Loss of interest in hobbies? Depression.

[Wishful]

the kitchen table- a location where projects might happen, well sitting there for very long is harder and harder.

I've got a table covered in projects and stuff for projects too. Lots of dust on it.

Anhedonia? Yup, that seems to fit me. I can still feel some emotions while reading books, so emotional flatness doesn't fit.

 

[Wishful]

My real problem is managing the weights.

Work smart. The builders of the pyramids and those statues on Easter Island didn't just use muscles; they used brains too. (Pity about our ME brains though. ) Think of ways to make the job easier, such as cutting some short lengths for rollers, or even rolling the lengths into the water upstream if that's easier. I had a pair of wheels with a length of pipe as an axle. A come-a-long is cheap (~$25) and worth it for avoiding muscle strain. You might need some more smarts to figure out something to attach the other end to.

Different thicknesses is just another thing to work smart about. When you notch the ends to lay on whatever foundation you have on each end (treated 4x4 or whatever), cut the notch to the right depth to get the tops level. One of my poles turned out to not match the nice curve of the first one, so I nailed on a strip of wood to even in out. It's not fine cabinetmaking.

Yes, wood laying on the ground does get heavier. If you're not in a hurry, lever the ends up and put something underneath, so the wood is out of contact with the moist soil. If you do the bridge after one of those kitchen table projects, the wood should be dry by then.

If anyone finds further bridge-building discussion totally out of place, we can move it to PM.

 

[Wayne]

Its likely my brain and body just wanting me to rest as you say maybe its it's way of making me rest properly right now.

Hi @Jemima37 -- I can certainly relate--and empathize--with so much of what you describe. I noticed there's a lot of mention about rest in this thread, and it seems to connect with something that has helped me a lot recently. I've gotten into the habit of doing virtually all of my eating in a 4-hour time frame, which I feel gives my digestive system, body, and probably most importantly--my brain--a chance to rest in ways that I've not been used to.

It feels like it's allowed me to ride the cycles of what you describe--perhaps anhedonia--in much more predictable ways. Besides giving my body deeper rest cycles, it's also seems to have given my body a greater resiliency for activity cycles. And when I can have consistent activity levels without causing PEM, I've noticed that I sleep better, and my overall rest is better.

My experiences tell me that whatever it is that pwME/CFS experience that at least resembles anhedonia, is likely primarily physically induced. It's seemed that way for me anyway. I've long thought that if I could ever get to a point where I could comfortably go for more extended periods of time without eating, that it could be a real key for me. So far, it's turning out to be the case.

Rumi, a poet from Persia, a few centuries ago said, "Fasting is the first principle of medicine". I suspect a large part of that principle is how much it allows our entire systems to rest and heal.

​

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I watched a great 20-min. video recently which expounds on how a person can incorporate some of these ideas in a regimen that's safe for the times we live in. Some of the information in it gave me a yardstick on how I might lengthen my times of not eating on a regular basis. Perhaps paradoxically, I've found my new eating schedule to be more comfortable and easier to follow than when I ate more regularly, because eating has for a long time been stressful on my system.

How I Reversed Chronic Constipation Using Coffee Enemas! | SIBO IBS-C Gallstones

Happy new year to everybody. May we all enjoy improved health this coming year!

 

[Hip]

I cant understand why now I have this lost mojo for my passions? It's quite strange not feeling that part of me. If my depression was a 10/10 in severity last year, it's now maybe a 5. It's situational now and that's normal I guess. 2 years being housebound with cfs and pots type symptoms is no fun. Can anyone relate to this loss of passions? It actually makes me anxious that I feel this numbness in my gut for my old passions? Its similar to when you're depressed and cant feel love for your own family, that's scary too.

As others have already mentioned, it's possibly the symptom of anhedonia you are experiencing. This is a condition that occurs in the brain, and it means you no longer get much pleasure or reward from doing things you previously enjoyed.

Anhedonia as a symptom is often found in depression, but I think you can experience anhedonia on its own, even without depression.

The virus which triggered my ME/CFS also caused me to get severe anhedonia, which is a horrible condition.

Unfortunately there are almost no good treatments for anhedonia, neither drug treatments nor supplement treatments.


There is also a related condition called blunted affect, which means your emotions become weakened or flat. I actually developed both anhedonia and blunted affect.

 

[southwestforests]

the kitchen table- a location where projects might happen, well sitting there for very long is harder and harder.

I've got a table covered in projects and stuff for projects too. Lots of dust on it.

Something here sounds kinda familiar but I can't quite put my finger on what it is ...



And thanks to the neuropathy and fibromyalgia, this is what the chair looks like;

 

[southwestforests]

Anhedonia as a symptom is often found in depression, but I think you can experience anhedonia on its own, even without depression.

Sounds reasonable to me.

 

[Rufous McKinney]

Something here sounds kinda familiar but I can't quite put my finger on what it is ...

