The Undetectable Infection

[gregh286]

Hi @gregh286, thanks for posting your results. I think it's unclear to all of us how to fix this. I will just say that I am very concerned by results we've seen after the gut has been nuked with antibiotics.

Yea..true thanks. I think its evident I need to reduce Bacteriodes and increase bifidos.
This is pre-anti biotic and probiotics.
After the 3 month treatment should be interesting to see how it looks

 

[Elph68]

Yea..true thanks. I think its evident I need to reduce Bacteriodes and increase bifidos.
This is pre-anti biotic and probiotics.
After the 3 month treatment should be interesting to see how it looks

Just on this Greg, B Fragialis is one of the biggest producers of D lactate of all the species.

D lactate production creates a perpetual motion device ...... When D lactate is predominant, more D lactate is produced by all species which results in a lower colonic PH and more bad bacteria resulting in more D lactate .....

 

[gregh286]

Just on this Greg, B Fragialis is one of the biggest producers of D lactate of all the species.

D lactate production creates a perpetual motion device ...... When D lactate is predominant, more D lactate is produced by all species which results in a lower colonic PH and more bad bacteria resulting in more D lactate .....

Cheers elph.
i have way too much bacteroides and parabacteroides.
i think the only way to lower the lactate response is to withdraw carbohydrate so they cant ferment.
can they still produce lactate with zero carbs??

 

[Seven7]

@Elph68 @Mark37
I came to the same conclusion about kefir colonics, do You have a good suggestion on a protocol.
2) Kefir water Vs Milk kefir. Which would be better.
3) If you have leaky gut can the colonics do any harm????

 

[Mark37]

Hi Mark,

I pushed so hard I have been in a legal battle with several medical people including the local pathology lab that have accused me with defamation .... As well as being forced into 'counselling' for being obsessive ....

Not sure if this suits you but I believe phage therapy offers the best chance of beating this .... AND it can be used on children. The cost is about $6k US for the preperation of the treatment, about $4k per person for treatment, plus airfares and accommodation for 2 to 4 weeks in Georgia (Europe) depending on how we use it.

It takes 2 weeks to develop the specific phages and we can then either stay for another 2 weeks to have it administered, or send the solution back to Aus to be administered here. I have checked with customs and phage solution is ok to be imported to AUS as long as it is for the person using it, and there is less than 3 months supply.

In order for this therapy to work we need to know exactly what bacteria to go after, the only way we can do that here in Australia, is with a stool test from Bioscreen and then it is a bit of an educated guess as to what is in the prostate.

Phage therapy has been used successfully to cure chronic enterococcus faecalis prostatitis, which is like viridans strep prostatitis .... almost impossible to cure as they act in the same way .... biofilms, calcification, organic acids, hydrogen peroxide and hydrogen sulphide etc.Enterococcus prostatitis is detectable, mixed viridans strep prostatitis is not ...

The phage people don't know enough about this, but have listened to my theories and believe they can come up with a solution that will work ..... They just need to know exactly what bacteria we want them to go after, so they can isolate the strains and match phages to kill them. If we could find a lab that would isolate the bacteria for us here in Australia, we could send them the live bacteria and they could develop the solution without us travelling there.

We still need to replace the bad bugs we take out with good live bacteria.

I would be very surprised Mark if Streptococcus sanguinis/parasanguinis isn't involved.

I am happy for you to call me if you wish to discuss: 0419 140 088

Cheers.

Thanks Darren, looks like a genuine solution. I discussed with my partner last night and will look into further. Plus the fda won't approve it, another promising sign.

I will call you, thanks for posting your number. After hundreds hours researching this nightmare, this thread is the first time I've ever posted anything in my life.

Mark

 

[Mark37]

@Elph68 @Mark37
I came to the same conclusion about kefir colonics, do You have a good suggestion on a protocol.
2) Kefir water Vs Milk kefir. Which would be better.
3) If you have leaky gut can the colonics do any harm????

Hi Inester

Elph is doing it, l'm planning it, so please keep that in mind. I will use milk kefir grains with chamomile tea and slippery elm.

I ate loads of water kefir grains,which brought on intense gut pain and the runs. I was happy with this result and felt better,more regular stool passag afterwards.

Dom, who is unequivocally a kefir legend in this area believes milk kefir grains to be superior. I will again try to post his protocol.

Mark

 

[Elph68]

@Elph68 @Mark37
I came to the same conclusion about kefir colonics, do You have a good suggestion on a protocol.
2) Kefir water Vs Milk kefir. Which would be better.
3) If you have leaky gut can the colonics do any harm????

Hi Inester,
I am on my own so I have found a turkey baster to be the best form of delivery ... and it is better doing it at night before bed as it takes the pressure off it wanting to come back out. Lay on the left side and I have found about 150mls is tolerable. The first few days created a lot of gurgling, gas etc. but it is all good now .... and my stools no longer burn.

