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Open letter to the OMF--help save us canaries

frozenborderline

Senior Member
Messages
4,405
Is there anyone else here on this forum who is willing to make a video testimonial to the enviromental effects of mold and other toxins , and jusy location itself, and send it to the omf or send it to Lisa Petrison , who is no longer active in this forum but who i can send it to ?
 

frozenborderline

Senior Member
Messages
4,405
I think there's strength in numbers. I am a little upset about being blown off on this even though they mean well
 

frozenborderline

Senior Member
Messages
4,405
There are tens of thousands of people ij mold avoidance forums who meet me/cfs criteria but aren't engaged on the activist portion of it or engaged w the me/cfs community so there is not enough dialogue between these groups. And they are rightly cynical about researchers and doctors , but I try to convince them its still worth fighting to be heard because even if avoidance works itz sometimes impossible, not a great way to live, etc. Id like to have evidence to show them that researchers can change their mind on this and value patient input. But ...
 

frozenborderline

Senior Member
Messages
4,405
I feel strongly that the amount of research directed toward environmental factors has been disproportionately small , even considering the small amount of funding for research in general. Researchers are not listening to patients.
 

Rufous McKinney

Senior Member
Messages
13,389
that the infectious aspect could make one perpetually more sensitive to the enviromental aspect. I don't know exactly why this happens but in my case I had signs of mild cirs before getting a fairly straightforward, acute case of Lyme, and then without knowing it I became more reactive to mold.

Thats- just highly likely to be whats up.....My chemical sensitivities cycle with run downness, PEM, and other factors and they are not constant.

Example- in an acute run down condition from air travel...I'm unable to sleep on the sheets due to the perfume wafting out from the laundry. I am lying there, getting worse and worse and realize: I'm in a foreign country and I am experiencing acute sensitivities and WTF. I can't stay here. And I'll have to complain to the Family. And they will be insulted. And it will be awkward. and where will I find no perfume laundry soap..

3 days later- I no longer could detect the laundry perfume problem. It subsided..as I got less Acute.

I've reacted similarly to mold. And many other things. I experience phantom smells, altered tastes...
in acute states.
 

Rufous McKinney

Senior Member
Messages
13,389
I feel strongly that the amount of research directed toward environmental factors has been disproportionately small , even considering the small amount of funding for research in general.

So many confounding variables.

Food

Exposure

Geography

Water sources

buildings

Another topic thats not at all adequately being examined is- phases of ME, progression of the illness. This is critical to the disability issue-and major decisions about whether continuing to push the self to work, in fact leads to- more disability.

I think thats a topic- they are also running from funding. Why help better understand the trajectory and how to manage this mess.
 

Rufous McKinney

Senior Member
Messages
13,389
Is there anyone else here on this forum who is willing to make a video testimonial to the enviromental effects of mold and other toxins , and jusy location itself, and send it to the omf or send it to Lisa Petrison , who is no longer active in this forum but who i can send it to ?

Somebody is likely out there...mold is not on the top of my personal list....And my exposure to organophosphates...in orchards...as a child....but I have no proof...just opinions.
 

Rufous McKinney

Senior Member
Messages
13,389
Wondering if other illnesses...are being examined from the environmental angle and how that is being approached research wise.
 

frozenborderline

Senior Member
Messages
4,405
i noticed now that when you search Open medicine foundation on youtube, this is in the top ten results. maybe once it gets into the top few results, it will be addressed...
 

