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Post-HPV Vaccine CFS: 25% Cured by Treating Their Nasopharyngitis With Zinc Chloride

Discussion in 'General Treatment' started by Hip, Jan 7, 2017.

  1. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    Treating Nasopharyngitis With Zinc Chloride Solution Cures 25% of Patients With a CFS-Like Condition Appearing After HPV Vaccination


    In a 2016 Japanese study (full paper here), Dr Osamu Hotta et al looked at 41 patients who developed chronic fatigue syndrome (CFS) after receiving the human papillomavirus (HPV) vaccine.

    All 41 patients were found to have severe chronic nasopharyngitis (also called epipharyngitis), which is an inflammation in the nasopharynx (also called the epipharynx), the area just above the pharynx.



    The Nasopharynx
    nasopharynx.jpg

    When the chronic inflammation in the nasopharynx area of 16 of these CFS patients was treated with 0.5% zinc chloride solution (ZnCI2) topically applied with cotton swabs, 25% of the 16 patients were completely cured of their CFS-like illness, and in total, 81% of the 16 patients significantly improved as a result of the treatment (they only treated 16 out of the 41 patients, because only these 16 were willing to regularly attend hospital for the zinc chloride treatment).

    In the 19% of the 16 patients who did not respond to treatment, the study authors observed that the zinc chloride unfortunately did not reduce their nasopharygeal inflammation; whereas in the responders, they observed that the application of zinc chloride helped resolve the nasopharyngitis. So this is more evidence that the nasopharygeal inflammation is actually playing a causal role in these cases of CFS.


    This study is very interesting, as it perhaps reignites the old idea of a chronic focal infection playing a role in ME/CFS (a focal infection is one that is localized to a specific site in the body). Several people on this forum had ME/CFS symptoms as a result of a chronic focal infection within the jaw bone (osteomyelitis). location

    It also makes me wonder whether the chronic or recurrent sore throat (pharyngitis) and the crimson crescents often found in regular ME/CFS patients might be playing a role in driving the disease.


    The Hotta 2016 study authors propose that the cures and symptomatic improvements in the CFS patients treated with zinc chloride could be related to hypothalamic pituitary adrenal (HPA) axis normalization, and propose that these improvement may arise from restoration of the immune neuroendocrine system.

    The authors think that this nasopharyngitis treatment may also be effective for various other types of functional somatic syndrome, regardless of the initial cause, as well as for some autoimmune diseases. Functional somatic syndromes include: chronic fatigue syndrome, fibromyalgia, multiple chemical sensitivity, the Gulf War syndrome and irritable bowel syndrome.



    Zinc Chloride Solution Treatment Applied to the Nasopharynx

    The image below shows how the 0.5% zinc chloride solution is applied to the entire nasopharynx surface, by inserting cotton swabs through the nasal cavity, and by inserting cotton swabs via the back of the throat. The treatment procedure is shown at timecode 6:46 in this video.

    Applying 0.5% Zinc Chloride Solution to the Inflamed Nasopharynx Using Swabs
    Swabs.png
    The nasopharyngeal inflammation in the 41 patients with HPV vaccine-induced CFS was severe: when the 0.5% zinc chloride solution was dabbed onto the nasopharyngeal area with cotton swabs, the swabs were significantly reddened with blood from the inflamed nasopharyngeal tissues (see image below).

    Diagnosis of nasopharyngitis can only be made by such direct surface abrasion using a cotton swab: if there is pain during surface abrasion and the cotton swab comes back with blood on it, then this helps confirm a diagnosis of nasopharyngitis.

    As treatment continues over the weeks, the severity of the pain and the amount of blood on the swab is found to gradually reduce in response to treatment with zinc chloride.

    The authors used the amount of blood found on the cotton swab as a rough gauge of the degree of nasopharyngeal inflammation (the more blood, the worse the inflammation).

