Effects of warm water immersion on blood pressure, heart rate and heart rate variability in CFS

[hunter1899]

How warm was the sauna? I have a diy sauna that isn't well insulated so it doesn't get much hotter than the temperatures mentioned in the paper above.

Not sure. It was at a gym so whatever is the default temp for a sauna. In other words it wasn’t custom set for CFS.

 

[Learner1]

Has anyone tried beta blockers and dip? Something tells me this isn’t as easy as popping a Benadryl for a magic cure huh?

I only mention them because I take a beta blocker for POTS daily and it seems to improve HRV, and changed with dose, while Benadryl tanks it on my Oura ring tracker. Therefore, it is difficult to associate changes in HRV with health or any progress. I'm assuming the save could be the same for other drugs as well.

The studies I've seen the ME/CFS patients on no drugs, so treating POTS or MCAS can dramatically change function and HRV in a way that doesn't nsjd much sense.

 

[Abrin]

So, I really don't have enough data points because not enough time has gone by yet but I've definitely noticed that if I got to my DIY infrared sauna when the temperature is at 35-37°C my heart rate variability indeed goes up the next day.

I got distracted one day during this experiment and missed having a sauna the night before and the next morning my heart rate variability reading fell by 10 points!

A lot more time and data is needed but I am definitely intrigued now.

 

[andyguitar]

I got to my DIY infrared sauna when the temperature is at 35-37°C my heart rate variability indeed goes up the next day.

Have you found anything else that has this effect on you?

 

[Abrin]

Have you found anything else that has this effect on you?

Not anything that has been this consistent yet. But, it is still so hard to tell since it has been such a tiny amount of time so it is hard to tell if it is anything worth noting or just random chance.

 

[Jjnz]

I did regular saunas for 2 years, 10~20 mins at 80 degrees. Which is testing
Hrv was typically around 25(rmssd) before sauna, after /during sauna is would be lower 12~20 and frequently followed by headache.
More often than not this results in redness that lasts several hours and joint pain and strong fatigue that lasts 24 hrs
I'm assuming we all have very low Hrv

 

[Abrin]

I did regular saunas for 2 years, 10~20 mins at 80 degrees.

The study recommended a temperature of 35-37°C.

 

[Jjnz]

The study recommended a temperature of 35-37°C.

Yeah I saw that and wondered why, that's body temperature.

 

[Abrin]

Yeah I saw that and wondered why, that's body temperature.

Room temperature is 20–22°C though.

 

[Abrin]

@andyguitar

I figured I'd share an image of the strange gains I've been making in HRV lately. You can actually see the drop in my HRV the one night when I skipped having a sauna.

So far, the gains seem to build on each other as well. I had to double-check my reading today when I saw that it went up by 10 points.

The saddest thing about this situation is that it all just might be a super strange coincidence. I guess I'll just have to cross my fingers and see.

 

[andyguitar]

 

[andyguitar]

The study recommended a temperature of 35-37°C.

Yeah I saw that and wondered why, that's body temperature.

I think the idea of this treatment is to reduce the amount of blood in the skin so it can increase the blood volume in the rest of the body. If you are surrounded by water at body temp you wont need to have blood circulating to the skin to keep warm. Make sense?

 

[andyguitar]

You might find this interesting @Abrin it's an account of how 2 patients with cfs got better using dry sauna.

 

[Abrin]

You might find this interesting @Abrin it's an account of how 2 patients with cfs got better using dry sauna.

Thanks so much for finding this for me @andyguitar.

I am very much looking forward to reading it!

 

[Abrin]

@andyguitar:

After a few more days, I wasn't able to maintain the gains I had been making and my HRV went right back it is regular normal lows.

I can't say I am surprised because I've learned many times in the past that while I can make progress, that progress never seems to stick.

I'd be lying if I didn't admit I was disappointed though. Sighs.

 

[andyguitar]

After a few more days, I wasn't able to maintain the gains I had been making and my HRV went right back it is regular normal lows.

Why not give the warm water bath a go?

 

[Abrin]

Why not give the warm water bath a go?

I find it really exhausting to get in and out of a bathtub. I'd be afraid any gains I got from it, I'd end up losing just by getting in and out of the tub.

 

[andyguitar]

I find it really exhausting to get in and out of a bathtub

Yes that is a bit of a problem. So the other option for you would be to give the Sauna a rest for a week then start again.

 

[Abrin]

Yes that is a bit of a problem. So the other option for you would be to give the Sauna a rest for a week then start again.

That is good advice, thank you! <3

 

[Davsey27]

Want to bump this thread

I think saunas and warm baths can be helpful for some who are able to tolerate this I took a pink Himalayan and salt bath and noticed I felt better the next day.

I know this can lead to PEM for alot.Start low temps go slow