Studies find that microbiome changes may be a signature for ME/CFS

[Rufous McKinney]

as in the quality of my BMs.

I can relate to admiring a really great BM.....!

Sometimes I think I should get out the camera!

 

[lyran]

Well, kiwi is a natural laxative. I usually eat 1 green kiwi per day and I feel it slightly helps with constipation. Could be though that gold kiwi or gold kiwi capsules have added benefits to boost butyrate levels.

 

[MonkeyMan]

Well, kiwi is a natural laxative. I usually eat 1 green kiwi per day and I feel it slightly helps with constipation. Could be though that gold kiwi or gold kiwi capsules have added benefits to boost butyrate levels.

For me, what's going on here is definitely more than the natural laxative effect of kiwi. I've always eaten tons of fruits and veggies (usually well-cooked, for better digestion), so I've been getting plenty of fiber in my diet, along with the other benefits (e.g., magnesium) these types of foods have. But my BMs have always been hit or miss until I started the gold kiwi caps. Things have improved dramatically.

 

[katabasis]

It's worth keeping in mind that kiwifruit contains actinidin, which has been shown to disrupt intestinal barrier integrity and have a pro-inflammatory effect (see here). If you're seeing a benefit from kiwifruit, it may be due to the pectin content or the polyphenols. Many other fruits contain pectin, and you might be able to find either supplements or whole fruits which have a similar polyphenol profile (kiwifruit polyphenols are assayed in this article). My money's on quercetin/rutin as big contributors to the benefits of kiwi due to their mast cell stabilizing effects.

 

[tyson oberle]

It's worth keeping in mind that kiwifruit contains actinidin, which has been shown to disrupt intestinal barrier integrity and have a pro-inflammatory effect (see here). If you're seeing a benefit from kiwifruit, it may be due to the pectin content or the polyphenols. Many other fruits contain pectin, and you might be able to find either supplements or whole fruits which have a similar polyphenol profile (kiwifruit polyphenols are assayed in this article). My money's on quercetin/rutin as big contributors to the benefits of kiwi due to their mast cell stabilizing effects.

When I started to take Kiwi Regularity from Enzymedica which has Actinidin enzyme 25,000 U/g I started to get more neck and shoulder pain. I thought it was possibly from the added dextrose in this supplement, but maybe it was from the Acticidin?
Anyway, I didn't even finish the Kiwi Regularity bottle. Instead I started taking PREbiotic GOLD from Intestinal Fortitude and I didn't notice the extra neck and shoulder pain like I did from the Enzymedica Kiwi. I am not sure if this different Kiwi supplement doesn't have acticidin, but I don't see it listed in the label. But this Kiwi supplement from Intestinal Fortitude doesn't have the added dextrose, maltodextrin, etc like the one from Enzymedica.

 

[MonkeyMan]

Well, my skepticism is less now. I started taking the Gold kiwi powder three days ago, and let's just say (to avoid TMI) that the results have been spectacular! The question is, will this continue??

Just an update - my gut's spectacular response the golden kiwi prebiotic supplement has disappeared, and the constipation has returned. This is even with a golden kiwi prebiotic capsule, a probiotic capsule, a Phage 1 capsule, kefir, and a banana all part of my diet yesterday.

It’s like whatever is causing the constipation initially retreats but then learns to work it’s way around whatever I throw at it. Has anyone else had a similar experience with their diet/supplements?

 

[BrightCandle]

Just an update - my gut's spectacular response the golden kiwi prebiotic supplement has disappeared, and the constipation has returned. This is even with a golden kiwi prebiotic capsule, a probiotic capsule, a Phage 1 capsule, kefir, and a banana all part of my diet yesterday.

It’s like whatever is causing the constipation initially retreats but then learns to work it’s way around whatever I throw at it. Has anyone else had a similar experience with their diet/supplements?