    Blood on the Cotton Swabs Used to Apply Zinc Chloride Solution to the Inflamed Nasopharynx
    Cotton Swabs.png

    In the Hotta 2016 study, they found that all 41 patients with HPV vaccine-induced CFS had the 2+ severe level of bleeding on the cotton swab applicator, as shown at the far left of the above image, which indicated that they had severe chronic nasopharyngitis.

    By contrast, in 39 female healthy controls, 39% had no bleeding, 56% had 1+ moderate to mild level bleeding, and 5% had the 2+ severe level bleeding, as determined by the amount of blood on the cotton swab. Ref: 1

    So interestingly, in the general healthy population, 56% had mild to moderate nasopharyngitis.



    Chronic Nasopharyngitis Links to Autoimmunity, HPA-Axis Dysfunction, Autonomic Nervous System Dysfunction, and Various Diseases

    The authors think chronic nasopharyngitis (epipharyngitis) may play an important role in the development of autoimmune diseases. They say that because of its anatomical location, chronic inflammation in the nasopharynx could have systemic effects through autoimmunity, and also via the autonomic nervous system. More info can be found at timecode 13:27 of this video.

    The Hotta 2016 study authors point out that:
    • Chronic nasopharyngitis is present in a significant proportion of the population.
    • Although it may cause significant symptoms, nasopharyngitis is rarely observed on routine otolaryngologic observation by ENT specialists.
    • Diagnosis of nasopharyngeal inflammation can only be made by direct surface abrasion of the nasopharyngeal mucous membrane (with a swab); pain during and after the abrasion of the nasopharyngeal mucosa with local hemorrhage confirms the presence of nasopharyngitis. In other words, if it hurts and it bleeds when a cotton swab is rubbed on your nasopharyngeal mucous membranes, then that indicates nasopharyngitis.
    • In the nasopharynx, there is an abundance of lymphocytes in the submucosal area, with a large number of lymphocytes colocating with the nasopharyngeal epithelial cells; there are more B-lymphocytes (B-cells) than T-lymphocytes (T-cells).
    • In the nasopharynx, both the T-lymphocytes and B-lymphocytes are highly activated, even in normal healthy individuals. So the nasopharynx site seems to be of immunological significance.
    • It is conceivable that latent, pre-existing inflammation of the nasopharynx may be prone to exacerbation by the immune stimulating effects of the adjuvants found in most vaccinations.
    The Hotta 2016 study authors say that the various symptoms related to chronic nasopharyngitis can be divided into three categories:

    (1) Direct or radiated symptoms caused by nasopharyngitis, including: headache, shoulder stiffness, neck stiffness, sore throat, throat discomfort including globus sensation (feeling of a lump in the throat that is not actually there), tinnitus, post-nasal drip, persistent cough, and low-grade fever are included in this category.

    (2) The second category is symptoms that arise because of dysfunction of the hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis (HPA axis) and alterations in the limbic system. Symptoms associated with dysfunction of the autonomic nervous system include: orthostatic dysregulation, dizziness, gastrointestinal symptoms, general fatigue, and generalized pain.

    (3) The third category is an associated immune-mediated mechanism caused by focal inflammation of the nasopharynx, and symptoms or conditions associated with this include: glomerulonephritis / inflammation of the kidneys (such as immunoglobulin A nephropathy), dermatitis (such as chronic urticaria and pustulosis palmoplantaris), arthritis (such as reactive arthritis and sternocostoclavicular hyperostosis), and some other autoimmune diseases.


    In Japan, the discovery of chronic nasopharyngitis, and the proposal that chronic nasopharyngitis could be linked to autoimmunity, originates with Professor Shinsaku Horiguchi 50 years ago (ref: 1). However, unfortunately the concept of chronic nasopharyngitis got lost in medicine, and was forgotten. Until now.



    Further Info

    An editorial commentary of the Dr Osamu Hotta 2016 study is found here: Is the immune neuroendocrine system the connection between epipharyngitis and chronic fatigue syndrome induced by HPV vaccine?

    The Dr Osamu Hotta et al 2016 study is here (full paper here).

    A good article about this study is found on the ME research UK website here.

