Women are relying more on 'Dr Google' than their GP .... I'm, like, totally stunned !!!!

[Rufous McKinney]

They're fun, and nobody's telling you anything that requires thought ....

laughing hysterically....

 

[Rufous McKinney]

I've found PA's to be better informed and friendly than most docs

the PA was worse than the doctors....(the one I was stuck with...).

The GP I saw down in the larger town...his waiting room was one day, 5 drug reps. One patient.

The receptionist did look fed up, as they bothered her and plied free wares in an attempt to see that doctor.

This never occurs in my doctors office. Reps would be escorted out the door by Shiela.

 

[Rufous McKinney]

Drive their merc's to the gym 4 days a week

We were required to appear at 6 am. I delivered my poor husband for his procedure.

How long is this? I'm there to wait. Oh the procedure is about an hour.

The doctor showed up at 9 am with his golf clubs, at least two hours late.

I never slept the night before. On a whole Xanax, I never went to sleep. had to stand up at 5 am, and I was profoundly sick.

by the time the one hour procedure was over at 11:30 am, I was destroyed and was sick for a month.

I no longer "attend" medical procedures my husband may require, and I cannot be his wife. How sad is that, for him?

 

[Rufous McKinney]

The question you should be asking is who cast ME/CFS as a psychologically-caused condition in the first place?

almost nobody in the U.S. casts this as psychosomatic. Not like you folks in the footprint of Viking Raids.

Additionally, they're the first point of contact in the medical system.

In the U.S.....GPs are like a referral system and a backstop for denials.

There is far too much to know- in a world which has become far too complicated, no one person can possibly know enough to even FAKE know whats possibly going on. Unless you just have the common, same old thing.

Medicine in the U.S. varies tremendously due to How they fund medical care. So for thirty years, I had HMO. They exist to deny services, to create any delays for you in obtaining the test or treatment needed. That system is entirely broken in my opinion. Large buildings exist with my insurer's name on them.

Example- I chased a bad pain once. What a mistake. Over three months. Since it felt like an ovary blowing up, I went to the gynecologist (who I could see without a formal referral/HMO). He sent me in for an ultrasound.

The technician may have been competent, yet there was never "a result". The gyn sent in another referral. that was denied. Two months I wait, to receive a letter saying I've been denied the referral, I" ve been diagnosed with Stress Incontinence (which I did not have) and told to go away. (actually it said go back to the GP)

I will therefore NEVER chase a pain, again.

My husband: it took numerous doctors, finally it was the emergency room young doctor in the beach town, understands this is a serious staph infection, obtained at a beach.

 

[Rufous McKinney]

Actually, has anyone here tried Symtoma? It is free, and studies have found Symtoma

the link went to your Guidelines...is that intended?

 

[Rufous McKinney]

That's not the doctor's fault.

My insurer refused to cover LDN...prescribed by my helpful GP

I pay for that myself, after I pay for RX drug coverage and RX drug premiums.

They refused me the Nootropic. My doctor Prescribed.

Who are they? they aren't doctors.

 

[Rufous McKinney]

Dealing with patients of all sorts is part of their JOB. It's part of their training, or used to be. If they find it 'disconcerting', imagine how the patient feels, confronted by a hostile wall of denial, rejection and denigration at the exact hands of those they're seeking help and answers from.

True: but here is a major problem- the personality types drawn to doctoring frequently lack the very bed side manners, and empthy needed to be a good doctor.

There is, of course, a percentage who are there for all the right reasons, and bless them for it.

 

[Hip]

Sounds like they just need to exercise more. Drive their merc's to the gym 4 days a week and meet up with their personal trainers, this will cure them or add prozac to their regime and learn to meditate. I almost forgot, lose some weight will help.

But isn't that the same approach to a problem that patients here are complaining that their doctors take? That is not, taking the issue seriously?

The cause of burnout is something of a medical mystery, just like ME/CFS, but it is a serious condition, and it is linked to heavy workload, too much stress, not being appreciated for one's work, not being recognized for one's achievements, being paid poorly, and other factors.