Very fun! There was a TV show I once watched and rather liked, and the main character had a craft room. Wow would that be great- everything organized, cabinets, work table...

But meanwhile- is that a Monkey effigy on top of your refridgerator?

 

[southwestforests]

Actually, a currently rather dusty fabric angel to go over large jars, for I don't remember why that a coworker at I don't remember where gave me multiple decades ago.

 

[Jemima37]

As others have already mentioned, it's possibly the symptom of anhedonia you are experiencing. This is a condition that occurs in the brain, and it means you no longer get much pleasure or reward from doing things you previously enjoyed.

Anhedonia as a symptom is often found in depression, but I think you can experience anhedonia on its own, even without depression.

The virus which triggered my ME/CFS also caused me to get severe anhedonia, which is a horrible condition.

Unfortunately there are almost no good treatments for anhedonia, neither drug treatments nor supplement treatments.


There is also a related condition called blunted affect, which means your emotions become weakened or flat. I actually developed both anhedonia and blunted affect.

Hopefully it’s something that won’t last forever. I’m missing that part of me. It’s actually making me anxious and depressed worrying about it lol

 

[Rufous McKinney]

a currently rather dusty fabric angel to go over large jars

It became Angelic, upon looking at it again with your ADDitional description!!

 

[JesseJo]

I wasn't sure where to post this as I couldn't find a forum section for mental health so I hope it's ok I ppst here.

I started with cfs early 2016. 2017 was a better year but then last year i started suffering from extreme anxiety, 12 hour panic attacks and later in the year for the first time, deep depression. I thought I'd had depression in my life before after my brother attacked me 7 years ago but last year I found out what it really was like. I scored very high on GP depression tests, felt so low, couldn't function at all due to depression and my CFS flared so badly all over again as a result of so much anxiety, panic and depression.

This year my anxiety improved, the panic attacks became rare again, my general anxiety halved and the depression lifted. Then after some stress in the summer losing my uncle, rabbit dying suddenly and then my dogs both had tumours diagnosed, my anxiety and panic returned for about a month as did the depression. Not as bad as last year but it took me about 6 weeks to improve. During that time the cfs flared bad again too.

In ths spring i started doing housework again, I could cook, shower etc and I felt so happy all I couldn't do last year was now back in my life. I felt like a mum and wife again. So the setback in the summer was hard. Anyway I felt much better by October mentally but since them this has happened.....

I've always had a strong sparkle in my stomach for my hobbies, they've kept me going through my tough times, a nice focus. Reading self help books, books on spirituality, Crystal's, meditation, gentle yoga, learning about healthy foods and vegetarian/veganism, essential oils etc.. I always felt that excitement for learning and having a focus and they were a huge part of me. Then these last few months that sparkle has gone. It stated where I felt too tired to read, I'd read a page and take nothing in which I assumed was fatigue so I didnt worry too much but now I've zero mojo for my hobbies. I dont want to do them and cant force myself to. I got upset yesterday talking to hubby, everyone knows me as this woman that loves Crystal's, spirituality, books, yoga etc and I feel I've lost that side of me. A side thats helped me through so much since the tough time I went through in 2012 with my brother and extended family.

Why? It sounds so much like depression I know, but my depression was far worse in the summer when i hit a period of difficult events. My anxiety is now lower and the depression definitely isn't anywhere near as bad ad the summer or at all like last year. Of course i didn't do hobbies last year as my days were a blur of panic, tears and fatigue but once i improved this year i was back excited about my passions. Now it's all gone again yet i dont feel deeply depressed thay bad. Is this normal? My hubby thinks it's because recently the fatigue has got in the way again, i am resting more than i was the rest of the year because of the fatigue every day and I'm brain fogged so lost my mojo. Yes there's an element of depression still but my GP agrees its situational, who wouldn't feel depressed with CFS, unable to get out to live life and feeling like you're the worst mother ever because of the CFS.

I cant understand why now I have this lost mojo for my passions? It's quite strange not feeling that part of me. If my depression was a 10/10 in severity last year, it's now maybe a 5. It's situational now and that's normal I guess. 2 years being housebound with cfs and pots type symptoms is no fun. Can anyone relate to this loss of passions? It actually makes me anxious that I feel this numbness in my gut for my old passions? Its similar to when you're depressed and cant feel love for your own family, that's scary too.

Sorry this is long

My mom and I have had serious anxiety/depression from the moment we got sick over 9 years ago now; it was just like someone flipped a switch in our brains. We're infected with Coxsackie B2 and B6 and possibly one or more of the closely related Echoviruses. I'd like to know if Interferon being produced by our cells to fight the viruses is causing that. It seems to make sense since anxiety/depression are common side effects when Interferon is administered medically to Hepatitis and Multiple Sclerosis patients. Anybody know about this?

