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I get really odd reactions to certain B vitamins and cofactors

Messages
31
Whenever I take a B-complex I get a headache, feels like the muscles in my head and other body parts really tighten up. My neurological symptoms flare up and I just get even more fatigued than usual. I'm drinking 1l of coconut water while taking it so I'm getting a lot of potassium.

Also when I tried taking 1g of Glycine I got really dizzy, room actually started spinning and I had to sleep it off.

I seem to do fine on certain B vitamins alone such as B2, I've been confirmed to have a B2 deficiency. B6 I'm unsure about, I have high levels of it in my blood but in my urine it's low, it might be because I'm not able to metabolize it properly due to my B2 deficiency. And B6 deficiency symptoms are identical to B6 toxicity from what I've read so it's hard for me to determine which is which.

Can anyone help me make sense of this?
 

gm286

Senior Member
Messages
150
Location
Atlanta, GA
Not sure how or why, but I am extremely similar and have inquired around online before w/o much in the way of answers. I cannot take B complexe vitamins no matter the dosage, form, or if co-enzymated.

I do well on the bio-available forms of B2, B6, and B9 at the following low doses only: 50mg, and 800mcg for the folate. Those are the ones I’m deficient in anyway, so that works out.

I know for certain that I do not tolerate B1. I get very weird symptoms several times over several years of randomly trialling. Weird tense muscles exactly like you, and/or strange nerve pain in localized areas, etc. The reaction is immediately noticeable. Not sure why.

edit: oh, and, weirdly yes the Glycine also applies to me. Something beyond fatigue, more like woozy and sleepy, even drowsy. But I think it has that effect on many. Again, not sure how or why.
 
Messages
600
There is a receptor for glycine that messes with neurotransmission of both gaba and glutamate systems. Could explain the symptoms.

Wrt b-vitamins maybe some of them are a bit stimulating, e.g vit b3. At least i think that one messes me up (i used nicotinamide).
 

Judee

Psalm 46:1-3
Messages
4,519
Location
Great Lakes
I do think some of it has to do with sulfur/thiols and that many of us have liver detox genetic issues.

Several of the B vitamins are sulfur/thiols... thiamine and biotin and one or two others that I can't remember right now.

Also there could be methylation issues.

Plus one SIBO doctor said that bad bacteria also use methylation to survive so if we take those vitamins before getting pathogens under control we end up basically feeding (fertilizing) the bad "guys." Hence they get stronger and we get sicker.

I do think there have been other threads on this topic that might have more educated theories because I know I've seen it mentioned often...this issue we have with B vitamins.
 

LINE

Senior Member
Messages
854
Location
USA
I am not sure what to think about the glycine - if I take it as a supplement, I had problems. I use bone broth which has glycine in it (I think) but I never have issues with it. There was a post on here about someone's use of glycine who said that initially, it caused problems but after some time, it worked well. There was an idea that it can help detoxify.

So much of this puzzle is to find the right pieces, obviously, there is no set standard since bioindividuality exists.
 

gm286

Senior Member
Messages
150
Location
Atlanta, GA
There was one extra symptom / reaction, the most recent one (was having trouble recalling it yesterday). Basically took a co-enzymated B formula and woke up with the worst frozen shoulder ever. I have a weak shoulder joint / capsulitis and it’s caused me pain before. Obviously I must’ve slept on it / put force, except I do this often. I knew something was up as the B vitamins were the only variable at that point.
 

LINE

Senior Member
Messages
854
Location
USA
There was one extra symptom / reaction, the most recent one (was having trouble recalling it yesterday). Basically took a co-enzymated B formula and woke up with the worst frozen shoulder ever. I have a weak shoulder joint / capsulitis and it’s caused me pain before. Obviously I must’ve slept on it / put force, except I do this often. I knew something was up as the B vitamins were the only variable at that point.

I had that happen with some questionable Vitamin C that turned out to have lots of preservatives. I could not move my shoulder then I stopped the Vit C and it went away. Clearly it was an immune response.
 
Messages
45
Whenever I take a B-complex I get a headache, feels like the muscles in my head and other body parts really tighten up. My neurological symptoms flare up and I just get even more fatigued than usual. I'm drinking 1l of coconut water while taking it so I'm getting a lot of potassium.

Also when I tried taking 1g of Glycine I got really dizzy, room actually started spinning and I had to sleep it off.

I seem to do fine on certain B vitamins alone such as B2, I've been confirmed to have a B2 deficiency. B6 I'm unsure about, I have high levels of it in my blood but in my urine it's low, it might be because I'm not able to metabolize it properly due to my B2 deficiency. And B6 deficiency symptoms are identical to B6 toxicity from what I've read so it's hard for me to determine which is which.