I think the the loss of the paternal status of a doctor probably contributes to burnout, as this status is part of the doctor's recognition. If patients no longer look up to a doctor, it affects their professional ego.

the link went to your Guidelines...is that intended?

Thanks, that was a mistake. I have corrected it. The link for Symtoma is: https://www.symptoma.com

 

[Hip]

And please don't mix up individuals with the whole system, they're not lone warriors, they get far more support then I ever have as a ME/CFS sufferer. I'd like to see them come round to my life stare at 4 walls and a ceiling all day, never get to see or speak to individuals for weeks on end, whilst my life filters away. And never even a phone call from someone concerned or a system to support me provided by an employer or the government.

I am very sympathetic to the conditions that many ME/CFS patients live in. I am lucky in that I live with elderly parents, so I have someone in the house. But in general my life is pretty much a void, only made more of a void because of anhedonia and blunted emotions, which means I cannot obtain much pleasure or emotional meaning from any activity. It's like being brain dead.

But I don't think that has much to do with the original topic of this thread, the lack of attention from their doctor that patients are complaining about in the article posted.

I agree that more money should be spent on the NHS. As a society, we need to forego some of the luxuries we enjoy, like holidays, entertainment, etc, and divert that money into the NHS.

 

[Treeman]

But I don't think that has much to do with the original topic of this thread, the lack of attention from their doctor that patients are complaining about in the article posted.

I was responding to the points you raised.....

However, I'm not trying to point score. I think it's well documented that pwme have had a rough deal. We all want the same thing. I agree everybody needs to be more considerate to GP's and all humans.

 

[heapsreal]

But isn't that the same approach to a problem that patients here are complaining that their doctors take? That is not, taking the issue seriously?

It's called sarcasm.

 

[Hip]

It's called sarcasm.

Sure, but I see burnout as a real problem in the medical world. We would't want airline pilots to get overworked to the point that they get burnout, because then they are more likely to make mistakes which crash airplane. Yet when doctors are reporting high rates of burnout, nobody does much about it, and it's actually patients which suffer as a result, if doctors start making mistakes or do not have enough time to spend on each patient.

I remember watching a TV documentary about a UK GP who emigrated to Australia to become a flying bush doctor. She was fed up with only having an average of 7.5 minutes to see and diagnose each patient in her work as a UK GP. She felt she could not possibly do a good job with such little time, and she found it very unsatisfying not to be able to give in-depth attention to each patient.

As a bush doctor, she would have to fly to see each and every patient, and she would get normally a full hour with every patient she saw. So she loved it, because she was able to provide a quality attentive service.

 

[lyran]

There are good doctors out there, but I have to say that I have gotten much more help with CFS from internet than from doctors. If I had just obeyed what doctors told me to do, I would be in much worse condition than I am now.

One thing I have noticed is that doctors almost never say "I'm sorry but I don't know enough of this disease to help you", they rather arrogantly say it is all in your head or psychosomatic. Maybe many of them think that if they don't understand something, it doesn't exist. The best doctor I had, was working in functional medicine.

 

[YippeeKi YOW !!]

Tylenol does nothing for pain for me. Even at four times the standard amount, its like a sugar pill. It also toxic for the liver.

Ditto. I'm baffled by why every hospital Im familiar with here in the US only has Tylenol as the low level pain medication, but I dont think it takes a genius to figure out the reasons for that ....

You might have better luck with Aleve. For me at least, it's been like a gift from heaven. I only use half a tab, and get at least 12 hours of relief, sometimes complete relief, other times considerable but not total elimination of pain. It's really been miraculous ....

It's also less deadly to the liver. You're right, Tylenol is absolute murder on the average liver ....

 

[YippeeKi YOW !!]

One thing I have noticed is that doctors almost never say "I'm sorry but I don't know enough of this disease to help you", they rather arrogantly say it is all in your head or psychosomatic

Yeah. A lot of us have stitched that into an ironic sampler, we've heard it so many times ....

Maybe many of them think that if they don't understand something, it doesn't exist

I think that it's more like an assault on their apparently very fragile egos. If they admit they dont know something, they might be exposed as less than the God-like figures many of them perceive themselves to be.

