The shot gun approach- mitochondrial/ methylation/ antoxidants

[Sherlock]

btw, I see cordyceps also being used now for PWO recovery

 

[Allyson]

Thanks so much for all that info Sherlock; fascinating about the Gi and insulin
yes I can see that pic thanks - so.... dissolve Creatoine very well in boiling water and stir well ....and even then it won t all dissolve....
I am finding creatine SOO helpful- my sleep has improved out of sight since taking it too.
Slept right through the last 2 nights with no hard drugs...bliss.

but i was tright about the gelatine ...i discarded all the mepyt caps into a coffee mug and iwithin a day or two had nearly a mugful of gelatine that I would have ingested ...and i am sure the preservatives in it keep me awake
thanks agin for the info


here's to a cure! in our lifetime!

 

[Allyson]

btw, I see cordyceps also being used now for PWO recovery

yes i see this abbout it

• Increases energy level. In ancient China Cordyceps Sinensis has initially been used as a energy tonic. Cordyceps increases the cellular ATP level and oxygen utilization, which leads to a real increase in actual energy that is available for use.

but it looks like it is expensive is it?

 

[Allyson]

Heaps, thanks, I think you are right with the protein vs carb bit but I don't think stomach temp will dissolve something that is hard to dissolve; Yes it takes quite a bit of mixing even with boiling water to dissolve creatine.

And i have noted if i take mey 101,000 meds with hot water they seem to work more efficiently and quickly - I esp notice this with anything for sleep

because putting cold water into your stomach is going to cool down your stomach temp, then you have to bring that temp up to body temp,and even that is is not very hot really.

Chinese medicine says you should never drink anything cold - should sip on warm water...and ice cream is anathema ......for reasons I have forgotten now.

 

[Allyson]

As for me, if I don't get the expected water weight gain then I think the creatine was wasted. Strength will not improve otherwise. As far as other effects, such as in the brain? I don't know.
[/media]

sherlock I dont think you need weight gain to improve your strenght - or even muscle bulk
i think creatine works to improve the ATP cycle so an increase in muscle bulk would not be needed
our muscles look normal but are not working properly
so even if someone with ME bulk up with weighlifting they are not goind to cure their ME
I know it did nt for me in 3 years of exercise .... i looked fit and toned but was still usually unable to get out of bed except to push mysefl to go to the gym every night.!!!

 

[RustyJ]

wow, there creatine is cheap $14 for 1000grams

Hi heaps, I can't see any shipping costs on this site. iHerb seem to have pretty good shipping prices. Creatine has me intrigued. May give it a go.

I note NOW creatine at iHerb is not too bad at $21: http://www.iherb.com/Now-Foods-Sports-Creatine-Monohydrate-100-Pure-Powder-2-2-lbs-1-kg/535

Unless other supps are cheaper at Beyond, I still think it might be cheaper at iHerb when you bundle everything in the one order, shipping cost-wise, I mean. I will check other costs out.

 

[Sherlock]

sherlock I dont think you need weight gain to improve your strenght - or even muscle bulk
i think creatine works to improve the ATP cycle so an increase in muscle bulk would not be needed
our muscles look normal but are not working properly
so even if someone with ME bulk up with weighlifting they are not goind to cure their ME
I know it did nt for me in 3 years of exercise .... i looked fit and toned but was still usually unable to get out of bed except to push mysefl to go to the gym every night.!!!

well, for strength I was using the measure of a 1 rep max lift, or even doubles or triples. You already have enough ATP stored for that burst of effort.

Each muscle cell can only fire all-or-nothing. So improving strength generally means that you are increasing the number of muscle cells that are recruited into that effort. It's a neurological training thing. But once you've maxed out your strength, you can't get any stronger unless you add muscle mass - which means adding more myofibrils into the existing number of muscle cells. Round and round it goes.

I agree with you 100% that our muscles aren't working properly. I find that varies according to how sick I am at any given time. When I'm much sicker than usual, I find that I even gets DOMs from relatively light exercise. Maybe it's from lactic acid buildup.

