Lion Diet

[GreenEdge]

What I'm actually doing is often called Ketovore. The lion diet is a strict elimination diet, it's next level for those that are seriously ill. I should be promoting carnivore, so I replied mostly over there.

What types of foods are you eating

I find meat taste best when cooked medium-rare, but I've been experimenting with very think cuts cooked rare because I think raw meat should digest easier and be more nutritious.

I've been buying 2.5 kg portions of beef chuck 'roast' because it's cheap and fatty. I'll slice off about a 700g piece and sear each side on medium heat. About 2-3 minutes on each side, starting with the side created by the cut I just made.

Raw meat has very little flavor, but my taste buds are slowly adjusting to it. The photo in earlier post above was an extra large ~900g piece. When cooked rare, it's too soft to cut with a knife and fork, so I use my fingers and kitchen scissors to cut off pieces as I'm eating it. I don't enjoy it much, it's so soft my teeth can only tenderize it. So I've been swallowing tenderized chunks and I've been finding it takes longer to digest. Beef rump was better rare, I think chuck needs to be cooked long and slow to taste good.

Some carnivore dieters will buy beef suet and eat it raw and still frozen with their meat. I tried this a month ago (cut into small squares with a little salt). I expected it to cause an upset stomach but I had no reaction at all. I find fat is easier to digest when eaten this way, so next, I will try leaner meats and add beef suet on the side. I think that will combination will digest easier. That will be my next experiment.

Liver: I also eat lambs fry (liver) almost every day. It taste good so my body still wants it.

Because I have not had any sweeteners for sometime, I can trust my taste buds. I find lambs liver tastes sweet when eaten rare or raw. I've heard that all organ meats taste best raw; so far the only organ meats I've eaten are lambs fry or beef liver. I prefer lambs fry; I buy frozen and allow it to soften in the fridge enough to enable cutting it into half-inch thick slices before refreezing. I try to spread out the slices (in a plastic bag) so they're not touching, otherwise they will stick together when refrozen. Then to prepare it, I put one frozen slice into a bowl and pour a cup of hot boiling water over it (to sterilize the surface) and I then leave it underwater for 10 minutes for the inside the thaw.

That's been my usual OMAD. On other days I eat 2MAD, mince and a sausage for flavor as one meal and bacon and eggs as another.

and how much improvement have you gained from this diet?

See my post in carnivore thread.

 

[sb4]

I've got to say that meal looks rough. I am quite hesitant to eat things raw though I have done in the past. I remember eating mackerel raw that I got from the market and getting food poisoning. Another time I ate undercooked blood sausage and had brutal food poisoning for 2 weeks.
Is Australia like America in that you can easily get access to cheap meats?

Might have to see if I can get a hold of some beef suet from the supermarket.

I have tried OMAD but it was rough on the slow digestion. I spent the longest time doing 2MAD in an 8 hr window but have recently moved to 3/4 meals.

 

[GreenEdge]

Is Australia like America in that you can easily get access to cheap meats?

Our cheapest cuts are typically AU$20/kg, converted to US dollars that's US$30/kg or US$13.50/lb.

Australia tends to follow the US like we're just another state of the US. Even thou our supermarkets have taken a large share of meat sales we still have butcher shops, so we still have access to organ meats. There are 2 butcher shops near me, so I buy all my food from them.

 

[GreenEdge]

Slow digestion is caused by not consuming enough fat or water to maintain gastro-intestinal (GI) motility. Constipation (especially on keto or carnivore) is fixed by eating more fat. Fat intake may need to be increased gradually because when you don't have enough bile; too much fat or delivered too quickly (eg. rendered or liquid fat) will cause diarrhea. Bile is reabsorbed and stored in the gallbladder. When needed your liver makes more.

The gallbladder stores and concentrates bile from the liver. The bile is then released into the first section of the small intestine (the duodenum), where it helps your body to break down and absorb fats from food.

Some find that animal fat is easiest to digest when eaten raw in it's natural state. Maybe because that way it is delivered more slowly. So I keep frozen suet and brain and let either semi-thaw (soften) to slice off some to add to my meals. I find brain is superior as it enables me to take more thiamine (TTFD) without worsening symptoms of vitamin B1 deficiency. I also regularly add a small amount of liver. Both brain and liver are nutrient dense - true super foods.

See video: How to add HEALTHY FAT to a Keto or Carnivore Diet (12 min)

 

[GreenEdge]

If you like the video, please give me a like.

