Vagus nerve and sleeping (sleeping on right side may be best)

[Rufous McKinney]

Caution Warning for Vagus stimulation by stretching your neck to the far right or far left...

DO NOT DO THIS EXERCISE.

I did one single thirty second stretch and it took my neck 2-3 months to recover.

 

[almost]

For years, I relied on exhaustion, taking mega-doses of melatonin, tryptophan, and other crutches to sleep. With Lactobacillus reuteri yogurt, I now sleep 9 hours every night, experience vivid dreams, and need none of these other sleep crutches to enjoy a deep and restful night of sleep. I believe that this is one effect we get with L. reuteri from the boost in oxytocin it triggers. https://drdavisinfinitehealth.com/2022/02/lactobacillus-reuteri-does-strain-matter/

I'm glad it worked for Dr. Davis (passage is from the linked article). Like all things regarding our disease/syndrome, it isn't this deterministic for all, i.e. your mileage may vary. I have made this yogurt exactly as specified with the exact strain(s) specified for several months and while I think it helped my gut a lot, it did nothing for my sleep. I am now making the SIBO yogurt recipe he recommends, and again, good for my gut but nada for sleep.

@Mary , this is a home-made yogurt. I used BioGaia® Gastrus® that I purchased on Amazon, but there are other places to get it. I use a 3-quart InstaPot to make it, using organic half-n-half and a touch of honey to get the bacteria going. Turns out very good. Strain it to get Greek style. Temperature management is crucial. If you try it, I hope it works for you.

 

[datadragon]

Is there a certain brand of yogurt you buy to get reuteri yogurt? Or do you make your own? And if you make your own, where do you buy the reuteri to make it? Any info would be appreciated, thanks!

I'm glad it worked for Dr. Davis (passage is from the linked article). Like all things regarding our disease/syndrome, it isn't this deterministic for all, i.e. your mileage may vary. I have made this yogurt exactly as specified with the exact strain(s) specified for several months and while I think it helped my gut a lot, it did nothing for my sleep. I am now making the SIBO yogurt recipe he recommends, and again, good for my gut but nada for sleep.

@Mary , this is a home-made yogurt. I used BioGaia® Gastrus® that I purchased on Amazon, but there are other places to get it. I use a 3-quart InstaPot to make it, using organic half-n-half and a touch of honey to get the bacteria going. Turns out very good. Strain it to get Greek style. Temperature management is crucial. If you try it, I hope it works for you.

Yes that passage @Mary was from Dr. Davis personal experience, not mine. There are probiotics with only lactobacillus reuteri available by the way I see. I found it interesting that A) Shank3 deficiency caused problems falling asleep even when sleepy and there are other reasons for Shank3 deficiency such as NLRP3 over activation and zinc deficiency beyond genetic causes that can overlap with ME/CFS B) That lactobacillus reuteri positively correlated with the expression of gamma-Aminobutyric acid (GABA) receptor subunits in the brain C) Lactobacillus reuteri works through the vagus nerve (as your topic mentioned ways to stimulate the vagus nerve) and releases oxytocin in the brain when active. I didnt mention that Oxytocin inhibits NLRP3 inflammasome https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-019-39349-1 or that histone deacetylase inhibitors sodium butyrate I am looking at for ME/CFS and trichostatin A were able to increase up-regulation of oxytocin receptor and vasopressin V1a receptor https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23727821/

As to @almost reply, I do agree that 'like all things regarding our disease/syndrome, it isnt this deterministic for all, i.e. your mileage may vary. In this case, that research is around autism which is primarily MALES at birth and so I added the info that there are SEX SPECIFIC DIFFERENCES. For example here it said In contrast, IL-17a and TNF-a increased in male Shank3 Knockout mice, while they decreased in female Shank3 KO mice. There are sex specific differences also in TH1 so its important to note any differences in treatment responses going forward based on sex differences https://forums.phoenixrising.me/thr...by-human-t-cells-in-a-sex-specific-way.90323/

 

[maddietod]

Is there a certain brand of yogurt you buy to get reuteri yogurt? Or do you make your own? And if you make your own, where do you buy the reuteri to make it? Any info would be appreciated, thanks!

This is from the site @datadragon linked above

https://drdavisinfinitehealth.com/2018/04/make-l-reuteri-yogurt/

If this link reverts to the main site page, you can find it by googling 'making yogurt with inulin.'

 

[BrightCandle]

Is there a certain brand of yogurt you buy to get reuteri yogurt? Or do you make your own? And if you make your own, where do you buy the reuteri to make it? Any info would be appreciated, thanks!

I have trying to do this for a while and recently came across something that really worked well.

You need Biogaia L Reuteri probiotics (https://biogaia.co.uk/collections/gut-health-for-adults/products/gastrus)

The recipe is as follows.

The first time:
Crush up a tablet of Biogaia into a powder
You need about 8 teaspoons of Dextrose per Litre of Milk
A litre of milk
Mix all of that well and put into a yoghurt maker(these can be about £20 https://www.amazon.co.uk/Stainless-...id=1692280373&sprefix=Homcom+yo,aps,77&sr=8-3 if you can find one), make sure you have sanitised it with boiling water.

Make yoghurt at 37C for 36 hours, put in the fridge and then it should be ready to eat after about 4 hours of cooling and should give you a gooey yoghurt but not firm/jelly like nor should it split.