So instead of saying, "Hmmmmm .... that's a new one, lemme do some research and get back to you ....", they get angry and defensive and hostile, and make unpleasant notes in your file, like "Uncooperative patient..." or "Potential psych issues ..." or "Treatment resistant malingerer ..."

 

[Rufous McKinney]

If they admit they dont know something, they might be exposed as less than the God-like figures many of them perceive themselves to be.

Yet its their job and role to: suggest a specialist who CAN help you.

My doctor said: Go to Stanford (unfortunately, thats not feasible)

He never really ever answered the direct question: why can't you give me antivirals.

He seems to think I should have some of those. Currently I"ve not gotten to any specialists other than eyes and the eye doctors refuse to help me, which makes no sense. literally just makes no sense.

 

[Rufous McKinney]

But in general my life is pretty much a void, only made more of a void because of anhedonia and blunted emotions, which means I cannot obtain much pleasure or emotional meaning from any activity. It's like being brain dead.

that sounds very hard....I hope it can improve for you.

One component of this illness in my case, is sort of the opposite- I feel intense things extremely intensely. My emotions are amplified, not blunted.

But there is an anhedonia aspect mixed in. I know...what your speaking of.

When visiting medical doctors, I attempt to keep all this as calm as I can. But thats hard too.

 

[Rufous McKinney]

lemme do some research

I believe they NEVER say that.

Nope: never heard those words uttered by a doctor.

(edited to indicate I did suggest my doctor view the film UNREST... however, I doubt he did so, as he is busy with a young exotic wife, wine and his ongoing books he writes).

 

[heapsreal]

Sure, but I see burnout as a real problem in the medical world. We would't want airline pilots to get overworked to the point that they get burnout, because then they are more likely to make mistakes which crash airplane. Yet when doctors are reporting high rates of burnout, nobody does much about it, and it's actually patients which suffer as a result, if doctors start making mistakes or do not have enough time to spend on each patient.

I remember watching a TV documentary about a UK GP who emigrated to Australia to become a flying bush doctor. She was fed up with only having an average of 7.5 minutes to see and diagnose each patient in her work as a UK GP. She felt she could not possibly do a good job with such little time, and she found it very unsatisfying not to be able to give in-depth attention to each patient.

As a bush doctor, she would have to fly to see each and every patient, and she would get normally a full hour with every patient she saw. So she loved it, because she was able to provide a quality attentive service.

Again I was just be sarcastic.

If you read my Initial post in this thread you will see that I mostly agree with what you are saying.

But in saying that, GPs can stop taking on new pts as well reduce the number of pts they choose to see in a day and also cut back on the number of days they work. A few years back the medical centre my wife worked at had about 6 GPs, none worked full-time, most didn't work 5 days a week and the dr that did work 5 days only worked 830-12 noon.

Burnout is across all occupations but I'd say drs are in a better financial situation to manage things than most. I just picture the guy/girl working an average paying job who has 3 or so young kids, doing overtime when they can, to make ends meet, but dreads going to work. Their partner can't work because whatever they make is just chewed up on childcare. Then I imagine that same guy/girl with cfs and can only manage to work part-time but in the same situation with partner and kids and they can't find a Dr who takes them seriously or can help them in any meaningful way. The drs burnout looks alot more attractive as they have multiple options and choices that their occupation gives them, compared to average Joe.

I mostly, don't think its burnt out Drs that cfs pts come across but the list of factors in my initial post in this thread.

Don't read this reply as me being angry in anyway, just debating or clarifying my view on the Dr Burnout situation, which I'm sure happens but....

 

[YippeeKi YOW !!]

Yet its their job and role to: suggest a specialist who CAN help you.

Yes, and then that specialist comes up crickets and refers you to another specialist who has zero clues, so refers you to another specialist, who is befuddled and pissed off as a result of having to admit that there's something he doesn't know, and refers you to another specialist, who nods sagely and refers you to ..... a psychiatrist.

So several thousand dollars later, you're not only back at square one, but now you're saddled with a psych eval and if you try to dodge that, at least based on what I've read in these threads, you're labeled hostile, uncooperative and a total head case.