The Undetectable Infection
- Thread starter Elph68
- Start date
hey @roonie, I fixed my gastric reflux by taking 10 drops of oregano oil in water 3-4x per day. I now only take oregano oil morning and night. I have a sneaky suspicion that reflux can be caused by SIBO .;....
Cheers.
Prescript assist was the one I was taking, they are just beneficial bacteria that don't hang around in the gut but pass through. The theory is that they compete for food with the resident bacteria thus helping to lower the numbers of bad bacteria in the gut .....
I found I wasn't so 'gassy' while i was taking them, and it felt like it helped with acidosis/brain fog etc.. I stopped taking them about a month ago because I am now trying to rebuild my flora with natural bacteria.
Everything I use (supplements) I either double or triple the recommended daily dose ..... I don't recommend anybody else do this though.
About 4 months ago I added iodine drops to my regime, I suspect that given the diets we follow many of us have a deficiency. As iodine is antibacterial and a very important part of our immune system, supplementing may be beneficial. This is one that you may need some advice on as iodine is poisonous, and having too much can also cause all sorts of problems ....
Cheers.
elph68...ive tried oil of oregano to no avial.
the biggest problems we face up here in Canada is a heath care system that never seems to want to get to the root cause of anything. Its great that our health care system is paid for but we get nothing in return but pills to cover symptoms...very sad. The drug companies have their hands in too many pockets. I believe the reason we are all not getting answers from the governments, researchers, etc. is that we are delving into, and looking for the truth and "they" dont like it when anyone comes knocking for the truth as there is no money in the truth (cure) so we are all left to fend for ourselves. Why fix a system that keeps people coming back for more.
It reminds me of a T shirt i seen that stated..."trust me..im a doctor"
the biggest problems we face up here in Canada is a heath care system that never seems to want to get to the root cause of anything. Its great that our health care system is paid for but we get nothing in return but pills to cover symptoms...very sad. The drug companies have their hands in too many pockets. I believe the reason we are all not getting answers from the governments, researchers, etc. is that we are delving into, and looking for the truth and "they" dont like it when anyone comes knocking for the truth as there is no money in the truth (cure) so we are all left to fend for ourselves. Why fix a system that keeps people coming back for more.
It reminds me of a T shirt i seen that stated..."trust me..im a doctor"
I understand your frustration @roonie, it is no different here in Australia .... and where I am here in Tasmania, it is the worst ...... our problem is, we don't know how to talk to them in their language ..... so let's change it here and now!!!!
So, my research says that Staphlyococcus slime is what causes the immune system activation ..... immune system activation is a well known and documented condition of CFS.
Staphlyococcus Slime is produced mostly by Multi Antibiotic Resistant Staphlyococcus Species (MARSS) .... so let's call them MARS.
To make this simple, we can call the immune system activation an 'allergic reaction'.
Therefore, the simplest way to explain this is 'We are allergic to MARSS'!!!!
If we start using this language, rather than the term 'infection' ..... I believe then some people will start to take notice and may start looking in the right place......
Staphlyococcus Slime is produced mostly by Multi Antibiotic Resistant Staphlyococcus Species (MARSS) .... so let's call them MARS.
To make this simple, we can call the immune system activation an 'allergic reaction'.
Therefore, the simplest way to explain this is 'We are allergic to MARSS'!!!!
If we start using this language, rather than the term 'infection' ..... I believe then some people will start to take notice and may start looking in the right place......
So this is just me thinking out loud ....... MARSS produce slime that contains polysaccharides which is what activates the immune system ..... the immune system however does not recognise that the polysaccharide is produced by MARSS so it attacks the polysaccharide but not MARSS ...... therefore MARSS keeps producing the polysaccharide keeping the immune system busy ...... now here is the thing, other bacteria like e-Coli are made up of polysaccharides, would it therefore not be possible for the immune system to think that e-coli is also the enemy and start attacking them ...... low e-coli is one of the problems of people with CFS ...... Could this scenario be possible???? .....
elph68...your thinking/information is so close to dr.Ritchie Shoemaker's. He has a website...survivingmold.com and has claimed to have helped tons of people get their life back. He has a 14 point treatment and says we will never get our health back without getting these infections out of all of the areas in our bodies including our noses.