Cordyceps powder, $7.75 for 100g http://www.beyond-a-century.com/Cordyceps-Powder-100-Grams_p_442.html

Shipping AFAIK is $5 flat rate and there are no good shipping coupons this month. But I doubt I'd try that, I'm going to try baking soda (as an anti-lactic-acid) soon though for possible improvement in cardio.

Thanks for relaying your exercise experiences. I think exercise is what keeps me out of the abyss, plus has given gradual improvement (without being a cure as you say).

 

[Sherlock]

Unless other supps are cheaper at Beyond, I still think it might be cheaper at iHerb when you bundle everything in the one order, shipping cost-wise, I mean. I will check other costs out.

Hi, Rusty. Can you buy from Amazon?
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0013OUOBM/ref=rcxsubs_dp_chrt?ie=UTF8&m=ATVPDKIKX0DER
600g $12.34 delivered. I've learned to always check at Amazon for subscribe&save, sometimes that pays off.

It's NOW brand, probably there are 2 or 3 Creatine Monohydrate makers in the world and it just gets bought by various sellers including BAC.

Amazon used to be good for buying whey, but no longer.

 

[Sherlock]

Slept right through the last 2 nights...bliss.

Amen to sleep being bliss. Creatine hasn't helped with my sleep AFAIK. What is your idea on why it helps you?

But... I often postpone weightlifting until the PM hoping that it will help in prolonging sleep.

 

[RustyJ]

Hi, Rusty. Can you buy from Amazon?
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0013OUOBM/ref=rcxsubs_dp_chrt?ie=UTF8&m=ATVPDKIKX0DER
600g $12.34 delivered. I've learned to always check at Amazon for subscribe&save, sometimes that pays off.

It's NOW brand, probably there are 2 or 3 Creatine Monohydrate makers in the world and it just gets bought by various sellers including BAC.

Amazon used to be good for buying whey, but no longer.

Hi Sherlock. Can't get the free delivery to Aust, unfortunately. May also be difficulties with Amazon delivering supps, from memory.

 

[heapsreal]

Hi Sherlock. Can't get the free delivery to Aust, unfortunately. May also be difficulties with Amazon delivering supps, from memory.

Rust i think iherb looks like the best priced for creatine. Some its hard to find postage until u order it etc Jarrows 1 kg for $20 from iherb is the go.

cheers!!!

 

[heapsreal]

here in oz i just bought creatine from the chemisy warehouse for $30 x 750grams, thats probably the best price i can find locally, but my next iherb order will be jarrows creatine.

cheers!!!

 

[RustyJ]

Rust i think iherb looks like the best priced for creatine. Some its hard to find postage until u order it etc Jarrows 1 kg for $20 from iherb is the go.

cheers!!!

Yep, saw it just after I posted about the NOW, but too tired to note it. Ta.

 

[RustyJ]

Anyone investigated glycocyamine - a precursor of creatine with a higher oral bioavailability and is more efficiently converted in the liver to creatine? Seems to be very difficult to find a supplier.

About glycocyamine

 

[Allyson]

well, for strength I was using the measure of a 1 rep max lift, or even doubles or triples. You already have enough ATP stored for that burst of effort.
Cordyceps powder, $7.75 for 100g http://www.beyond-a-century.com/Cordyceps-Powder-100-Grams_p_442.html

Shipping AFAIK is $5 flat rate and there are no good shipping coupons this month. But I doubt I'd try that, I'm going to try baking soda (as an anti-lactic-acid) soon though for possible improvement in cardio.

Thanks for relaying your exercise experiences. I think exercise is what keeps me out of the abyss, plus has given gradual improvement (without being a cure as you say).

thanks for useful reply sherlock
I take sodi bic every nite before bed now to counteract any reflux as I think that wakes me sometime and that seems to help a lot ....about a teaspoon in a small glass of water
yes i find exercse in the evening helps me sleep
best of all is an aquaerobics class - water pressure boosts blood volume and soothing motion of water all seems to help
next best is the horizontal parts of a body pump class
followed by a spa or swim in warm pool if possible
or a warm bath

 

[Allyson]

Hi heaps, I can't see any shipping costs on this site. iHerb seem to have pretty good shipping prices. Creatine has me intrigued. May give it a go.