 

[sb4]

It's somewhat related however not carnivore, I have been eating keto-ish for the last month or so consistently. One of the things that helped have been low carb vegetables to soak up the butter however I still had problems digesting it, especially considering the shear amount required on keto.

The thing is though, I can eat very high fat ratios when its in salami or something but the same ratios as cod and butter for example just doesn't work. I speculated that the issue is something to do with how the fat is packaged. When you have melted butter its basically just oil however in salami its inside fat cells in specific structures (phospholipids, triglycerides???) that probably make it easier to digest.

When your gut digests fats it has to emulsify the fat, then digest with lipase enzymes. I already know that emulsifying fat helps with consuming it. If your food is swimming in oil, swallowing that oil is disgusting however if its emulsified in some way its usually fine.

So I started using egg yolk powder with my butter for emulsification, using psyillium hust to soak up some more of the oil, and taking some old lipase enzymes I had lying around.

My digestion has much improved after these changes. Less bloating, less gastroparesis, less gut pain / diarrhea.

@GreenEdge Are you in the video above?

 

[Viala]

The thing is though, I can eat very high fat ratios when its in salami or something but the same ratios as cod and butter for example just doesn't work. I speculated that the issue is something to do with how the fat is packaged. When you have melted butter its basically just oil however in salami its inside fat cells in specific structures (phospholipids, triglycerides???) that probably make it easier to digest.

I've noticed the same thing recently, I love butter and I can eat a lot of it but it doesn't work the same as fat that is naturally found in meat for example. Even if I eat the same amount of fat during a day it is not the same. It is similar with carbs and how they are prepared. Soaked and cooked whole vs soaked, mixed in a blender and cooked, the body doesn't digest it the same way. Whole foods are much better.

 

[GreenEdge]

@GreenEdge Are you in the video above?

Not me. I agree with everything he says - it matches my experience.

If you want to try lion diet, I would suggest:

1. Drink only water.
2. Transition into carnivore diet by reducing carbohydrate intake each week by 50%
3. Go carnivore for 6 months and only include dairy if you want to gain weight.
4. Each month switch between carnivore and lion diet to feel the difference and compare.

 

[Rufous McKinney]

Learning to resist temptations will serve me well into the future.

I do that.

Keep some of the thing around I am to not be consuming. Because I believe grown ups must learn discipline and self restraint.

 

[Rufous McKinney]

it's where the term Salisbury Steak originated.

Im finding it sorta of trippy that I was this child who hated vegetables, and most fruit, also. There were a few meats I would consume.

and Salisbury Steak was my single MAIN thing I liked. I wonder if I am Kellogg reincarnated.

(I had severe food allergies as a child; extreme taste sensitivity also) Food is all SUSPECT.

Still is....(blame the food)

 

[datadragon]

Still looking over what may be helpful in these type of diets. Some new thoughts below:

Orexins are activated by high protein diets. The top three amino acids that activate orexins are glycine, aspartate and cysteine. BCAA (Branched Chain Amino Acids) leucine, isoleucine, and valine also seem helpful, as they can restore orexin levels after brain injury.Fats, specifically triglycerides stimulate orexins as well. https://drvanta.com/how-to-treat-orexin-deficiency-naturally/

glucose-induced inhibition of orexin neurons exhibits a unique sugar-selectivity signature: It is caused by d-glucose, mannose and 2-deoxyglucose but not by l-glucose, galactose, α-methyl-d-glucoside, or fructose.
Previous studies show that orexin neurons are GI, inhibited by increases and excited by decreases in extracellular glucose in a metabolism-independent manner
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2551664/

In lab animals, the principal way to activate orexin is by restricting glucose. elevated glucose concentration can block or silence the activity of orexin neurons https://physoc.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1113/jphysiol.2011.217000 https://diabetesjournals.org/diabet...912/Hypoglycemia-Activates-Orexin-Neurons-and

Glucose deprivation strongly inhibited IFN-gamma gene expression (increased by ifn-a, heavy exercise), whereas IL-2 production was little affected. Inhibition correlated with diminished phosphorylation of p70S6 kinase and eIF4E binding protein 1 and a requirement for de novo protein synthesis, whereas other signaling pathways known to regulate IFN-gamma expression were unaffected. Together, our data reveal that optimal induction of IFN-gamma transcription is a glucose-dependent process https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/15814691/

 

[GreenEdge]

You lost me at eliminate coffee.

Spoken like a true addict.