Here is the thing though.....many people that have CFS claim to have been on antibiotics and believe antibiotics did this to them....if you look at how antibiotics are made, many of them derived from mold, it could be possible that we have ingested mold from the very antibiotics that we took so many years prior to getting sick. I personally was on over a year straight of tetracycline for which my acne never went away...but sunlight made it go away in only a couple weeks. Acne was on my back so bad that i, at the age of 17 never wanted to take my shirt off in public so i took my shirt off in my back yard and my acne dissapeared. I honestly believe tetracycline did this to me and because was on them for such a long period of time, i had/have the worst case of cfs that ive ever heard of...I DAM NEAR DIED!!!
My dear friend ...(who just passed away)....a gastro piediatrician that i was fortunate to be a good friend of for 20+ yrs....after spending many years with, thinks ive been concussed as ive had two bad car accidents and probably countless other head injuries as a child in sports and rough play. Many people get this from a loss of a family member or other stressor that triggers this....its all the same thing in my eyes. Hell...the NFL football players get this and commit suicide or die prematurely. ITS A CHANGE IN GUT FLORA!!
Here is the thing though.....many people that have CFS claim to have been on antibiotics and believe antibiotics did this to them....if you look at how antibiotics are made, many of them derived from mold, it could be possible that we have ingested mold from the very antibiotics that we took so many years prior to getting sick. I personally was on over a year straight of tetracycline for which my acne never went away...but sunlight made it go away in only a couple weeks. Acne was on my back so bad that i, at the age of 17 never wanted to take my shirt off in public so i took my shirt off in my back yard and my acne dissapeared. I honestly believe tetracycline did this to me and because was on them for such a long period of time, i had/have the worst case of cfs that ive ever heard of...I DAM NEAR DIED!!!
My dear friend ...(who just passed away)....a gastro piediatrician that i was fortunate to be a good friend of for 20+ yrs....after spending many years with, thinks ive been concussed as ive had two bad car accidents and probably countless other head injuries as a child in sports and rough play. Many people get this from a loss of a family member or other stressor that triggers this....its all the same thing in my eyes. Hell...the NFL football players get this and commit suicide or die prematurely. ITS A CHANGE IN GUT FLORA!!
Hi @roonie the gut flora changes daily and you don't see people dropping with CFS as you are walking down the street.
There are 100's of thousands of people on antibiotics every day ..... tetracycline is used as anti malaria prophylactic, they aren't dropping with CFS. But you are right, they do mess up the microflora and I have said all through this thread the gut is a contributing symptom ...... the cause is a overloaded/dysfunctioning immune system.
I suppose the thought has never crossed your mind that the reason you had bad acne was because you were what I would call pre-CFS ..... your immune system was already failing, you just hadn't had your first real crash.
Many researchers believe there is a link between acne outbreaks and Staphlyococcus colonisation but are struggling to find a link ..... your case supports what I have found .... in fact it fits it like a glove and in my next post I will explain your case in detail so it is crystal clear .....
Cheers.
Before I get to @roonie and his case I just want to show why i am picking on MARSS as the cause.
Firstly, let's talk about PIA or Polysaccharide Intercellular Adhesion. This is the substance produced by staph species which causes immune system activation:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19016779
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22077230
The polysaccharide 20 KDaPS stops the immune system from killing the staph bacteria.
https://www.semanticscholar.org/pap...vata/28bfcff87474ac907984cb59bdd0d4af37cf07d2
So the more of these bacteria that we call normal flora there are in our microflora, the more activated the immune system becomes but because of 20 KDaPS the immune system can't kill the offending bacteria, therefore it keeps running on overdrive until it finally crashes.
In order to explain this, maybe we can think of the immune system as a juggling act. Let's say a juggler can juggle 10 balls, that is it. If they try to juggle 11 or 12 balls, it all crashes down. Let us say that normal people are juggling 5 balls, whereas those of us who develop CFS are already juggling 9 or even 10 balls.
Those people who are only juggling 5 balls can handle extra balls. They can take antibiotics, they can handle stress, they can eat bad food, get a virus infection etc. without overloading the ability to juggle.