The best I can figure .... need to do it every day for at least a couple of months.

The kefir grains do contain more bacteria than the milk/water ..... so make sure some grains get in there too ... or at least eat them.

Personally, I am using milk ..... milk contains other goodies and this protocol has supressed my carb cravings.

I haven't been able to find any negatives as yet, I am sure somebody here will put some forward .... Some of the bacteria in kefir, like lactobacillus rhamnosus are known to help fix leaky gut.

It is just trial and error really .... the difference with this probiotic is about live bacteria and volume reaching the lower gut which makes a difference to any other probiotic.

Right now after all the treatment (apart from this prostate that started it all), I have some lingering lack of energy issues, still have some peripheral neuopathy (although nowhere near as bad), and some short term memory and word recall issues and pretty much every single joint cracks .... Not sure how much of this is just from getting older and how much is from what I have been through .... I am about 90% to what I would expect to be normal. I go to the gym almost every day and I have been now for 4 months, I sleep well, I need a lot less and I feel rested after sleep.

I am pretty happy with my improvement ....

 

[Elph68]

Thanks Darren, looks like a genuine solution. I discussed with my partner last night and will look into further. Plus the fda won't approve it, another promising sign.

I will call you, thanks for posting your number. After hundreds hours researching this nightmare, this thread is the first time I've ever posted anything in my life.

Mark

Hey Mark,
I am really glad you stopped by .... I have felt a lot like a loan crusader at times.

I reckon by putting our heads together we can get right to the bottom of this and come up with a solution that works for at least a subgroup of people, and fix this cricket ball up my clacker .....

I look forward to hearing from you.

Cheers.

 

[Mark37]

Hello mods, please pass this .

Preparing Kefir-Grains for Rectal Retained Injection
What You need:
1 tsp Slippery Elm bark powder (Ulmus fulva). Optional but highly recommended.

1 to 2 Tbs fresh Kefir-Grains [strained from kefir and rinsed with cold fresh water to remove any milk protein deposit from the surface of the grains].

1/4 cup warm freshly prepared Chamomile tea, or Neem leaf tea. Or 1/4 cup fresh Aloe Vera gel prepared by removing the outer green skin with a potato peeler or filleting knife. You want just the clear inner gel portion of the Aloe leaf without any brown gel found just beneath the out dark green skin of the leaf. Do not use any preserved Aloe Vera, it must be freshly harvested.

100 to 250ml [1/2 to 1-cup] Douching bottle or 25 to 50ml syringe for rectal injections.

If you have frozen milk kefir-grains, thaw by placing a bag of frozen culture in 1 cup fresh water for 10 minutes. Remove kefir grains from the bag when ready to use and keep in a clean cup.
Blend kefir grains with warm tea or Aloe Vera gel and slippery elm bark powder to mix well and form a thick emulsion or gel, but not so thick."

 

[Mark37]

This site is an excellent (albeit at times convoluted) source on kefir :

http://users.sa.chariot.net.au/~dna/IBD/

 

[gregh286]

Hi guys.
please excuse my ignornance on this one. I know nothing about kefir...especially rectally.
what is the big advantage of it.....how do you know it will populate lower gut into correct bacteria?
Is it the probiotic champ?
Sorry for the questions i just never got involved in the whole kefir thing on any forums.

 

[Mark37]

Hi guys.
please excuse my ignornance on this one. I know nothing about kefir...especially rectally.
what is the big advantage of it.....how do you know it will populate lower gut into correct bacteria?
Is it the probiotic champ?
Sorry for the questions i just never got involved in the whole kefir thing on any forums.

Hi Greg

At the beginning of this year l began drinking kefir water, kefir milk and kombucha.

I've read some remarkable success stories about relieving and curing loads of chronic ailments and disease. Who knows how much these wild life forces played a role, but why not try? They possess their own unique beneficial bacteria and yeast strains that are said to improve our health in many ways.

l can verify reduced sweet cravings, feeling more satiated throughout the day, better digestion and more stamina.
I believe it's helped relieve some anxiety also.

The origins of kefir and how it got to Russia is interesting. The Russians are said to supply a glass for every child arriving at school who might like/need it. Affordable insurance policy for reducing national health care. This approach is polar opposite to multinational death food vending machines, at kids schools in some other countries.

Anyway, I stopped drinking water kefir grains (they're different to milk) as I've never been comfortable with the amount of potential sugar left from the brew. It's said to be tiny. I doubt it's possible to ascertain, a hydromoter will only confirm any booze produced (usually insignificant). They're also the most high maintenance of the three cultured drinks, which when you're often knackered/brain fogged etc it can become a further pain in the ass .

However you may wish to brew for the grains alone, big numbers can be produced rapidly; they're an affordable unique prebiotic.