Happens a lot with ME/CFS. You get something and it works for up to a month and then the body/gut whatever it is adapts and your prior homeostatis is returning. Usually finding one of these thnigs helps a little long term as well the new basis is usually a small improvement but not always. I would say its a pretty universal experience and its why there is so much "wow this cured me" and the same people are still posting (myself included).

 

[godlovesatrier]

Hi all,

I just wanted to let you all know I successfully raised my prausnitzii over a 2 yaer period from 1% to 22% and correct gnavus from about 5% to 2%. All of these percentages match the NIH study for improvement in severity and physical fatigue and with these improvements I indeed saw amelioration of physical fatigue and a huge improvement in cognitive energy. Also my ability to crash from stress was significantly less and I felt far less emotional (less reactive) in certain situations. So for example when I wen tto a funeral recently I didnt actually cry, bit odd really to be honest not to do this! I'd suggest maybe an over dampening effect on emotional response.

I noticed the biggest changes when I started taking 1 to 2 tsps of inulin per day and 1 tsp of FOS rotated every few weeks. I also noticed big improvements in anti inflamatory action and dampening hyper activity of immune response when taking vivomixx 400 billion cfu's on an empty stomach, say three doses every two or three weeks, studies prove this actually persists for about this long, so it makes sense that I had to top it up.

I also made dietary changes, adding fruit (I wasn't allergic to) and changing my breakfast to granola from milk and wheat biscuits. I think this had a slight impact as well.

The trend over time was gradual but I saw the biggest improvement on my 2023 sample.

I had felt better before this but feel that the above changes in microbiome based treatments got me to a higher level. I do still struggle with light sensitivity and some brainfog (which might be due to histamine release). But overall it's much better.

Oh and this year my lactobacillus and bifidobacterium were the bottom end of healthy (biomesight ranges) for the first time since 2021 when I started testing. Akkermansia remains low however.

 

[godlovesatrier]

Here's the screenshots to go with that:
prausnitzii


gnavus

lactobacillus

bifido


Whilst some of these numbers may look low, considering how little bifido and lactobacillus make up the overall healthy proportion of bacteira (1% for lactobacillus) there not low. Gnavus again looks meaningless but the NIH study did show that low percentiles were statistically important with regards to fatigue scores.

 

[Judee]

I noticed the biggest changes when I started taking 1 to 2 tsps of inulin per day and 1 tsp of FOS

What brands did you use?

 

[godlovesatrier]

Any brand will do, it's just raw plant food fibre.

 

[Consul]

https://www.newscientist.com/articl...uFncnCEvV-O4F2ZkM1D9MJV6hw#Echobox=1687474952

 

[Rufous McKinney]

Just an update - my gut's spectacular response the golden kiwi prebiotic supplement has disappeared, and the constipation has returned. This is even with a golden kiwi prebiotic capsule, a probiotic capsule, a Phage 1 capsule, kefir, and a banana all part of my diet yesterday.

Oh, gosh bummer, @MonkeyMan

I have not kept up my golden kiwi consumption after mostly not really noticing much effect one way or another.

(I'm more IBS-d or IBS-chaos than IBS-c)

Are others still getting benefit from taking golden kiwi?

 

[tyson oberle]

Oh, gosh bummer, @MonkeyMan

I have not kept up my golden kiwi consumption after mostly not really noticing much effect one way or another.

(I'm more IBS-d or IBS-chaos than IBS-c)

Are others still getting benefit from taking golden kiwi?

I never once felt kiwi pills helping me

 

[Judee]

Found a site on raising Prausnitzii. Just skimmed it. Hopefully it has some more suggestions that are helpful for increasing that.

https://www.gutxy.com/blog/beneficial-bacteria-a-focus-on-faecalibacterium-prausnitzii/

 

[Rufous McKinney]

I never once felt kiwi pills helping me

I noticed nothing....

 

[Rufous McKinney]

Digestion tanks when I crash. Digestion improves when I don't. I got things going better there for a few weeks and now I got more run down again and on it goes.