Those who develop CFS are juggling all they can and then extra balls arrive like a virus, external toxins, antibiotic use, stress and any other triggers that people have identified and all the balls fall down.
So what these MARS do is keep the immune system running which reduces its capacity to deal with other issues. In @roonie case, the immune system is fighting a war that it doesn't know what the enemy is stretching its resources to the point where it can't keep the acne in check so the acne gets out of control. So the treatment was tetracyclene for acne. Unfortunately these MARS are highly resistant to tetracyclene so as other bacteria are killed off in the microflora the staph takes its place ..... thus there is more staph up the nose, in the throat. So the immune system now has more to deal with due to the more staph in the system.
So now any opportunistic bacteria that resides in the gut can also flourish because the immune system does not have the ability to fight the staph and keep the gut in order and gut issues become worse resulting in IBS, SIBO and other gut issues associated with some people suffering from CFS.
The only thing I can't figure out with this problem is would everybody develop CFS if they were colonized with these slime producing strains rather than the microflora species they currently have? The big mistake in the research is 'counting bugs' They need to look at what the bugs are producing.
So @roonie, to cure your problem I would go with:
8 to 12 weeks of Rifampicin + Fusic acid There are other good anti staph treatments (I still say however phage therapy is the long term answer)
Chlorhexidine body wash around your orifices (eyes/nose/mouth/genitals/anus/under arms/hair) 2x per day
A diet consisting of homemade sauerkraut/kefir/kimchi and fresh leafy greens
use sauerkraut juice up nose and wash on the skin
increase fat and fibre intake
increase protein
No sugars/bread/wheat/rice/corn/dairy etc.
supplement lauricidin, CoQ10, proteolytic enzymes, magnesium, selenium (6 to 8 Brazil nuts), zinc, vitamin C, iodine, vitamin B, Vitamin D (get out in the sun), Prescript Assist probiotics, low sugar yakult, and a good multi probiotic.
Regular exercise in keeping with energy levels and overall health improvement.
No personal/intimate contact with anybody including sharing food/drink and the utensils, for a couple of months after treatment finishes.
Keep away from dogs, don't pat them, don't let them lick you.
This is why I made it simple ..... It is more like an allergy than an infection the body can't produce antibodies to clear the bacteria ..... That is why staphypan worked, it produced antibodies to the bacteria and then the immune system was able to kill them ......
Anyway ..... I hope this sheds some light on this whole thread.
Cheers.
Firstly, let's talk about PIA or Polysaccharide Intercellular Adhesion. This is the substance produced by staph species which causes immune system activation:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19016779
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22077230
The polysaccharide 20 KDaPS stops the immune system from killing the staph bacteria.
https://www.semanticscholar.org/pap...vata/28bfcff87474ac907984cb59bdd0d4af37cf07d2
So the more of these bacteria that we call normal flora there are in our microflora, the more activated the immune system becomes but because of 20 KDaPS the immune system can't kill the offending bacteria, therefore it keeps running on overdrive until it finally crashes.
In order to explain this, maybe we can think of the immune system as a juggling act. Let's say a juggler can juggle 10 balls, that is it. If they try to juggle 11 or 12 balls, it all crashes down. Let us say that normal people are juggling 5 balls, whereas those of us who develop CFS are already juggling 9 or even 10 balls.
Those people who are only juggling 5 balls can handle extra balls. They can take antibiotics, they can handle stress, they can eat bad food, get a virus infection etc. without overloading the ability to juggle.
Those who develop CFS are juggling all they can and then extra balls arrive like a virus, external toxins, antibiotic use, stress and any other triggers that people have identified and all the balls fall down.
So what these MARS do is keep the immune system running which reduces its capacity to deal with other issues. In @roonie case, the immune system is fighting a war that it doesn't know what the enemy is stretching its resources to the point where it can't keep the acne in check so the acne gets out of control. So the treatment was tetracyclene for acne. Unfortunately these MARS are highly resistant to tetracyclene so as other bacteria are killed off in the microflora the staph takes its place ..... thus there is more staph up the nose, in the throat. So the immune system now has more to deal with due to the more staph in the system.
