling zinc chloride solution. This of course is highly speculative, and there is no reason to suppose that what works in the nasopharynx will also work in the pharynx. But gargling daily with 0.5% zinc chloride solution would not be difficult to do.

In the case of the crimson crescents, you could also rub these with a 0.5% zinc chloride-soaked cotton swab (Q-Tip), to provide the same ablation effect on the epithelial cells that Dr Hotta suggested was acting to remove any damaged epithelial cells, and encouraging new healthy epithelial cells to grow in their place.

However, I think it is more important to try to replicate the Hotta study in any ME/CFS patients who find, via the swab test, that they have severe chronic nasopharyngitis (especially patients whose ME/CFS appeared just after a vaccination). I think those are going to be the patients who stand a real chance of cure or improvement in symptoms, from performing the zinc chloride treatment.
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Toronto, ON


Senior Member
@MastBCrazy, I have used this, and found that it has changed my life.
If I stop using oral probiotics (I use three of them every day), I feel symptoms creeping back. Which makes me think that I get probably reinfected with whatever is the culprit immediately.
Even if I don't touch people. Most of the people I know seem to give me this effect. I get a kind of dark cloud of depression, a touch of bleeding gums. They don't seem to know there is something wrong with them.
Now it only lasts for a couple of days.
I know I am not crazy, because my husband has the same reaction.

The strange thing is that this happens only if we meet them in a home, not in public places. I suspect that the public places are awash with disinfectants of all kinds.

Anyway, thanks to the oral probiotics, we are back very fast to our happy, fun loving, joke cracking selves. Which makes us weirder and weirder by the day, considering the general gloom!

I started a thread about his some time ago :

Good luck to all!


Hoarder of biscuits
Sometime in the 1990's my regular GP recommended Zicam to me as a way to shorten my colds, and he based this on clinical trials. It has to be used right at the start of the cold. I think I was able to shorten a few colds because of it, and I recommended it to my friends/family.

Zicam is listed as a homeopathic remedy, composed of the active ingredients zinc acetate (2X = 1/100 dilution) and zinc gluconate (1X = 1/10 dilution) and the homeopathic ingredients galphimia glauca, histamine dihydrochloride (homeopathic name, histaminum hydrochloricum), luffa operculata, and sulfur.

The bad news:
In 2006, Matrixx Initiatives paid $12 million to settle 340 lawsuits from Zicam users who said that the product destroyed their sense of smell[5] (medically termed anosmia), although the company did not admit fault.[13] As of 2009, "hundreds more such suits have since been filed."[5]
FDA warning and product recall
On June 16, 2009, the FDA advised consumers to discontinue use of three nasally administered versions of Zicam Cold Remedy—Zicam Cold Remedy Nasal Gel, Zicam Cold Remedy Nasal Swabs, and Zicam Cold Remedy Swabs, Kids Size (a discontinued product)—because the FDA had associated a serious risk of anosmia with them.[17] The advisory did not implicate other Zicam products.

Losing one's sense of smell is hazardous because you can't smell smoke from a fire or natural gas odor or spoiled food.

FDA Warning:
On June 16, 2009, the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) warned consumers to stop using and discard three zinc-containing Zicam intranasal products. The products may cause a loss of sense of smell.

Zicam isn't the only intranasal zinc product linked to loss of smell:
According to Zicam lawsuits, it has been known for years that intranasal zinc can cause a partial or complete loss of smell. During the 1930s, medical professionals attempted to prevent polio by using intranasal zinc. While the effort was unsuccessful, it was noted that the zinc caused a loss of smell in some people who received treatment.
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