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Created in 2008, Phoenix Rising is the largest and oldest forum dedicated to furthering the understanding of and finding treatments for complex chronic illnesses such as chronic fatigue syndrome (ME/CFS), fibromyalgia (FM), long COVID, postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome (POTS), mast cell activation syndrome (MCAS), and allied diseases.
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Klonopin (and you might try finding the numerous negative references to it in these threads, people who haven't been as lucky as you, or maybe just took it as prescribed, and as their Drs instructed them to, which you correctly avoided) was developed by Roche Labs to compete with the then market leader for epilepsy, Dilantin.But there must be something in this and why it causes a massive reduction in symptoms for me and many others. How can we harness this?
Actually, it won't. As other posters have mentioned, oral GABA doesnt cross the BBB, and while there are GABA receptors in other parts of your body, if you've been taking exogenous GABA stimulators like benzos, gabapentin, neurontin, etc, those receptors are probably also down-regulated to the point of invisibility.Source Naturals sells GABA lozenges which you let dissolve under the tongue. This will provide the GABA you need to stop the anxiety. Anxiety = low GABA. Easy fix.
You're right, which is why benzos are so seductively dangerous. They hit you where GABA lives, then they wipe it out, and as you go deeper and deeper into tolerance withdrawal, your Dr will simply increase your dosage repeatedly until it occurs to him that his license might be in jeopardy, at which point he'll cut you loose like a dead weight in free-fall.Supplemental GABA is nothing like a benzo at all. I’ve tried nearly every GABAergic in existence and imo nothing gives the same symptom relief as pharmaceutical benzos.
That's a really novel approach !!!! It might well be worth trying ....Benzos are mast cell stabilizers. Have you looked into mast cell meds?
Magnesium blocks the NMDA receptor, which is is major contributor to reducing a GABA/glutamate imbalance and decreasing the effects of excess glutamate in an already overloaded system, assuming that's what the issue is ....Magnesium also helps to maintain GABA in the synapse along with other nutrients such as B6.
Magnesium, in whatever form your system tolerates best (for me, it's glycinate or bisglycinate), is required for over three hundred isomeric conversions and functions. It's critical in the absorption of Vit D, which will suck up your magnesium stores like a Dyson on steroids .... there's a lot of other stuff, but the main point is that most of us are probably mildly to severely deficient in mag ....In the case of magnesium, it's used in multiple pathways, so perhaps the first amount you take is going elsewhere and you need more to improve this pathway.
Not sure what " .... antioxidants may help with magnesium...." means.Vitamin D status, B vitamins are complimentary to magnesium. Magnesium is also sensitive to toxins, antioxidants may help with magnesium. Also, could try different forms such as mag glycinate or mag chloride.
Actually, it won't. As other posters have mentioned, oral GABA doesnt cross the BBB, and while there are GABA receptors in other parts of your body, if you've been taking exogenous GABA stimulators like benzos, gabapentin, neurontin, etc, those receptors are probably also down-regulated to the point of invisibility.
So no. No easy fix here.
You're right, which is why benzos are so seductively dangerous. They hit you where GABA lives, then they wipe it out, and as you go deeper and deeper into tolerance withdrawal, your Dr will simply increase your dosage repeatedly until it occurs to him that his license might be in jeopardy, at which point he'll cut you loose like a dead weight in free-fall.
That's a really novel approach !!!! It might well be worth trying ....
Interpret that any way you want, I'm too tired and dispirited right now to argue ....I guess you will have to convince my neurons that it does not work. I
Yes. I'm quoting from extensive personal experience and trial and error, too. Years worth. Paid for at no little personal cost, but that's how you learn. My respect for 'medical texts' is nil. Once you learn how a lot of the 'research' they cram down the maw of medical believers is done, well, what more can I say.I am not sure if people are quoting medical texts about the BBB but seeing things on paper vs. personal experiences are two different worlds as I have learned by doing countless experiments
Why yes, it does. We all have our days, yes? And I'm having one, too, so I'm totally not taking it personally ....(Please don't take this as an assault to your comments, though it does sound a little angry).
This is dangerous oversimplificaton.I don’t fully understand the difference but GABA and Benzos bind different sites of the GABAA receptor complex so they have distinct effects.
You may change that view when you inevitably either decide, or are forced, to get off them.benzos are by far the most effective medication I’ve ever tried for ME symptoms.
oral GABA doesnt cross the BBB
I am not sure if people are quoting medical texts about the BBB but seeing things on paper vs. personal experiences
I don't think so, but that's just an opinion, based on something vaguely recalled that I remember reading .....
I dont think so. Taking a benzo is like taking a jackhammer to your receptors and GABA distribution/ production. But taking exogenous GABA (not chemical substitutes like Neurontin, gabapentin, Pregbalin etc) shouldnt have the same effect, which is why it cant really be substituted for benzos in the case of someone whose system has already been brutalized. It does a much gentler more organic job...So if that could maybe be the case, do you think taking exogenous GABA would still downregulate those receptors like benzos, et. al. do?
BZRAs enhance the effect of GABA by lowering the concentration of GABA required to open the GABA channel. BZRAs bind to a modulatory site on the GABAA receptor that is distinct from the GABA binding site and change the receptor complex allosterically to increase the affinity of the receptor to GABA, thus producing a larger postsynaptic current prolonging inhibition. Although BZRAs do not directly open the chloride channel, they modulate the ability of GABA to do so, thus enhancing its inhibitory effect.
And again, the issue isnt where benzos act or which modulatory site on the GABAa receptor they work through, it's their documented and known effect on endogenous GABA and their known downregulation of GABA receptors.Due to their unique binding site benzos act as positive allosteric modulators and act differently from GABA.
30 mins later, I started feeling warm, after feeling cold all morning, my urination literally stopped, my appetite came back, and despite feeling a little slowed/relaxed from the medication I had an increase in energy and even went for a little walk listening to music.
But not addicted?I’ve been completely physically dependent on benzos twice in my life