Diwi9

Administrator
Messages
1,780
Location
USA
@debored13 - I agree with the environmental exposure angle. It's always been curious to me that I was a teen in the Eastern Province of Saudi Arabia during Gulf War I...with lots of contact with soldiers, bases, and taking home of uniforms, camo netting...lots of crap that I set up in my bedroom. I've participated in some studies with Nancy Klimas' group, but have never visited them for an evaluation. She claims Gulf War Illness looks like ME/CFS but has a different mechanism. There is heterogeneity in the ME/CFS patient pool given we are only confirmed based on clinical presentation.
 

frozenborderline

Senior Member
Messages
4,405
@debored13 - I agree with the environmental exposure angle. It's always been curious to me that I was a teen in the Eastern Province of Saudi Arabia during Gulf War I...with lots of contact with soldiers, bases, and taking home of uniforms, camo netting...lots of crap that I set up in my bedroom. I've participated in some studies with Nancy Klimas' group, but have never visited them for an evaluation. She claims Gulf War Illness looks like ME/CFS but has a different mechanism. There is heterogeneity in the ME/CFS patient pool given we are only confirmed based on clinical presentation.
Yeah, Gulf War Syndrome is pretty interesting in how obvious the toxic exposure angle is, although hard to narrow down to just one source--sarin gas, burning trash/munitions, cyanobacteria exposure in desert crust in kuwait (a lot of people dont know you dont need water for cyano and it can be present in desert soil)

and while GWS is being explored as a separate entity there's all the ppl with me/cfs who are gulf war veterans.

Imo we should start out with no preconceived notions about what exactly the environmental thing were reacting to is... obviously i favor the mold/nanoparticle explanation but any good study should be doing epidemiology and taking mass spectrometry samples of the air to search broader than just "mold"

i think there is indeed heterogeneity but there is also surprising amount of signal that comes through the noise...
in the places that come up repeatedly as very bad on the visitors or locations rating map, very few people i know thrive there, and vice versa, although theres lots of shades of grey in the middle

examples i know of would be tucson, boston, the cities of the pacific northwest (the wilderness is supposed to be alright in that area, but when saying "pacific northwest" i basically would mean portland or seattle) or the bay area... very few people i know healing much in those places

whereas in the middle, theres lots of room for people to have different allergy triggers, or sensitivies, that makes some places good for individuals and bad for individuals, i do believe there are some objectively bad toxins in some of the areas I discuss, that are going to be bad for almost everyone and show up on a large enough sample as a consistent pattern
 

frozenborderline

Senior Member
Messages
4,405
organophosphate exposure in the mother can cause neural tube defects like chiari and tethered cord. idk if organophosphate exposure in adulthood can cause similar issues but it is interesting
 

wastwater

Senior Member
Messages
1,271
Location
uk
Maybe something in the environment is modifying genetic function then immunologically giving problems dealing with mold rather than mold being the real problem
 

frozenborderline

Senior Member
Messages
4,405
I have an idea to keep pushing this, politely but insistently.

My video comes up in YouTube searches fairly highly, but not in Google searches. If I had a domain name related to open medicine foundation, it could come up in Google searches. And then link to a video.

I'm willing to buy a domain name and provide broad strokes of content, but I'm wondering if anyone from the community would help with web design which I know exactly nothing about !
 
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frozenborderline

Senior Member
Messages
4,405
Here's a rough transcription :

I used a software to do a rough transcription of this:

Open Letter to the Open Medicine Foundation:

"I'm a severe ME/CFS patient. Um, and I wanted to make this video to the OMF about trying to get across the severity of the situation of the environmental component and why I really feel like we need, Um, despite the great work, you're already doing, you guys to step up and really strongly look into this environmental component.

Uh, and let me try and tell my story, you know, succinctly. Um. I got Lyme while also living in a moldy house, which I didn't know at the time. It was moldy. In 2016 I sort of gradually deteriorated until I ended up being bedridden. In that time, I got the diagnoses of ME/CFS from Susan Levine, um, pots, um, MCA S and eventually.

I started having these new symptoms and I got diagnosed with CCI, which as you guys know, um, means my brain STEM is being compressed because my ligaments, her legs, I have no hereditary connective tissue disorder. I've never had head trauma. And so my strong feeling is that the mold, which I think is short hand for environmental.

You know, bad stuff that we notice we're affected by is what caused this. Um, and I was experiencing episodes of like total paralysis, being unable to speak, um, or move in my house in Vermont. Um, and my sister took me across the country in the back of a van horizontal because of the CCI, because it could not have had handled train travel and did months of just like camping, which is kind of insane to do when you're this severe, but we didn't have the money for an RV or to just indefinitely stay in hotels and Airbnbs.