My path has been research based, trial and error and being as disciplined as possible. Fermented drinks are definitely part of the total solution for me. Kefir milk (goat) is my numero uno and the least maintenance in keeping supply. Raw milk is supposed to be best, but l can't access it.
Yet.

Rectally injected saved Dom and others from ulcerative colitis.

He and others have mentioned it as a way for women to treat bacterial/yeast vaginosis also.

I doubt oral abx/herbs/probiotics can get to where l need them in strong/effective enough doses to overcome or manage the bastardos

Resistant starch may be the course l take first.

If you have energy/time to make cultured foods/beverages then Sandor katz "art of fermentation" is an excellent resource also.

Please check the bottom page of the kefir link l posted earlier, there's links to a treausure trove of information pertaining to origin, breakdown of bacterias and yeasts, how to make, making kefir krout, etc.

Cheers
Mark

 

[Seven7]

@Mark37 What country are you??? I did the same Kambusha and Kefir milk until I found out that in USA u cannot get real kefir milk. So I would need to do myself. I am looking into it.

 

[Mark37]

@Mark37 What country are you??? I did the same Kambusha and Kefir milk until I found out that in USA u cannot get real kefir milk. So I would need to do myself. I am looking into it.

@Mark37 What country are you??? I did the same Kambusha and Kefir milk until I found out that in USA u cannot get real kefir milk. So I would need to do myself. I am looking into it.

Hey Inester
I live in Australia. I ordered all three from Dom in south Australia and l believe he'll send to anywhere in the world. I asked them questions before l purchased, they were prompt and informative.
Yes, REAL grains, no packet/made up crap - l reckon the milk grains should transit ok, after a couple of batches they really reactivate. I hope you're able to get the right stuff.
My kombucha didn't turn out too well so l went elsewhere and all's well now.
Mark

 

[Mark37]

So I would need to do myself. I am looking into it.[/QUOTE]

Oh, check Sandor katz website, he has referenced Dom previously, as he lives in the US, l'm sure his blog/site will have info helpful to you on local access to grains.

Btw l don't believe these alone will cure me, but they are healing and definitely an effective component in my long term arsenal of weapons.

 

[Elph68]

I just thought that this paper might be beneficial given the current conversation.

http://hkjpaed.org/pdf/2006;11;246-254.pdf

Basically people with short bowel syndrome develop CFS symptoms ... But it is called short bowel syndrome.

To cut a long story short they identified D-Lactate as the main culprit, and use vancomycin followed by probiotics supplied by yakult, that being lactobacillus casei and bifidobacterium bereve with GOS (prebiotic) to treat D-lactate because it has been successfully used before .....

Even talks about how mitochondria damage AND/OR interference from other organic acids prevents the breakdown of D-lactate in the body ..... Even says why D-lactate levels aren't detectable by normal assay ....

Anyway ... Thought it would be of interest to those who are interested ....

 

[gregh286]

Thanks elph.
i got my d lactate measured at kdm clinic.
2.5nmol against median control .84 nmol.
therefore i have x3 more d lactate than your average cat.
If anyone can source b.breve yakult let me know. Googled it lots and cant get a load of it.
L. Casei easily found in uk.
class article.
Chronic high d lactate i think causing our system major issues. I think it causes red cell abnormality and poor small capillary penetration as body closing up small vessels to protect organs from lactate.
and we all know what happens in poor blood flow.and circulation....numbness...tingling....brain fog....pem...

 

[Elph68]

Hi Greg,

It has always been my belief that this is the underlying cause of our problems, and is the total problem in at least 50% of people with CFS.

Before I cop flack, I also wish to say that I believe the rest have complications from heavy metals, toxins, retroviruses, herpes, other viruses, Lyme etc. (and anything I have missed) which results in the more severe symptoms.

LTA I believe is the organic acid which everybody has overlooked, hydrogen sulphide and hydrogen peroxide also play a part. .... All I know is that all the literature talks about LPS and its possible link to CFS inflammations and CNS issues ...... LTA is much, much worse. And it has been sitting there in my signature block since I started here.

The medical profession just needs to start doing the right tests .....

I reckon lactobacillus GG and any L-lactate bifidobacterium will also work .... Streptococcus thermophillus is another good one .......

 

[Elph68]

Just further on that yakult thing ....

Whenever I travel through Asia (which is regularly) I drank yakult at least 3 times a day .... Always felt good .... Should have taken more notice ......

 

[gregh286]

Hi elph.
yes will try and source a breve only probio.
certainly continous high dlactate could not.do anyone any good.
i mean very high levels can be medical emergency....its taken very seriously.
i think it plays havoc.with our blood.and.cardio system.
i took an awful dip on vsl3 last week.
hence not all probios are.created equal. Targeted probio is necessary.
bicarb.soda and strong lemon water should help alleviate the acid by alkalising....then carb restriction.
closing in on this b***ard.
good stuff elph