    Dr Osamu Hotta details his findings in this video presentation.


    Professor Shinsaku Horiguchi's 1975 book: The Discovery of the Nasopharyngitis and Its Influence on General Diseases.

     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2017 at 2:51 PM
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  2. Asklipia

    Asklipia Senior Member

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    :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:
     
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  3. dreampop

    dreampop

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    This sounds an awful lot like me as I have severe sinusitis but ENTs usually only find mild symptoms I have orthostatic intolerance, headache, neuromuscular problems in the neck.

    Is there any idea how many applications they required? Not sure I'm comfortable sticking something that far up my nose, I'd be scared i'd mess something up. Also, why zinc chloride?

    I'm a little skeptical of the cured, because it doesn't have a length of follow up so they could've relapsed a week later.
     
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  4. PeeWee

    PeeWee

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    Did they measure the prevalence of severe chronic nasopharyngitis in people whose CFS did not develop following an HPV vaccine? (/in men with CFS?)

    ... might the study results be relevant to people whose CFS did not develop following an HPV vaccine?

    Do they have any idea whether the nasopharyngitis was there before the vaccine was administered (in which case maybe treating nasopharyngitis before giving HPV would be a good idea)?
     
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  5. wastwater

    wastwater Senior Member

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    Zinc popped up on my profile as one to try,can you tell if you need zinc by looking for ridges on fingernails?
    If you took zinc via nose would it make its way into the brain and could that be helpful I wonder
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2017
  6. alex3619

    alex3619 Senior Member

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    If this is on the membrane and not internal then it might be very hard to detect the infection using a blood test. A swab might be more effective.
     
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  7. alex3619

    alex3619 Senior Member

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    I wonder if they considered a zinc chloride spray?
     
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  8. lnester7

    lnester7 Seven

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    I wonder if this is the same as what Lipkin group was refering on the altered bacteria in those areas???
     
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  9. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    When I was going through the literature and video, I thought I saw somewhere that they applied the 0.5% zinc chloride solution with swabs three times a week; but I can't seem to find that statement now, so don't quote me on that.

    EDIT: in this post later in this thread, it says the treatment was performed twice a day for patients in hospital, and once or twice a week for outpatients.


    The length of treatment is around 6 or 7 weeks (46 days), judging by the following patient case study:

    At timecode 10:31 in the Dr Osamu Hotta video, he details a case study of one of the 16 CFS patients treated with 0.5% zinc chloride solution. This young girl could not stand up on her own, could barely move her legs, and needed a wheelchair. She had severe nasopharyngitis.

    By day 19 of the zinc chloride treatment, her nasopharyngitis had significantly improved, and she was able to stand up for the first time in six months.

    By day 41 of the treatment, the swabs used to apply the zinc chloride no longer came back blood stained, indicating that the nasopharyngitis had resolved; and by this stage she could now stand up with ease.

    By day 46 of the treatment, this smiling young girl appeared fully healthy.



    As Alex mentions above, I wonder if a 0.5% zinc chloride spray would work just as well as cotton swabs? If you fixed a spray nozzle at the end of a short thin stick (eg, a pencil), and placed this nozzle in your windpipe pharynx area, with the nozzle facing upwards, you might be able to spray the whole of the nasopharynx area.

    However, perhaps a mucous coating on the nasopharynx mucous membranes might prevent the zinc chloride from reaching the mucous membrane cells. Perhaps that's why the mechanical pressure from a swab might work better. But it would certainly be worth trying such a spray, if someone does have chronic nasopharyngitis.

    A further issue with the spray idea is that at timecode 20:50 in the Dr Osamu Hotta video, he says that one of the healing mechanisms of the zinc chloride treatment is ablation of the damaged epithelial cells in the nasopharynx (via scrubbing with the zinc chloride-soaked cotton swab). Ablation in medicine means the destruction or removal of tissue.

    By ablation of these damaged epithelial cells, new healthy epithelial cells can grow. So that is one of the likely healing mechanisms of the zinc chloride treatment applied with a cotton swab.