Can anyone help me make sense of this?

Calcium is also involved in reducing tight muscles. Hypocalcemia can cause tight muscles as well as cramps and spasms and also severe fatigue. Calcium is normally associated with muscle contractions but thats what calcium does intracellularly. In the blood it does the opposite, it reduces excessive sodium channel activity. So if your diet doesn't include much calcium, you may want to try normalizing your calcium intake.

This short article on the topic is really informative for anyone interested:

https://pittmedneuro.com/ions.html
 
Messages
27
So years ago I tried B Vitamin complexes like Nature Made since it is easy to buy in any store. It have me horrible irritability. After a week I stopped. I then tried a B Complex from Thorne and I no longer had the issue.

So it could be dosage between the vitamins included, or even just the quality/form of vitamin.
 
Messages
27
Calcium is also involved in reducing tight muscles. Hypocalcemia can cause tight muscles as well as cramps and spasms and also severe fatigue. Calcium is normally associated with muscle contractions but thats what calcium does intracellularly. In the blood it does the opposite, it reduces excessive sodium channel activity. So if your diet doesn't include much calcium, you may want to try normalizing your calcium intake.

This short article on the topic is really informative for anyone interested:

https://pittmedneuro.com/ions.html
Isn't Calcium a supplement you really don't want to take excess of? So I'm not sure how you know if you should take it instead of magnesium or potassium. Especially if you don't have bone issues.
 
Messages
94
Whenever I take a B-complex I get a headache, feels like the muscles in my head and other body parts really tighten up. My neurological symptoms flare up and I just get even more fatigued than usual. I'm drinking 1l of coconut water while taking it so I'm getting a lot of potassium.

Also when I tried taking 1g of Glycine I got really dizzy, room actually started spinning and I had to sleep it off.

I seem to do fine on certain B vitamins alone such as B2, I've been confirmed to have a B2 deficiency. B6 I'm unsure about, I have high levels of it in my blood but in my urine it's low, it might be because I'm not able to metabolize it properly due to my B2 deficiency. And B6 deficiency symptoms are identical to B6 toxicity from what I've read so it's hard for me to determine which is which.

Can anyone help me make sense of this?

I’ve always wondered about my similar reactions. I get muscle tension, sometimes my neck from what I remember, a fuzzy head pressure and extra fatigue when I take some b vitamins on their own. B1 was the biggest problem, the bad feeling comes over me really quickly.

B2 and lower dose B3 were ok.

I’ve also wondered about sulfur because I know I’m sensitive. Glycine makes me dizzy. B complexes if low dose and not the methyl forms I can tolerate.

Also extremely sensitive to ALA and NAC which I’ve blamed on sulfur.
 

Judee

Psalm 46:1-3
Messages
4,519
Location
Great Lakes
I do also think some supplements can backlog the liver detox systems causing a buildup of ammonia in our bodies which would account for the muscle burning/tightness/tension that comes after taking them.
 
Messages
45
Isn't Calcium a supplement you really don't want to take excess of? So I'm not sure how you know if you should take it instead of magnesium or potassium. Especially if you don't have bone issues.
You don't want to excess of course but you always want to make sure you have enough. Ideally you want to get close to 1000mg a day total from diet and/or supplements. Chronically low calcium intake will lead to problems with blood calcium (it can go too low or too high) and in the long term will lead to PTH related symptoms and substantial bone loss and interfere with calcium homeostasis in your tissues.
 
Messages
764
Location
Israel
I have MTHFR mutation and my brother had a stroke at my age. Every doctor tells me to take methyl folate with whatever folic acid supplement that will suit it.

It doesn't matter form of folate I take, I feel bad the day after. It causes a worsening of my CFS.

Same with any synthetic B vitamin combination or complex.

I now try to get it from my diet.

Very frustrating that no doctor believes me. They think that it is just methylation and if I get the right form of folate everything will be ok.
 
Last edited:
Messages
764
Location
Israel
Whenever I take a B-complex I get a headache, f

Can anyone help me make sense of this?

Have you had MTHFR mutation test?

I don't know what country you are in, but it should be something your state health system covers..You should not need a private gene test.

MTHFR mutation is recognised by all haematologists and should by recognised by family doctors.

It is a gene that means you can't metabalise regular folic acid and need more of it than a regular person.

It is gene that puts you more at risk of strokes, or if you get pregnant, more at risk of giving birth to a baby with defects.