And the improvements are slow. I don't think it's going to heal my CCI, but at home I was, you know, raising my heart rate to like insane levels, just crawling to the bathroom and back in death Valley. Um, two or three weeks ago, I walked the length of a football field and back without my heart rate breaking 100 and now I'm here and I'm near Taos, New Mexico. Questa and what I just said might sound like, you know, a total success story, but you know, this lifestyle is, it's insane. I don't think we can keep it up. And yet it's one of the only things that has helped us. So that's why we desperately, desperately need researchers to look into the environmental aspect of like the location's effect on our health.

And my story is not uncommon. And the connection to CCI shows that this is not a zero sum thing. This is, um. You know, they might be really deeply intertwined. Um, there's studies that show mycotoxins and mast cell activation can degrade collagen. Um, so I'm just, I'm not sure if we can keep doing this lifestyle, even though it's the only thing that has helped me with our financial resources.

It's, it's totally cold here. Um. We had bad luck in this. Um, Airbnb actually isn't good. It's moldy. Um, and there are just so many things about this lifestyle that are really difficult. I caught some kind of bug. Um, and, uh, that makes things harder. So I've dipped down a little since the improvement I talked about.

Um, so in short, I think that. Unless someone looks into the whatever environmental aspect to this disease there is. Um, and like the epidemiology, including like the cluster outbreaks and how they were geographically contained within certain areas. Until someone does that, I think people are going to die.

They're going to not be able to do this lifestyle. I wouldn't consider myself lucky because we don't have the financial resources for like an RV or something, but I'm still luckier than a lot of people in that I had a caregiver willing to drive me across the country. Um. So please look into this, or people will die.

That's basically my message and that sounds aggressive, but, um, you know, I'm out here shivering and Taos, and I'd rather just, you know. Have a cure for this component of the illness. Um, even though it's beautiful, as you can see, um, this isn't about sight seeing. It's about survival. And, uh, thank you very much."
 
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frozenborderline

Senior Member
Messages
4,405
Transcription of the video entitled "what if I'm right"

transcription of another one:
"what if I'm right"

"This one is really short because I'm really worn out after I'm doing these other videos, um, and feeling pretty awful. But, um, I wanted to try and be really succinct in getting across, um, an urgent message about looking into environmental factors in ME/ CFS. And so I want to say to ME/ CFS researchers
what I, um, said to my parents when I was arguing with them about this, um, about us being maybe canaries in the coal mine for, um, or sentinels for, um, environmental changes, environmental, bad environmental changes. Um, um, maybe first in line for a human extinction. And what I said to them, um, and what I think is a really simple message is, what if I'm right?

You know, you don't have to assume I'm right, but what if I am right. That this is happening and you're not doing anything about it. I mean, like, if there are nonlinear cascading environmental effects that I'm like, Erik Johnson has suggested, make mold way more pathogenic, but also maybe make it more prevalent.

Um, just make the biome more messed up. Um, and we're canaries for that. And then let's step back and not just assume its mold, but that there's something [known unknown] in the environment that we're sensitive to that's devastating. Us and ME/ CFS patients are canaries for it, or are the first test subjects or, um, the first humans to go extinct maybe.

Um. What's the worst case scenario, if I'm right and you don't look into it, and then what's the worst case scenario, if I'm wrong, and you dont look into it? Um, I think the worst case scenario, if I'm right and I don't want to be right, is that this problem will grow exponentially, and that. Lots of people won't be able to be in a healthy environment and, um, won't be able to do all this stuff, and they'll die.

They'll kill themselves. They'll get so sick that they cannot be moved. Um, and if I'm wrong, I'm really happy to be wrong. And if it's, if it's all genetic, and if some like niche gene therapy cures all of this, and if there's nothing going wrong in the environment that's causing this disease, I'm happy to lose that bet.

But right now, I'm really betting that I'm right and I want you to think about what if I'm right."