    Note though this post which details how intranasal zinc products can sometimes cause a loss of smell.


    The reason zinc is used as a treatment for nasopharyngitis may be because zinc has anti-inflammatory effects, and promotes wound healing. But since Dr Hotta proposes that mechanical ablation with the cotton swab may also be one of the healing mechanisms, it's not clear how much of the healing is due to the zinc, and how much is due to the ablation.


    (The nasopharynx, incidentally, is the area where the nasal symptoms of a common cold manifest; the common cold is referred to as nasopharyngitis.)
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2017 at 2:40 PM
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  10. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    That's what I would like to know.


    Testing For Nasopharyngitis

    I guess the first thing to do would be to test for nasopharyngitis, to see if ME/CFS patients might have this condition of chronic inflammation in their nasopharynx area. If any ME/CFS patient has this chronic nasopharyngitis, then this simple zinc chloride swab treatment might be the answer for those patients.

    I communicated with Dr Osamu Hotta by email, and he kindly explained the nasopharyngitis testing procedure to me. Dr Hotta said that if you prod the cotton swab approximately 20 times into the mucous membranes of your nasopharynx, if you find blood on the cotton swab after this, it is a reliable diagnostic sign of chronic nasopharyngitis.

    Thus if you place a cotton swab (a Q-Tip) into the back of your throat (oropharynx), and then gently push the swab upwards into the hidden nasopharynx area just above the back of the throat (as shown in the ② pharyngeal swab image below), and prod the nasopharyngeal mucous membranes with your swab 20 times, blood on the swab indicates chronic nasopharyngitis.

    I tried this myself, but saw no blood on the Q-Tip. So I presume that means I do not have chronic nasopharyngitis.

    Testing for Chronic Nasopharyngitis With a Q-Tip Cotton Swab

    Swabs.png

    The amount of blood you have on your cotton swab is a measure of the severity of the chronic nasopharyngitis, as the image below indicates.

    If you have blood over most of the cotton, that indicates severe chronic nasopharyngitis. If only one third of the cotton has blood on it, that indicates moderate chronic nasopharyngitis. If only the tip of the cotton has blood on it, that indicates mild chronic nasopharyngitis. If there is no blood, that indicates you do not have chronic nasopharyngitis.

    After Prodding Your nasopharynx 20 Times With a Cotton Swab, the Amount
    of Blood on the Cotton Indicates the Severity of Your Nasopharyngitis

    Cotton Swabs.png



    Though it occurred to me that I have some chronic nasopharyngitis further up, in an area which can only be reached by pushing a swab through the nasal cavity, as shown in the ① nasal swab image in the first post.

    Now I am not recommending this, but I decided to sticky tape two Q-Tip together to make an extra long Q-Tip cotton swab, I wetted the cotton swab with some water (actually, I used physiological saline to wet it, as this is less irritating to the nasal membranes than water), and I carefully pushed this extra long cotton swab into my nose, as shown in the ① nasal swab image in the first post.

    The extra long Q-Tip was incredibly itchy when in my nose, and made me sneeze a lot afterwards, but there was no pain as the cotton end of the swab touched what I hope was the mucous membranes of my nasopharyngeal area at the far end of my nasal cavity, and still no blood on the swab when I removed it from my nose. (I am not suggesting that anyone should follow my example though.)



    My ME/CFS, however, appeared to be triggered by viral infection. But I wonder if patients whose ME/CFS seemed to be triggered by vaccination are more likely to have chronic nasopharyngitis? Dr Osamu Hotta found that all his cohort of 41 patients who developed CFS after HPV vaccination had severe chronic nasopharyngitis. So it looks like severe chronic nasopharyngitis is extremely common in this post-HPV vaccination CFS-like syndrome.

    But what about other types of post-vaccination ME/CFS, such ME/CFS after the hepatitis B vaccine, which is thought to be the most common vaccine trigger for ME/CFS? It would certainly be interesting to know whether any patients on this forum whose ME/CFS seemed to be vaccination-triggered have chronic nasopharyngitis, as tested via the Q-Tip into the back of the mouth and up into the nasopharynx method that I just mentioned above.



