The Lightening Process. Does it work? If so then how?

[Undisclosed]

I wish I had enough money to attend the course. I would pretend to be a model subject -- easily brainwashed. I would then proceed to write up an article on everything that went on -- anonymously. Phil would be very disappointed in me today because I am 'doing' lots of pain.

 

[Calathea]

And you can't really legally prove that someone has ME, let alone that it's worsened, which probably protects them from lawsuits.

 

[Ambrosia_angel]

@Kina I'd love to do it too and try it out. It costs so much though. I still can't get over the fact that anyone could be doing ME. Also most of the positive testimonials seem to be from trained LP practitioners who said they had ME before and any blogs seems to go as far as advertising the LP? Seems really fishy to me.
Still searching the internet to find the reputable testimonials.

 

[Calathea]

Are there any undercover journalists with chronic illnesses who could go in, I wonder? Preferably with hidden cameras?

 

[Undisclosed]

Are there any undercover journalists with chronic illnesses who could go in, I wonder? Preferably with hidden cameras?

Problem is the journalist could brainwashed and write a glowing report about LP and the article could be titled -- "LP -- how to stop patients from 'doing ME' when CBT fails to work on them"

 

[Calathea]

I suspect you're OK if you go in knowing exactly what they will try and how to fake it for them. Obviously they try to screen those people out, but if you're making a big effort, you could pretend to be their ideal victim - er, patient. I don't think it's that culty.

The real problem is that I wouldn't want someone with real ME to risk this, it'd be too damaging.

 

[Dster]

Hi I'm hoping people can shed some light on how the lightening process works. I've come across so many things about it and a lot seem to be positive considering its not a physical(correct me if I'm wrong) treatment. But I can't seem to find anything about what actually happens while people are doing it. The only thing I seem to relate it to is hypnotherapy?

Also is it worth it? I'd do anything to improve my health even if it possible means having to go through a junk of bad treatments too. Has anyone here done it? If so then what's your advice?

Thanks for all the replies. I didn't expect so many. This is obviously a problem in the cfs/me community. I didn't actually realize it was directly advertised at cfs patients :/. They mention medical conditions as if it helps an array of illnesses and not just cfs. I guess that's just to make us feel as if we're not lumped in with the anxiety and stress group..

I'm actually mentioning this thread because I just came across a blog and she claimed to be cured by the LP. Funny thing is that I was actually looking at bloated tummy stuff then came across it on Google images. Here's the original blog post I read. I realized after reading around some more that she seems to be an advertiser. Seems a bit suspicious? Opinions on this?

I tried the lightening process unknowingly one evening lol. Took £0 and I ended up with very bad legs the next day. Worse they had been since I was ill. Woke up with them feeling extremely heavy and weak. I didn't realise it was so easy as saying I'm fine over and over again. Why the hell would you pay for that? I'm a very positive person but if saying your fine over and over again gets you better then you were probably fine to begin with. I do think, thinking (extremely) positive can help mentally because it has helped me cope with this better. But it hasn't cured me physically.

The medical/alternative medical industry is disgusting though. They ask for up to £1000 for a few session to teach you how to not thing negatively when you could explain that in half a leaflet. Makes me sick honestly and I don't need to be ill anymore than I am.
Does anyone know people on here who have done the LP? Would be cool to get a completely uncensored version of how it hasn't helped. I was thinking it was strange that I couldn't find many testimonials online. Even the ones on action for me seemed a little... off?

Ambrosia - it's only a problem in that part of the CFS/ME community which refuses to acknowledge any success the LP has had in treating the condition. Those of us who have tried it are no longer a part of that community because we are no longer sufferers.

So how about a completely uncensored version of how it HAS helped someone - well 3 people actually. Since I was last on this site I have been on the LP and would like to report what happened. Let's start with me - diagnosed (and for the pedants amongst us, that's diagnosed by the NHS) about 4 years ago - couldn't exercise one bit, would crash with severe flu-like symptoms if I did. Massive amounts of muscle pain, brain-fog, etc. Did the LP in January 2014 with an experienced practitioner (here are some of the testimonials of those she has helped http://www.kathykent.co.uk/testimonials.html). Got home after the course and began pumping iron 3 times a week, plus interval training, golf - no ill effects. This isn't hearsay and anecdote by the way, this is fact. The second person I have described before on this site, again what I am about to say is fact not anecdote. She is a colleague who I have worked closely with throughout her illness (extremely bad CFS/ME) for 5 years. Did the process and was cured, pretty much overnight - she is the Linda you see on the Kathy Kent testimonial page.The third person is more anecdotal since I don't know him that well, but it's Linda's husband - he suffered dreadful chronic pain from a serious neck injury from a ladder fall from over 15 years. On returning from doing LP he signed himself off disability benefit and started his first proper job in 15 years yesterday as it happens.