Please excuse my explaining if you already know about it. Many people don't know about it. I only found out about it recently.
 
Messages
31
Have you had MTHFR mutation test?

I don't know what country you are in, but it should be something your state health system covers..You should not need a private gene test.

MTHFR mutation is recognised by all haematologists and should by recognised by family doctors.

It is a gene that means you can't metabalise regular folic acid and need more of it than a regular person.

It is gene that puts you more at risk of strokes, or if you get pregnant, more at risk of giving birth to a baby with defects.

Please excuse my explaining if you already know about it. Many people don't know about it. I only found out about it recently.

I had my MTHFR C677T and A1298C genes tested years ago and according to that test they were normal functioning, I had hetero mutations in MTR and MTRR and homo in CBS and COMT. I've never had a problem with sulfur though, a low sulfur diet changed nothing for me so I don't think that's my issue. I've also always consistently had low B2 (riboflavin) levels and elevated in other B vitamins like B6 and B12. I have symptoms of B6 toxicity like neuropathy and visual snow. Any time I take a supplement with B6 in it (including P5P) these symptoms worsens badly.

I'm currently leaning towards my deficiency in B2 being the issue here, as you need B2 to be able to metabolize other B vitamins and get them into cells, otherwise they just float around in your body not being used, causing higher levels of them in the blood. At least, from what I currently understand about all this.
 
Messages
7
I had my MTHFR C677T and A1298C genes tested years ago and according to that test they were normal functioning, I had hetero mutations in MTR and MTRR and homo in CBS and COMT. I've never had a problem with sulfur though, a low sulfur diet changed nothing for me so I don't think that's my issue. I've also always consistently had low B2 (riboflavin) levels and elevated in other B vitamins like B6 and B12. I have symptoms of B6 toxicity like neuropathy and visual snow. Any time I take a supplement with B6 in it (including P5P) these symptoms worsens badly.

I'm currently leaning towards my deficiency in B2 being the issue here, as you need B2 to be able to metabolize other B vitamins and get them into cells, otherwise they just float around in your body not being used, causing higher levels of them in the blood. At least, from what I currently understand about all this.
@HurrySaveMe can I ask, are you getting any better with your supplementation? I'm very similar in that many B vitamins make me worse as well as vitamin D and I suspect my main issue might be B2 deficiency as it's the one vitamin that I tolerate very well. I also have neuropathy and dizziness and most of your symptoms really. Was just wondering if you figured anything out.
 

Mary

Moderator Resource
Messages
17,468
Location
Southern California
Also when I tried taking 1g of Glycine I got really dizzy, room actually started spinning and I had to sleep it off.
oh, and, weirdly yes the Glycine also applies to me. Something beyond fatigue, more like woozy and sleepy, even drowsy. But I think it has that effect on many. Again, not sure how or why.

Glycine is known to help with sleep. Also, 1 gram is a very large dose. Glycine can be very powerful so if someone is taking it for the first time, I strongly recommend you start with a low dose, maybe 100 mg.

The Sleep-Promoting and Hypothermic Effects of Glycine are Mediated by NMDA Receptors in the Suprachiasmatic Nucleus


There was a post on here about someone's use of glycine who said that initially, it caused problems but after some time, it worked well. There was an idea that it can help detoxify.

That was me :rolleyes: When I first took glycine, I took at least 500 mg and maybe more and was hit with a severe detox reaction, got very spacey, tired, felt sick. Muscle testing showed that the glycine was good for me but to start with a much smaller dose. Glycine helps with Phase II liver detox. So I went to a very small dose and gradually over a period of 6 months titrated up slowly, till by the end of 6 months no detox reaction at all from the glycine, or anything else - prior to then I used to detox a lot. Without muscle testing I never would have been able to figure this out. I still take glyine at night for sleep with no bad reaction.
 

LINE

Senior Member
Messages
854
Location
USA
That was me :rolleyes: When I first took glycine, I took at least 500 mg and maybe more and was hit with a severe detox reaction, got very spacey, tired, felt sick. Muscle testing showed that the glycine was good for me but to start with a much smaller dose. Glycine helps with Phase II liver detox. So I went to a very small dose and gradually over a period of 6 months titrated up slowly, till by the end of 6 months no detox reaction at all from the glycine, or anything else - prior to then I used to detox a lot. Without muscle testing I never would have been able to figure this out. I still take glyine at night for sleep with no bad reaction.

Interesting - it likely targets a specific pathway in the liver. I don't have any problems with bone broth which contains a fair amount of glycine. Good comment on the muscle testing, I use a similar method which has been very guiding for me.