    Furthermore, I would be interested to know whether those who developed narcolepsy after the Pandemrix H1N1 flu vaccine have severe chronic nasopharyngitis.

    If so, this simple zinc chloride treatment of the nasopharyngitis could cure or improve some of these narcolepsy cases as well, which would be wonderful.



    Yes, in the Hotta 2016 study (full paper here), they say that chronic nasopharyngitis is common in the general healthy population, and in their own tests on female healthy controls, they found that 56% of them had mild to moderate chronic nasopharyngitis, and 5% had severe nasopharyngitis.

    What the study authors suggest is that, with chronic nasopharyngitis being such a common pre-existing condition in the general healthy population, it is conceivable that this pre-existing chronic nasopharyngitis may be prone to exacerbation by the immune stimulating effects of the adjuvants found in many vaccines.

    In other words, a healthy individual may have some degree of chronic nasopharyngitis already, but when their immune system is stimulated and ramped up by the adjuvant in the vaccine, this may make the pre-existing nasopharyngitis inflammatory immune response worse, and this is when the nasopharyngitis becomes severe, may then start to cause major problems, such as triggering autoimmunity.
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2017 at 10:01 PM
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  11. GlassHouse

    GlassHouse

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    I'm with you! I'm definitely not a fan of sticking hard-ish objects that far up my nose. It would be great to have a spray to see if one derives any benefit from this.The only issue I can think of is I wonder if the spray would be able to get far enough into the nose?

    I doubt that this would cure me but if it would fix my drug-resistant non-allergic rhinitis then that would still be much appreciated haha. I'm all for anything that can help even 1 symptom
     
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  12. cb2

    cb2 Senior Member

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    looks like a spray form is available through rx. I wonder how to get a dr to do the nasal swap to check for blood? my lyme dr did a swab for marcoons it felt like it went pretty deep, i survived but i didnt see any blood- then again i wasn't looing.
     
  13. Barry53

    Barry53 Senior Member

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    Agreed - don't think I could even do it. Apart from which I would be worried that when I pulled it back out again some of it might have got left behind!
     
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  14. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    I would think that you don't need to stick a Q-Tip into your nose for chronic nasopharyngitis diagnosis: if you place a Q-Tip swab head into your mouth and into the back of your pharynx, and then gently push the cotton swab head upwards into your nasopharynx mucous membranes, that may be enough to check if the Q-Tip comes back with blood on it or not.

    I am talking about the ② pharyngeal swab method, going through the mouth, shown in this image in the first post.

    If there is no blood on the Q-Tip, you probably do not have chronic nasopharyngitis, so zinc chloride solution is unlikely to help you (unless the inflammation is further up in your nasopharynx, as so did not show on the Q-Tip swab test).

    But if you find blood, then perhaps you are in luck, because then this simple zinc chloride treatment might just cure or improve your ME/CFS.


    Note though that you would expect many people to have some bleeding in the swab test, because as mentioned, in the study even in healthy controls they found 56% had 1+ mild to moderate level bleeding in the swab test, and 5% had the 2+ severe level bleeding.
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2017
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  15. Jon_Tradicionali

    Jon_Tradicionali Alone & Wandering

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    Zinc is much more than anti-inflammatory.

    I first started looking at the antiviral properties of zinc when Pridgen hypothesised HSV1 as the causative factor in ME/CFS. Zinc is a very effective antiviral and this could be another potential reason it has worked in the patients in study quoted by @Hip

    http://www.project.nsearch.com/m/blogpost?id=4878805:BlogPost:553213

    Above link gives a great overview on zinc and it's antiviral properties.

    Anyone who does try the swab test, please report back with findings.

    I think studies like these are extremely useful in furthering our understanding on the mechanism of CFS and more importantly provide us with direct treatment options and skips the years of studies needed to find out questions such as "why?" and takes us straight to "here is how you fix it".
     