So, what are we to conclude - that all 3 of us are deluded, soft-headed, or liars, or charlatans? I don't give a fig if Phil Parker makes money out of selling LP - I have no vested interest myself, since I am not a practitioner. I am not promoting LP for any financial gain - my agenda is to pass on what has happened to me and 2 other people.

But what is the agenda of the people responding to your thread? Are they seekers of the truth, warning folk off spending their hard earned cash on chicanery and voodoo? Because if they are, they are misleading every single person who visits this website desperate for help - I mean to say, who, having read the replies to your original post, would go near LP or touch it with a bargepole? And the crying shame is they are speaking almost wholly from ignorance, hearsay and rumour . What they gain from coming on here and writing this garbage I have been trying to understand but have failed. They are very sad people who have my sympathy.

I am responding to your thread to try and bring some objectivity into the discussion - the bile, vitriol and disgusting lies that are being peddled about LP and its practitioners on this site are outrageous. It DOES work, and if you want to try it you need to buy this book and read it, very carefully and slowly making a few notes here and there all the while:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/An-Introduction-Lightning-Process®-Getting/dp/178180057X.

Then there are two routes to take. Either contact a practitioner and book yourself on a course (very expensive at £650) or buy Parker's recent book and give it a try yourself:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Get-Life-You-Love-Now/dp/1781801746/ref=pd_bxgy_b_img_y

At only a tenner, it's got to be worth that of anyone's money to try it out - as long as you approach it with an open mind and not full of the bullshit written about LP on this site

By the way, I'd be interested to know how you "tried the lightening (sic) process unknowingly one evening" - without being trained in it you can't do it!

As a final note there is some evidence which (retrospectively!) supports Parker's hypotheses about how the LP helps with conditions such as CFS/ME

"Dr. Bruun Wyller, who is considered to be one of Norway's leading experts on ME, says:
Recent research on CFS pathophysiology has revealed alterations of cardiovascular regulation and thermoregulation, characterized by enhanced sympathetic nervous activity and increased secretion of epinephrine. These findings indicate a state of permanent distress response – sustained arousal – in CFS patients. Based upon our findings, we have formulated a theory of sustained arousal in CFS, which seems to correspond quite neatly to the theoretical considerations underlying the Lightning Process.
You can read this research in full at http://lib.bioinfo.pl/auth:Wyller,VB"

Ambrosia, I wish you (and strangely enough, everyone reading this, including the bile-writers) every blessing and good fortune in your search for freedom from whatever ails you. Myself, I have booked myself into a local gym and must dash for my induction. All the best

 

[Dster]

It's really just a very systematic form of positive thinking, with a lot of imagined authority for the trainer and some sciencey sounding buzz-words which can all help manipulate patients into thinking there's more to their unfounded claims than there really is.

Hypnotherapy is probably not a bad comparison.

Some people within the CFS heap could find this sort of thing helpful, but I find these sorts of things pretty disgusting tbh. Personally, I'm not keen on junk therapies, and don't think that trying this sort of thing is likely to be helpful... but I'm still ill!

I think we'd be in a better position if the money spent on stuff like this was put into worthwhile research instead.

It's not a junk therapy, it cured my CFS/ ME - and it was MY money I spent on it, and I'll spend it on precisely what I choose to. It's not available on the the NHS so don't worry none of your taxes are being used on it

 

[Dster]

I suspect you're OK if you go in knowing exactly what they will try and how to fake it for them. Obviously they try to screen those people out, but if you're making a big effort, you could pretend to be their ideal victim - er, patient. I don't think it's that culty.

The real problem is that I wouldn't want someone with real ME to risk this, it'd be too damaging.

It's not culty at all - you don't know what you're talking about - it's a training program that works. Period. I wasn't a patient or a victim I was someone who paid money for a training program that cured me of my CFS/me. Get over it

 

[Dster]

from Private Eye magazine (#1248)

Under "Legal News" (p. 10)

Oh do come on - get with the program for heavens sake - the old private eye article was utter rubbish - no-one has ever been threatened with legal action over it - Parker wrote to private eye about the article asking for the evidence so he could do something about the aforementioned legal action and got nothing back - because it never happened they made it up - quite a lot of Private eyes stuff is false - very funny, but false - that's why they are nearly bankrupted every year by legal action against them for printing shite - luckily they have some very wealthy supporters who pay their legal bills !

 

[Dster]

Kina
bad backs, migraines, ah, today's "demonic possession" and "black magic hexes"!
i.e. anything without a simple answer = automatically fair game for being "gamed"

"stuckness"...yes, I'd like a pack of frenzied meth-amphetamine chugging, sex-starved baboons to get "stuck" up Wessely, White etc's asses!

*imagines bunch of psychs being chased around by mad, horny primates to the tune of the Benny Hill chase*

Silver blade, not sure what you're on, but I want some!!!

 

[Dster]

Pretending that we're not really ill, or that we're not as ill as we really are, and acting accordingly is what has made most people with ME much worse. We're already under enough social pressure to do that already. Most of us need to learn how to slow down and do less, not more.

