Multiple binders

[ljimbo423]

Holy shit! I think that amount would finish me off! Are you taking it for mould specifically, and have you seen any benefit? Have you been able to increase the dose over time?

I'm not taking it for mold, I'm taking it to mop up toxins in my gut, specifically excess lipopolysaccharides, from gut dysbiosis.

I do feel better taking it and I often still notice improvements in my energy within a half hour or so after taking it. I started off with a very low dose, I think maybe around 100 mg and worked my way up to over 3 grams but that took quite a while.

What made me go so slowly in increasing the dose wasn't herxing, it's because taking almost any supplement causes my anxiety to go through the roof.

 

[seamyb]

@hb8847 I think we can both agree that there is no loss of machismo from splitting the caps and doing every few days. Obviously compared to Jimbo there is, but I think us mortals need to respect the carbon.

Well from what I read the charcoal is only good for ochratoxin. Bentonite is good for all the rest but not ochra. So, the combination covers a wide base.

This reaction happened to me before but I didn't realise it because I'm never disciplined with starting and stopping things.

And I agree, there's a sense of camaraderie with going through a herx together

 

[hb8847]

I'm not taking it for mold, I'm taking it to mop up toxins in my gut, specifically excess lipopolysaccharides, from gut dysbiosis.

I do feel better taking it and I often still notice improvements in my energy within a half hour or so after taking it. I started off with a very low dose, I think maybe around 100 mg and worked my way up to over 3 grams but that took quite a while.

Thanks Jim, good to know. Maybe it's also getting rid of bad stuff other than mould toxins in my case too. I'm not sure I can envisage a day I'll ever be able to take your amount but gotta just keep plugging away at it I guess!

 

[seamyb]

From Nathan's website, or a talk he did, can't remember. But it's from him.

 

[hb8847]

Well from what I read the charcoal is only good for ochratoxin. Bentonite is good for all the rest but not ochra. So, the combination covers a wide base.

Interesting, where did you read this? This is what Nathan says in his book:

■ Ochratoxins appear to be bound best by cholestyramine, Welchol, and activated charcoal.
■ Aflatoxins are bound by activated charcoal and bentonite clay.
■ Trichothecenes are bound by activated charcoal and possibly other binders. Chlorella and bentonite clay appear to be useful, but the medical literature is limited.
■ Gliotoxins are bound by bentonite clay, Saccharomyces boulardii (a probiotic yeast), and N-acetyl cysteine (NAC).

Edit: Don't worry just read your reply. Bentonite and Charcoal does seem a good mix.

 

[seamyb]

I had a really good period a week or two after I crashed last time. I'm gonna try that and see do I get the same response.

And last time I crashed it was a few days after I stopped it. I wonder if it's the stopping after a while of taking it that causes the bad crash.

Either way, I'm treating it like glutathione now. A tiny amount is probably very significant.

 

[seamyb]

And yes, my statement on charcoal should have been "I'm only taking it for the ochratoxin because it's the only one not covered by bentonite."

 

[hb8847]

Did you ever get your mycotoxin levels checked? Are you considering it?

 

[seamyb]

Did you ever get your mycotoxin levels checked? Are you considering it?

No and yes.

I started all the iodine and stuff and thought by the time I get round to testing all my mycotoxins will be gone. What a fool.

My only concern really is the distance my sample has to travel. I'm not sure how the quality of the test degrades with time spent in transit.

 

[hb8847]

No and yes.

I started all the iodine and stuff and thought by the time I get round to testing all my mycotoxins will be gone. What a fool.

My only concern really is the distance my sample has to travel. I'm not sure how the quality of the test degrades with time spent in transit.

Gotcha.

For what it's worth, I had mine done with Biolab, who then send it off to the States to this address:

"Testing performed by The Great Plains Laboratory, Inc., Lenexa, Kansas."

I think Biolab and Great Plains are both part of the same company. I think you're only able to get a mycotoxin test through a doctor, I did with mine at the time (Dr Lulsegged). I subsequently reached out to Biolab for some names of other practitioners who use their services a while ago, they were pretty helpful from what I recall.

Regarding the test itself, it's a urine sample taken midstream from the first pee of the day. I've not read anything about samples degrading over time, at least mine certainly don't seem to have been reduced - several of my markers were way over the normal range.

 

[seamyb]

I had mine done with Biolab

Yea same one I was looking at.

I think you're only able to get a mycotoxin test through a doctor

That's what put me off! I absolutely hate when people are abusive to medical professionals, or anybody in their line of work for that matter, but I can guarantee that having that conversation with my doctor would lead to a rage I could not control. "Is my approach of doing fuck all and hoping you go away not good enough?" I'm getting angry just thinking about it lol.

Maybe I'll get in touch with them and tell them my doctor left me in charge and remind them I'm not trying to get opiates.

 

[hb8847]

Haha. Yes maybe email them and ask, they were pretty helpful with me.

 

[seamyb]

How you feeling now @hb8847? I'm definitely over the worst of it.

 

[hb8847]

Nah still very full on. I don't think I'm going to do Charcoal again for a while, this has been just too much. Reckon I'll try doing the Bentonite for a bit as I seem to be able to handle that a bit better, then look to add Charcoal at a later date. I guess it's a positive that the Herx means I must need it and it must be working, just difficult to keep telling yourself that when you're feeling so shit.

 

[seamyb]

Nah still very full on. I don't think I'm going to do Charcoal again for a while, this has been just too much. Reckon I'll try doing the Bentonite for a bit as I seem to be able to handle that a bit better, then look to add Charcoal at a later date. I guess it's a positive that the Herx means I must need it and it must be working, just difficult to keep telling yourself that when you're feeling so shit.

Ah crap, that's no good. Hope you pull out of it soon. I slept 11 hours last night so I'm still feeling it, it's just not as torturous as it was yesterday.

I think that's exactly what I'm gonna do too. Try the bentonite clay for a bit and then add charcoal (although who knows, I might even react badly to the clay). One possible thing to consider is the overlapping mycotoxins mopped up by the two... could this have had a compounding effect? I think we should use very small amounts of everything. Another possible reason for me feeling better is the glutathione, but I know our experiences differ with this.

Hope you feel better soon.

 

[hb8847]

Cheers pal, likewise. Let me know how you get on.

 

[Rufous McKinney]

I am starting a New

I am starting Proteolytic Enzymes. FIRST. before I try charcoal or lymph cleanse herbs.

and the reminder to drink water.

 

[seamyb]

I am starting a New

I am starting Proteolytic Enzymes. FIRST. before I try charcoal or lymph cleanse herbs.

and the reminder to drink water.

Go slow on the binders Rufous. Think weeks and months to build up to significant doses. The level of ill they can make you is ridiculous!

 

[hb8847]

Best of luck Rufous.

Re the glutathione @seamyb , yes on the day I took it last week it seemed to help initially, but then the following day my MCAS was worse and I had really bad brain fog. It's an antioxidant so in theory it should help your immune system and reduce a Herx reaction, for me though it just has other side effects which make it intolerable. Perhaps it mobilises the immune system beyond what I can handle.

 

[seamyb]

but then the following day my MCAS was worse and I had really bad brain fog.

I had difficulty with glutathione too. But it seems to be the case that keeping at it with low doses has enabled me to tolerate it. Started off with tiny doses throughout the day and then was able to take larger amounts, although I'm still taking relatively small doses. Can't guarantee this would work for you though.

Sometimes I take something else which puts me back into a state where I can't tolerate it any more. It's very strange.