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  16. lnester7

    lnester7 Seven

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  17. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    Yes, in ME/CFS patients who have a chronic sore throat and/or crimson crescents, I was wondering whether gargling with 0.5% zinc chloride solution daily to target the sore throat might be worth trying.

    In the Hotta 2016 study, they say that the nasopharyngeal area is rich with B-lymphocytes (B-cells), and also with T-lymphocytes (T-cells), and that these lymphocytes are found to be highly activated, even in normal healthy individuals.

    So the nasopharynx site seems to be pretty active immunologically, and in the study they suggest this immunological activity could play a role in autoimmunity, or could affect the HPA axis (since the nasopharynx lies close to the pituitary gland), or could affect autonomic function.

    I just wonder whether the crimson crescents and chronic sore throat often found in ME/CFS might also be one of these active immunological areas, and in which case, there might be benefits obtained from the anti-inflammatory or antiviral effects of gargling zinc chloride solution. This of course is highly speculative, and there is no reason to suppose that what works in the nasopharynx will also work in the pharynx. But gargling daily with 0.5% zinc chloride solution would not be difficult to do.

    In the case of the crimson crescents, you could also rub these with a 0.5% zinc chloride-soaked cotton swab (Q-Tip), to provide the same ablation effect on the epithelial cells that Dr Hotta suggested was acting to remove any damaged epithelial cells, and encouraging new healthy epithelial cells to grow in their place.



    However, I think it is more important to try to replicate the Hotta study in any ME/CFS patients who find, via the swab test, that they have severe chronic nasopharyngitis (especially patients whose ME/CFS appeared just after a vaccination). I think those are going to be the patients who stand a real chance of cure or improvement in symptoms, from performing the zinc chloride treatment.
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2017
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  18. MastBCrazy

    MastBCrazy

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  19. Asklipia

    Asklipia Senior Member

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    @MastBCrazy, I have used this, and found that it has changed my life.
    If I stop using oral probiotics (I use three of them every day), I feel symptoms creeping back. Which makes me think that I get probably reinfected with whatever is the culprit immediately.
    Even if I don't touch people. Most of the people I know seem to give me this effect. I get a kind of dark cloud of depression, a touch of bleeding gums. They don't seem to know there is something wrong with them.
    Now it only lasts for a couple of days.
    I know I am not crazy, because my husband has the same reaction.

    The strange thing is that this happens only if we meet them in a home, not in public places. I suspect that the public places are awash with disinfectants of all kinds.

    Anyway, thanks to the oral probiotics, we are back very fast to our happy, fun loving, joke cracking selves. Which makes us weirder and weirder by the day, considering the general gloom!

    I started a thread about his some time ago : http://forums.phoenixrising.me/index.php?threads/oral-probiotics-to-clear-your-head.42606/

    Good luck to all!
     
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  20. CFS_for_19_years

    CFS_for_19_years คภภเє ɠรค๓թєl

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    Sometime in the 1990's my regular GP recommended Zicam to me as a way to shorten my colds, and he based this on clinical trials. It has to be used right at the start of the cold. I think I was able to shorten a few colds because of it, and I recommended it to my friends/family.

    Zicam is listed as a homeopathic remedy, composed of the active ingredients zinc acetate (2X = 1/100 dilution) and zinc gluconate (1X = 1/10 dilution) and the homeopathic ingredients galphimia glauca, histamine dihydrochloride (homeopathic name, histaminum hydrochloricum), luffa operculata, and sulfur.

    The bad news: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zicam#Safety_concerns
    Losing one's sense of smell is hazardous because you can't smell smoke from a fire or natural gas odor or spoiled food.

    FDA Warning: http://www.fda.gov/ForConsumers/ConsumerUpdates/ucm166931.htm
    Zicam isn't the only intranasal zinc product linked to loss of smell:
    https://www.forthepeople.com/class-action-lawyers/zicam-lawsuits/loss-of-smell-from-zicam/
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2017
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