No-one has to pretend they're not ill- where did you get that from?! My practitioner was extraordinarily sympathetic to my illness having been a sufferer for 10 years plus herself. And she cured me . Full stop. Cured. Deal with it

 

[Undisclosed]

@Dster -- it's very nice that you could think yourself better. Most of us can't because our issues aren't caused by psychological problems or bad thinking.

 

[Dster]

P

If people could 'think' themselves well, not only would it work for ME, it should work for all other illnesses. If people could think themselves well there would be no need for medicine or stupid money grabbing programs like LP.

Why is ME lumped in with a whole bunch of psychiatric problems that involve 'stuckness'. How bloody insulting and he gets away with this.

Phil Parker says:



Yup, I really want to 'get better at ME', I guess I am just not doing it right. Migraines? Puleez -- I get silent ocular migraines triggered by bright light from my laptop. Perhaps, I could cope with that by turning the brightness down rather than pay Parker any amount of money. What if the LP programs triggers migraines -- that would be really bad. Bad back -- why not just work on your posture etc. The bottom line of his whole program is that he is blaming people for thinking about things in the wrong manner -- reminds me of somebody else.

There certainly ways people could use positive thinking related to things unrelated to actual physical illness but still you don't need to pay Parker for this.

He may want us not to 'do' ME, well I am not going to 'do' LP.

Please yourself - I used to du ME, then did the LP. i don't du ME anymore - go figure

 

[maryb]

I am not going to make a post on this thread
I am not going to make a post on this thread
I am not going to make a post on this thread
I am not going to make a post on this thread
I am not going to make a post on this thread

ah I feel so much better......

 

[Undisclosed]

P

Please yourself - I used to du ME, then did the LP. i don't du ME anymore - go figure

Dster, I am very pleased that I won't 'do' an unproven unfounded therapy and waste my money. I know I don't have a psychological issue that would respond to psychobabble. What is 'du'?

20 posts on LP -- agenda is ?

 

[peggy-sue]

I agree with you wholeheartedly Kina.

@Dster -- it's very nice that you could think yourself better. Most of us can't because our issues aren't caused by psychological problems or bad thinking.

oh, please miss, I know about this du thing!
I was reading PPs site - it's a new word he's invented for du-ing his "processes". You actually need some funny accents on it, to get it right,

 

[Sushi]

No-one has to pretend they're not ill- where did you get that from?! My practitioner was extraordinarily sympathetic to my illness having been a sufferer for 10 years plus herself. And she cured me . Full stop. Cured. Deal with it

What do your before and after lab tests show? Many of us have labs that confirm that we have major dysfunctions of the immune system, the gut, the autonomic nervous system and that we have infectious diseases. Do you have have labs confirming that LP normalized these conditions?

Sushi

 

[Dster]

All LP (Lightning Process) seems to be is saying motivational statements, not allowing yourself to think about "bad" or "negative" thoughts like having symptoms or being sick (even if this is reality), and deciding to think (er, being manipulated into thinking) about yourself as healthy.

Plus there may be some kind of gag rule (if you don't like it, you may have to promise not to tell others, and even if you do like it, you might not supposed to say what the protocol is).

It seems to me that LP would interfere with managing symptoms. Just because you notice symptoms (I am having x symptom) is not a "bad" or "negative" thought and is necessary to figure out what to do about it (e.g., normal symptom hungry--> may be eat... disease symptom lightheaded-->may be drink and lie down).

Simply denying symptoms would be creating a false world. Lots of people try this--normally when initiated by the patient it's called denial

and denial is considered not the best coping strategy in the book to carry out long term, but it's normal, most of us have been there at some point, sometimes off and on--certainly that was my main strategy at one point when I wasn't diagnosed and the doctors had no clue what to do and neither did I.... but it probably made me worse.

However when denial is specifically induced by the therapist as if it were a treatment, I would think that would be profoundly unethical.

So if you want someone to talk to, you may like to find a support group or get a recommendation for a good supportive counselor. There is no good evidence cognitive therapy can help your disease; it could help your coping and quality of life, if that's what you're looking for help for.

Willow, there's no manipulation whatsoever - I've been on it and it i promise you to say there is is untrue. There is absolutely no "gag" rule either! Where on earth did you get that from - Parker's published two books on the subject describing it in depth what would be the point of a gag rule? I have told everyone who's interested about it freely. All they say is don't teach it to others and the analogy I've used before is that you wouldn't want to be taught to drive by a newly passed driver

 

[Valentijn]

It's not culty at all - you don't know what you're talking about - it's a training program that works. Period. I wasn't a patient or a victim I was someone who paid money for a training program that cured me of my CFS/me. Get over it

How on earth does a "training program" cure orthostatic intolerance and various bacterial infections? Nothing personal, but believing that you can cure a biological illness by changing how you think is utterly insane. It is completely irrational and illogical - there is absolutely no basis in reality for such a belief. You'd might as well "pray away the gay" or drink bleach to cure cancer.