 

[GreenEdge]

Mikhaila Peterson's reaction video to Mayo clinic article on lion diet.

 

[GreenEdge]

Jordan Peterson Reports Back After 5 YEARS on Carnivore Diet (Results)
Jordan Peterson Ate Beef Only for 5 Years on the Carnivore Diet, Here's What Happened..

 

[Alvin2]

Jordan Peterson Reports Back After 5 YEARS on Carnivore Diet (Results)
Jordan Peterson Ate Beef Only for 5 Years on the Carnivore Diet, Here's What Happened..

Mikhaila Peterson's reaction video to Mayo clinic article on lion diet.

If these people ate only beef they would be dead from multiple nutrient deficiencies.

 

[forestglip]

If these people ate only beef they would be dead from multiple nutrient deficiencies.

You can make preposterous claims till the cows come home (pun intended), yet snake oil remains snake oil.

There are lots of people that eat only beef and are fine/better than ever. For example, probably hundreds of people in the Lion Diet Facebook group who have been eating this way for months or years.

If expanding to carnivore, the subreddits r/zerocarb and r/carnivore are full of people who maintain this diet long term.

There's also the person above, GreenEdge. Are you convinced they are lying about being on a long term carnivore diet?

 

[Alvin2]

There are lots of people that eat only beef and are fine/better than ever. For example, probably hundreds of people in the Lion Diet Facebook group who have been eating this way for months or years.

If expanding to carnivore, the subreddits r/zerocarb and r/carnivore are full of people who maintain this diet long term.

There's also the person above, GreenEdge. Are you convinced they are lying about being on a long term carnivore diet?

Do we really need to go into what vitamins and vital nutrients are. Beef is not a complete nutrition source.
You can live on it for a while but eventually you will pay the price. A bunch of bro science "influences" peddling stupidity is ridiculous and dangerous.
Here is an account of a non ideologue who tried it.
https://www.theguardian.com/food/2018/sep/10/my-carnivore-diet-jordan-peterson-beef

I'm already expecting the excuses that he should have just kept going until he caused permanent damage (which if course can't happen because vital nutrients are no longer vital when you can have beef....)

 

[forestglip]

Do we really need to go into what vitamins and vital nutrients are. Beef is not a complete nutrition source.
You can live on it for a while but eventually you will pay the price. A bunch of bro science "influences" peddling stupidity is ridiculous and dangerous.
Here is an account of a non ideologue who tried it.
https://www.theguardian.com/food/2018/sep/10/my-carnivore-diet-jordan-peterson-beef

I'm already expecting the excuses that he should have just kept going until he caused permanent damage (which if course can't happen because vital nutrients are no longer vital when you can have beef....)

Vitamin and mineral RDAs are based on specific diets. The studies they are based on used people eating common diets. There has been nothing comparable in scale in terms of measuring requirements for carnivore dieters.

As one example, glucose competes with Vitamin C in the body. If eating little or no carbohydrate, very little Vitamin C is necessary.

And yes, that's an anecdote of someone who had issues. There are also loads of anecdotes who had issues on vegetarian, vegan, and omnivorous diets.

 

[Alvin2]

Vitamin and mineral RDAs are based on specific diets. The studies they are based on used people eating common diets. There has been nothing comparable in scale in terms of measuring requirements for carnivore dieters.

As one example, glucose competes with Vitamin C in the body. If eating little or no carbohydrate, very little Vitamin C is necessary.

This is not how any of this works.

 

[GreenEdge]

This is not how any of this works.

How did pre-agriculture humans lose the ability to make vitamin C and yet thrive? A genetic trait can not propagate and prosper if it reduces that individuals ability to thrive.

The theory of evolution is the one thing we can trust. Evolution is my first bullshit filter.

Does meat cure scurvy?

Fresh meat from animals, notably internal organs, contains enough vitamin C to prevent scurvy, and even partly treat it. Scott's 1902 Antarctic expedition used lightly fried seal meat and liver, whereby complete recovery from incipient scurvy was reported to have taken less than two weeks. - Wikipedia

YouTube explanations:
Going Carnivore? What about Vitamin C (6:33)
Vitamin C: Truths, Lies, and How to REALLY Prevent Colds (3:58)
Why You WON'T Become Vitamin C Deficient on a Carnivore Diet | Prof. Bart Kay (7:18)
How can someone be carnivore for 65 years and never get scurvy?

Besides, why should anyone fear scurvy when vitamin C supplements are available everywhere?