Fredd,
Thank you for your help. I have started the Methyl B12 .....1/4 of a 1000mcg ..no problems so far....ordered others. Does the Jarrow 5000mcg come from Ihereb as I could not see it on their site? Now what kind of potassium....citrate or chloride. I have adrenaline induced high Bp will that be Ok taking it.?
Hi
Here's my 2 cents on the debate. Just my experience.
I've been on the yasko protocol since Feb 2007. I've been supplementing hydroxy B12 since then in various forms. For the past 6-8 months or somwhere around there I've been injecting 2-3ccs of 25mg/ml every day, which I think is a lot in anyone's book.
Progress has been slow.. although supporting my methylation cycle is the only treatment that has worked for me so far.
Anyway, I thought I would try methyl B12 as I thought that would speed things up. I ordered some injectable stuff from a compouding pharmacy. I tried a smidge ..less than 1/10th of 1 cc.. and it messed my brain up for days. FOR DAYS. It was very unpleasant.
Now I think I went with too high a dosage ...5mg/ml.. (and I ordered 3 bottles.. more $$$ down the drain).. But anyhow, I feel like methyl B12 needs to be approached VERY carefully.
Fredd's theory about large dosages of methyl B12 being better than small ones is interesting, but I don't think I'll be volunteering to try this any tiime soon.
It seems to be a case of what we really need being really potentially damaging for us.
I have had helacious reactions to glutathione and hydroxocobalamin and Lipoflow (I think it was the glut plus Methyl B12 product).
When I tried those 2 things I was in agony for a week. It felt like my brain was on fire.. on the one occasion.. and the only thing that helped was yasko's RNAs which are kinda expensive.
That's all I can tell you.
It would be nice to figure out a safe way to take methyl B12 .. maybe teeny, tiny doses??? because it just seems like otherwise we could be at this for years as Klinghardt has apparently said.
I just don't think I can afford to lose any more brain cells.
Cheers
L.
I agree with you on the hydroxy.. that it's not getting to the nervous system or the brain or whatever.
I think that what you call start-up effects of methyl B12 is brain inflammation by virtue of the effect of metals on microglial cells.
"Metals have been shown to activate the mircroglial cells that are responsible for inflammation." Professor Richard Deth.
I'm not sure if I have this right, but the sensation feels like inflammation. It abates after txt with anti inflammatory RNAs (yasko) and I'm guessing Deth's explanation provides the mechanism.
Welcome clarification on this though!!
and yes, titration seems to be the way to go with all our therapies. maybe start with sublinguals and move to injectable.
this is a lesson I keep having to learn the hard way. Can I blame that on my poor memory!?
Although I must add that everything I hear from the autism folks, and Deth has said this too, is that injectable is far superior to oral..so I guess ultimately you would want to get an Rx.
Hi Aquariusgirl,
Sorry yes technically its not a binder like charcoal and I agree I would normally use something like charcoal - the one I use is the Dr Schulze intestinal formula 2 to bind to toxins but when the detox is going on in my brain that doesnt seem to be enough....that only works when the toxins are mostly in my gut. The DMSA seems to be helping presumably by attracting any mercury that is being stirred up or released from taking the b12 etc and doesnt seem to be making things worse by chelating more out. At least that is my interpretation of whats happening! It really seemed to helped me a lot last time I tried it too.
I agree it definitely feels like metals being moved out. Thnx for the info on the tests, I've never had a urine or fecal test to verify whats happening but it would probably be a good idea to do that sometime.
Thanks for your input.
Hi Freddd,
I just wanted to ask your opinion on things...I have been carrying on with the methylb12 - I havent raised my dose I'm just taking 1/4 of a 1000mcg tab a day plus an extra 60mcg from the Jarrow B Right which I know its only a small amount but I'm too scared to take any more! Plus 1/4 of a tablet of Folapro. My head has been pretty bad the last few days and I am just wondering if this is some kind of detox reaction so wanted to check it out with you. I get memory black outs and really dont know what day it is, it really is like dementia. And/or like mercury is moving, but thats just my intuition, I know you would disagree with that!
Usually in the past when I've had brain fog, its like that part of my brain which clicks in pretty fast and makes me realise that I've made a mistake but with this I really get it wrong for hours!
Do you think its just detox? Does anyone else have any thoughts I'd be most grateful.
The good news is that some things are definitely getting better for example I seem to have gotten my taste for red meat back which I know is related to b12 deficiency. I ate some lamb tonight and it actually made me feel a lot better so I that could post this message! I guess this might be the aminos I needed plus the zinc.
Just to add I'm doing other treatments too (homotoxicology for viruses) I guess it could be the combined effect but the -ve effects defnitely feels like a b12 and/or folapro effect as I've had them before. I cant understand why it would get worse even though I've not raised my dose..
Thanks.
Hi Freddd and anyone else interested,
I had major problems with shortness of breath from my first dose of 1/2 lozenge of MB12, so I reduced it to 1/4 for two days, and when 1/4 produced no bad symptoms, I went back up to 1/2, and then to a whole 5 mg. lozenge. I've been at one lozenge each morning for a few days now with no further changes noticeable at all while I take it.
I have also been at one lozenge of ADB12 each afternoon for a week now with no changes noted any longer. Unfortunately, the noticeable improvements I had with the first dose went away the next day.
I started the Metafolin yesterday with no noticeable effects. I've been taking the B-right, potassium and TMG from the start.
I have not been able to sleep more than 6 hrs. for a couple of nights, but that can happen to me anyway, so I'm not blaming it on this protocol unless it goes on and on. My hair loss has slowed down to within normal, just barely. That appears to have been a temporary effect of the ADB12, or at least I hope it was temporary.
For background: I have never taken the Hydroxy form. I have been on a multi-vitamin with the methyl form in it for over a decade and have also experimented with MB12 sublingual tabs before, but got no result with them under my tongue.
My questions:
1) Am I supposed to continue raising the dosage beyond one lozenge of each type of B12 per day, and if so, how high do I go?
2) At what point should I do it, and how do I manage the logistics of the 50 mg. challenge? How do you fit ten MB12 lozenges under your upper lip at once?! How do you fit 17 lozenges of ADB12 under your lip at once?!
Thanks very much,
klutzo
Hi Freddd,
Thank you so much for your explanation of how to do the 50 mg. challenge. It sounds possible now, though I will look like a vampire while doing it, with all that cherry coloring running down my teeth.
Thanks also for explaining how to raise the two forms of B12 and how to tell when it's high enough.
I have been taking 1,500 mgs. of L-carnitine for over ten years already in my excellent Cardiac multi-vitamin. I took fumirate for awhile too, but noticed no difference. Must it be in fumarate form?
Ditto the zinc, though it is not quite that much in my multi, and I am afraid to take that much zinc. I have never had a white spot on one of my fingernails in my life. Is it that this B12 program going to cause a zinc deficiency?
I also take 8,000 units of D3 daily and have done ever since my insect allergies got so bad I could not stay outdoors. I recently finished 8 weeks of taking 50,000 units of prescription D3 twice weekly, to try to get my 25OD up to 65, since I have a precancer in my stomach. I got it up to 51, but it dropped to 47 after that in two months on 4,000 units daily, which is why I upped it to 8,000. I said it before, but want to mention again for others reading this, that if you are fat, you need double the amount of vitamin D that is recommended, because it literally gets stuck in your fat and does not come out.
SAMe is very expensive and never did anything for me, even when I tried it for several months. Is it absolutely needed here? I don't remember seeing that listed on the necessary list, and I tried this protocol because I could afford it, unlike most things people recommend.
Thank you,
klutzo