I note NOW creatine at iHerb is not too bad at $21: http://www.iherb.com/Now-Foods-Sports-Creatine-Monohydrate-100-Pure-Powder-2-2-lbs-1-kg/535

Unless other supps are cheaper at Beyond, I still think it might be cheaper at iHerb when you bundle everything in the one order, shipping cost-wise, I mean. I will check other costs out.

yes Dr teitelbaum claims creatine is very helpful
for me it has been amazing
has not got me up yet but i am not crashing so much
and I am defintely sleeping better with it
last 2-3 nites i slept through all night long....amazing.
not 100 per cent tho
[i really think drinking HOT water when you wake up in the night helps too ...free and easy]
you need a loading dose of creatine and i have not been on it long so looking forward to long term benefits
last thing that had this much impact was d ribose which teitelbaum aslo recommended
oh and vit b12 helped my sleep amazingly
I would also like oxygen at home as that helped me alot the times i tried it
wish fairy are you reading?

 

[Allyson]

Amen to sleep being bliss. Creatine hasn't helped with my sleep AFAIK. What is your idea on why it helps you?

.

I don t know whybut
vit b12 imporved th depth of my sleep
then the creatine lengthened it i think
it could be a cumulative effect of the b 12 but i am liking the creatine for lots of reasons

i have treic heaps of things over last few years that do not work at all like 5htp, sublingual b12 etc etc so I do not think this is placebo

the creatine improves my feeling within a few hours of taking it
i am wary ot daking things close to bed so took it early
but when i took later dose too minus the gel caps it seemed to help my sleep
teitelbaum claims d ribose helps sleep and i have never found that but i take it weith the creatine at nite
i was taking d ribose at nite anyway tho with no effect
will keep you updated, just annoyed i didnt find it - creatine - sooner

but then again some things dont work for every one
eg some people d ribose has no effect on

 

[heapsreal]

yes Dr teitelbaum claims creatine is very helpful
for me it has been amazing
has not got me up yet but i am not crashing so much
and I am defintely sleeping better with it
last 2-3 nites i slept through all night long....amazing.
not 100 per cent tho
[i really think drinking HOT water when you wake up in the night helps too ...free and easy]
you need a loading dose of creatine and i have not been on it long so looking forward to long term benefits
last thing that had this much impact was d ribose which teitelbaum aslo recommended
oh and vit b12 helped my sleep amazingly
I would also like oxygen at home as that helped me alot the times i tried it
wish fairy are you reading?

i think the loading phase is now debatable from what ihave read, they say if u use the same dose from the start you will reach saturation point within a short time anyway. They saythe idea of a loading phase was that the supplement companies sold more??? but many say they do better with a loading phase. I use 5 grams twice a day, they say the body produces approx 3 grams a day, so u could see how using 5 grams a day would reach saturation point quite quickly.

Last few days only when exercising i have noticed a drop in energy, i wonder if this is because i have stopped the ribose. I will be putting an order in for ribose again soon so we will see. otherwise my other cfs symptoms have beengood, just the reduced energy when exercising. Time to be careful.

cheers!!!

 

[Rand56]

D-ribose had no effect on me either. Too expensive of a supplement for me to continue with it. I assumed since it didn't have any effect, waiting to see if it would have an effect would be pointless since I'm assuming if one were to have an effect, it would be more immediate.

 

[Rand56]

Talking about creatine, I found this interesting.....

" Sam-e is also involved in the production of creatine, which in turn is phosphorylated to phosphocreatine using adenosine triphosphate."

http://www.tribulusterrestrisextract.com/sam-e.html

Can one assume, and lets say for depression, that if someone was trying SAM-e for depression, could one possibly have a better therapeutic effect if they were taking some creatine along with the SAM-e? On the surface, one can maybe assume they would have a synergistic effect, but I'm not knowledgeable enough in biochemistry to know if in this case, 1+1=2.

I have taken both before, but if I recall correctly, not at the same time. I had no antidepressant effect even at high doses of SAM-e, which needless to say got very expensive.