 

[Hip]

My mom and I have had serious anxiety/depression from the moment we got sick over 9 years ago now; it was just like someone flipped a switch in our brains. We're infected with Coxsackie B2 and B6 and possibly one or more of the closely related Echoviruses. I'd like to know if Interferon being produced by our cells to fight the viruses is causing that. It seems to make sense since anxiety/depression are common side effects when Interferon is administered medically to Hepatitis and Multiple Sclerosis patients. Anybody know about this?

You might be interested in my account of the generalized anxiety disorder and anhedonia (a symptom of depression) that my coxsackievirus B infection caused me, when I caught it in 2003.

The anxiety I had was moderate to severe, and quite hellish. I finally fixed it with N-acetyl-glucosamine and a few other anti-inflammatory supplements. See here:

Completely eliminated my severe anxiety symptoms with three supplements!

My speculation is that the anxiety arises from the brain inflammation the infection causes. Brain inflammation releases a lot of the neurotransmitter glutamate, which is excitatory, and I think may overactivate areas of the brain like the amygdala, which create anxiety feelings.

 

[Rufous McKinney]

Hobbies involve:

Thinking..and thinking hurts

For me, hobbies are Sit at the Table. Sit at the Table hurts.

Involves eyes, looking carefully- and looking hurts. My eyes ache.

Lift- something in the sails..is required. Lift is often absent.

I just now started to write a hand written post holiday Note. I wrote one sentence. Stopped, not in the mood for this, stopped.

I played several album cuts the other day, during a moment of lift. Dust is back on the record player. It might be weeks, before "hear a song" desire occurs again.

 

[Hufsamor]

@Jemima37 i can relate, thanks for the thread

aboulia (lack of motivation)

Thanks for this!
This is something new for me, the last 1-2 years, (Ives been sick of years, but gotten worse) I didn't know it had a name!
I've always had a big self-drive, and through this aboulia I feel I've lost a lot of myself.
So grate to have a name for it

 

[Wolfcub]

Like today it's new years day and no I have no feelings for new year.

That had been creeping on me for a few years actually even when I was super well. It is very "bah humbug" but I got to the point where I couldn't see the meaning in it. It's just a date....it's just "time" Something figured out by humans. Apart from our conditioning....what does it really mean?

 

[Wolfcub]

Anhedonia? Yup, that seems to fit me. I can still feel some emotions while reading books, so emotional flatness doesn't fit.

No it doesn't quite fit me either. I do have times when I feel a lot emotionally, but go through "dead zone" patches. If I can't feel emotionally when listening to my favourite music I always think...uh-oh. It comes back though at other times.

I have definitely discovered that if there is any physical unease, the emotional responses shut off along with it.
Like....what's the point of Rachmaninov 2nd symphony when you are feeling tremors and nausea?

I have tried my favourite music to help to lift me out of bad times physically. But it doesn't really work. Yet as soon as I start to feel easier physically, the appreciation comes back again.

 

[Hufsamor]

@Wolfcub
I'd push the like -button for your post- if there where any.

After the discovery of the inflammation in the brain, I picture my brain with lots of inflammation when I'm in a bad place. And the inflammation will do all kind of silly stuff to my mind.

I guess the brain has to fokus on important matters-like heartbeats and breathing and stuff, and don't have any extra energy for less important matters...like fun and soothing stuff and positive feelings.

I just would prefer the brain to knock out the anxiety that rises at the same time as the body flare, but what do I know....maybe my brain recognise trouble and wants me to get out of the situation- like it would tell me to if it did recognise a lion (or in Norway, a big mama-moose) just in front of me. Big, big anxiety....GET OUT OF HERE! But, as there is no lion or moose around, only the inflammation in my brain, the reaction is for no good at all.

 

[Wayne]

@Wolfcub -- Love your new avatar!

 

[Wishful]

I guess the brain has to fokus on important matters-like heartbeats and breathing and stuff, and don't have any extra energy for less important matters...like fun and soothing stuff and positive feelings.

Possibly, but I think it's more likely that something in the state of ME--communication molecules or whatever--interferes with some neural pathways or hormones. Instead of poor quality fuel for a car, it's more like dragging something behind the car, or driving on a bumpy slippery road.

 

[JesseJo]

You might be interested in my account of the generalized anxiety disorder and anhedonia (a symptom of depression) that my coxsackievirus B infection caused me, when I caught it in 2003.

The anxiety I had was moderate to severe, and quite hellish. I finally fixed it with N-acetyl-glucosamine and a few other anti-inflammatory supplements. See here:

Completely eliminated my severe anxiety symptoms with three supplements!

My speculation is that the anxiety arises from the brain inflammation the infection causes. Brain inflammation releases a lot of the neurotransmitter glutamate, which is excitatory, and I think may overactivate areas of the brain like the amygdala, which create anxiety feelings.

Thanks for the info, we'll give that a try. I've been taking Fluoxetine 40mg/day for about a year now for possible antiviral activity and it does seem like I can think a bit more clearly but otherwise I'm still just as sick.