So now any opportunistic bacteria that resides in the gut can also flourish because the immune system does not have the ability to fight the staph and keep the gut in order and gut issues become worse resulting in IBS, SIBO and other gut issues associated with some people suffering from CFS.
The only thing I can't figure out with this problem is would everybody develop CFS if they were colonized with these slime producing strains rather than the microflora species they currently have? The big mistake in the research is 'counting bugs' They need to look at what the bugs are producing.
So @roonie, to cure your problem I would go with:
8 to 12 weeks of Rifampicin + Fusic acid There are other good anti staph treatments (I still say however phage therapy is the long term answer)
Chlorhexidine body wash around your orifices (eyes/nose/mouth/genitals/anus/under arms/hair) 2x per day
A diet consisting of homemade sauerkraut/kefir/kimchi and fresh leafy greens
use sauerkraut juice up nose and wash on the skin
increase fat and fibre intake
increase protein
No sugars/bread/wheat/rice/corn/dairy etc.
supplement lauricidin, CoQ10, proteolytic enzymes, magnesium, selenium (6 to 8 Brazil nuts), zinc, vitamin C, iodine, vitamin B, Vitamin D (get out in the sun), Prescript Assist probiotics, low sugar yakult, and a good multi probiotic.
Regular exercise in keeping with energy levels and overall health improvement.
No personal/intimate contact with anybody including sharing food/drink and the utensils, for a couple of months after treatment finishes.
Keep away from dogs, don't pat them, don't let them lick you.
This is why I made it simple ..... It is more like an allergy than an infection the body can't produce antibodies to clear the bacteria ..... That is why staphypan worked, it produced antibodies to the bacteria and then the immune system was able to kill them ......
Anyway ..... I hope this sheds some light on this whole thread.
Cheers.
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i believe its a genetic predisposition. For many many yrs. my immune system actually worked the opposite, wherein i couldnt catch a cold if i tried for many many yrs. while i was searching for answers. Then , after my cytokine storm, that lasted for many many yrs. and still is,..i cant go into any store or any place where people are without getting a cold. Here is an interesting video with good explanation. Very important to clean up our environment. What i am waiting for is doctor/scientist right here in my own city that has discovered a way to shut off the histamine response permanently......in other words...a permanent cure for allergy..i will post a link. He has found a way to shut off the mast cells.
Here’s how the technique works:
Here’s how the technique works:
- The key component of this research is dendritic cells, which serve as the gate-keepers of the immune system and are present in tissues in contact with the external environment, such as the skin and the inner lining of the nose, lungs, stomach and intestines.
- Gordon’s pioneering treatment involves producing dendritic cells in a test tube and then exposing them to a unique mix of proteins, a vitamin A-related acid naturally occurring in the human gut, and to the allergen, in this case, peanut or ovalbumin (egg white protein). The modified dendritic cells are then reintroduced into the mouse.
- Using this technique, the researchers were able to nearly eliminate the allergic reaction by converting allergen-sensitive immune cells into cells that mimic the response seen in healthy, non-allergic individuals.
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One of the things that I had a problem with in the early days was asthma .... I always thought it was linked ....
This is an interesting study
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/all.12230/abstract
There are heaps of studies that link staph to allergies, eczema, rhinitis etc.
This one links staph to dust mite allergy.
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1398-9995.2005.00902.x/full
This is an interesting study
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/all.12230/abstract
There are heaps of studies that link staph to allergies, eczema, rhinitis etc.
This one links staph to dust mite allergy.
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1398-9995.2005.00902.x/full
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So, here I am thinking out loud ......
What if all our problems aren't genetic ..... I said earlier I am not sure if anybody could get this if they acquire these bugs .....
What if we get these nasty MARSS from our mother?? And our immune system is messed up from birth???
I had eczema - hay fever - asthma - diabetes - and now this ..... all of these are Staphlyococcus related .....
It still could be community acquired ..... prove that it is and watch the change in attitude with regards to research funding .....
I have found a link between Staphylococcus and diabetes other than diabetic ulcers ..... staph colonisation increases blood glucose levels in diabetics ..... if you struggle with that concept, ask any nurse what happens to diabetics when they are given antibiotics?