You can use a 8 teaspoons of the previous yoghurt to make the next batch with milk and dextrose. Whole milk works better but its the dextrose they eat so apparently coconut milk also works.

I wont go over what didn't work as I have been trying to make this type of yoghurt decent for 2 years. This is the recipe, dextrose is the magic answer.


I have also confirmed with a biomesight that this has resulted in a permenant change to my biome, L Reuteri now turns up in results without taking in the yoghurt for weeks before hand.

 

[consuegra]

I have trying to do this for a while and recently came across something that really worked well.

You need Biogaia L Reuteri probiotics (https://biogaia.co.uk/collections/gut-health-for-adults/products/gastrus)

The recipe is as follows.

The first time:
Crush up a tablet of Biogaia into a powder
You need about 8 teaspoons of Dextrose per Litre of Milk
A litre of milk
Mix all of that well and put into a yoghurt maker(these can be about £20 https://www.amazon.co.uk/Stainless-Adjustable-Thermostat-Homemade-Desserts/dp/B0B2Q7LB9S/ref=sr_1_3?keywords=homcom+yogurt+maker&qid=1692280373&sprefix=Homcom+yo,aps,77&sr=8-3 if you can find one), make sure you have sanitised it with boiling water.

Make yoghurt at 37C for 36 hours, put in the fridge and then it should be ready to eat after about 4 hours of cooling and should give you a gooey yoghurt but not firm/jelly like nor should it split.

You can use a 8 teaspoons of the previous yoghurt to make the next batch with milk and dextrose. Whole milk works better but its the dextrose they eat so apparently coconut milk also works.

I wont go over what didn't work as I have been trying to make this type of yoghurt decent for 2 years. This is the recipe, dextrose is the magic answer.


I have also confirmed with a biomesight that this has resulted in a permenant change to my biome, L Reuteri now turns up in results without taking in the yoghurt for weeks before hand.

This is a helpful post. Thanks for this. What exactly were you able to determine seemed to be permanently altered in taking this probiotic? It seems somewhat difficult to have probiotic material actually colonize.

Chris

 

[BrightCandle]

This is a helpful post. Thanks for this. What exactly were you able to determine seemed to be permanently altered in taking this probiotic? It seems somewhat difficult to have probiotic material actually colonize.

Chris

I got a permenant colony of L Reuteri as shown by my biomesight test. I think the reason we have colony issues is partly dose and often a lot to do with probiotics not being human varieties of bacteria but plant ones. They have to be human derived or all they do is pass through you. Also dose matters if you just take the Biogaia pills I doubt you get a substantial colony going, 36 hour fermented yoghurt on the other hand will deliver ~125 billion CFUs.

As to the benefit of L Reuteri specifically it just seems to be clearing up the bloat and pain from my small and large intestine. Its been a gradual process over a year but now I only have two spots of problems in my large intestine that are an issue and the rest of the pain/bloat is largely gone and its reduced what I need to do with constipation. It wont effect anything else ME wise its just going to help your gut improve, widen the foods you can eat and reduce the pain and its a slow process and you'll need to keep at it.

 

[shakyradical]

vagus.net

I use a stimulator from this site (along with all the vagus exercises), I find it helpful in small doses.

 

[datadragon]

Butyrate, a metabolite of intestinal bacteria, enhances sleep​

We tested the hypothesis that butyrate may serve as a bacterial-derived sleep-promoting signal. Oral gavage administration of tributyrin, a butyrate pro-drug, elicited an almost 50% increase in non-rapid-eye movement sleep (NREMS) in mice for 4 hours after the treatment. Similarly, intraportal injection of butyrate led to prompt and robust increases in NREMS in rats. In the first 6 hours after the butyrate injection, NREMS increased by 70%. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-019-43502-1/ Something to potentially try at night.

Moreover, with an ability to cross the blood-brain barrier, butyrate activates the vagus nerve and hypothalamus, thus indirectly affecting host appetite and eating behavior https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28356427 Butyrate may have dose dependent different effects low vs high as found in rats https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24212060

Interesting that both butyrate and l reuteri are lowered via the shank3 deficiency which can happen via nlrp3 over activation such as from RNA viruses https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8009543/ or many other reasons,. Zinc regulates shank3 so a zinc deficiency can also cause the problems however nlrp3 lowers shank3 which lowers zinc uptake in the gut.

During inflammation or infection, zinc uptake levels are also lowered by also lowering levels of Shank3. we have reported expression of SHANK3 in human enterocytes, where SHANK3 was functionally linked to zinc (Zn) transporter levels mediating Zinc absorption. We detected decreased expression of Zn uptake transporters ZIP2 and ZIP4 on mRNA and protein level correlating with SHANK3 expression levels, and found reduced levels of ZIP4 protein co-localizing with SHANK3 at the plasma membrane. We demonstrated that especially ZIP4 exists in a complex with SHANK3. Zip2 and Zip4 proteins act as key players of zinc absorption in enterocytes. Low enterocytic SHANK3 levels result in diminished Zn transporter levels that could eventually explain reduced Zn concentrations in tissues and organs https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28345660/ as being discussed here https://forums.phoenixrising.me/thr...s-chronic-fatigue-syndrome.90582/post-2442240

@pattismith @LINE @mariovitali @Mary