What if all our problems aren't genetic ..... I said earlier I am not sure if anybody could get this if they acquire these bugs .....
What if we get these nasty MARSS from our mother?? And our immune system is messed up from birth???
I had eczema - hay fever - asthma - diabetes - and now this ..... all of these are Staphlyococcus related .....
It still could be community acquired ..... prove that it is and watch the change in attitude with regards to research funding .....
I have found a link between Staphylococcus and diabetes other than diabetic ulcers ..... staph colonisation increases blood glucose levels in diabetics ..... if you struggle with that concept, ask any nurse what happens to diabetics when they are given antibiotics?
http://www.staph-infection-resources.com/4/mrsa-secrets-revealed.html
someone trying to make money...lets all pitch in and buy the book...lol
someone trying to make money...lets all pitch in and buy the book...lol
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Antibiotic resistant bacteria could be one of the main factors in this disease : Streptococcus , Staphylococcus , Enterococcus - all these lactic acid producing bacteria creates loads of problems.
Check out this video on how bacteria are evolving and getting stronger and stronger despite the heavy antibiotics usage.
http://www.npr.org/sections/health-...vade-antibiotics-and-transform-into-superbugs
Also @roonie 's statement with antibiotics is so true! I have collapsed and entered into bedbound state of CFS after Amoxicillin 500mg usage! My dad developed a 9cm fungal growth in the colon after massive usage of antibiotics and had to be removed with surgery! They are made from mycotoxins ( aflatoxins, ochratoxin,etc. ) and these substances can do damage further.
These drugs can be so helpful if you are dying , if you are into such a serious infection - meningitis , inflammation of the brain ,etc. they can for sure save your life but prescribing them for every flu and what not destroys everything in your body , all the good microbiota is gone , plus now the opportunistic/ antibiotic resisstant Strep ,Staph, Enterococcus takes advantage and they multiply like crazy.
Check out this video on how bacteria are evolving and getting stronger and stronger despite the heavy antibiotics usage.
http://www.npr.org/sections/health-...vade-antibiotics-and-transform-into-superbugs
Also @roonie 's statement with antibiotics is so true! I have collapsed and entered into bedbound state of CFS after Amoxicillin 500mg usage! My dad developed a 9cm fungal growth in the colon after massive usage of antibiotics and had to be removed with surgery! They are made from mycotoxins ( aflatoxins, ochratoxin,etc. ) and these substances can do damage further.
These drugs can be so helpful if you are dying , if you are into such a serious infection - meningitis , inflammation of the brain ,etc. they can for sure save your life but prescribing them for every flu and what not destroys everything in your body , all the good microbiota is gone , plus now the opportunistic/ antibiotic resisstant Strep ,Staph, Enterococcus takes advantage and they multiply like crazy.
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There are also some new discoveries in CFS posted yesterday :
Problems with Citric acid cycle ( the one that generates almost all of the energy ) , so I would say that toxicity is involved as well, therefore a multitude of factors are creating this disease.
Problems with Citric acid cycle ( the one that generates almost all of the energy ) , so I would say that toxicity is involved as well, therefore a multitude of factors are creating this disease.
I agree with this and I have stated that amoxicillin, cipro (quinolines), azithromycin/erythromycin (macrolides), doxycyclene/tetracyclene, penicillin make this condition worse ....
1 month after my anti staph treatment and I still feel great .... my strength is increasing, my IBS is gone, My arthritis pain is gone, I am still sleeping well and I wake up energized .... no more brain fog and my head is clear, my memory is better .... my prostatitis symptoms have almost gone ..... there is calcification in there so it is like it is full of sand but the constant burning pain/back pain has gone ..... My partner had 10 days of keflex to prevent re-infection and I believe that was the key to total cure.
Just so everyone knows, I had no staph in my bowel ..... but removing strep did help lessen my symptoms.
Just so everyone knows, I had no staph in my bowel ..... but removing strep did help lessen my symptoms.
My bet is polysaccharides such as 20KdaPS and PIA (Polysaccharide Intercellular Adhesion) ... Found in Staph slime ....