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Tongue Issues

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Toronto
I am a Traditional Chinese doctor and I have chronic fatigue!
In clinic it is part of our practice to look at patients tongue and see how it relates to their symptoms. Then we will determine their disease pattern and provide acupuncture and chinese herbs accordingly
Swollen tongues are a sign of what we call dampness in the body, meaning usually the person is fatigued, ESP in the morning, foggy thinking, loose stools, feels cold (ESP if the coating on the tongue is white and the tongue is pale). Person feels sluggish, can have dull headaches as if head is wrapped in a bad etc.
Teethmarks often can be even on swollen tongues. Meaning is same. So please avoid cheese, raw food such as lettuce, try to eat warm food so that your stomach can digest week, drink warm ginger tea with your food.. Avoid raw juices and raw fruits and veggies ESP if with loose stools you can see undigested food in them! It s all the food you have not digested, all the energy not used by your body

Red tongues with a yellow coating are a sign of heat or inflammation in the body, person will be more thirsty, hot of course, angry maybe depending on shape of tongue and the Chinese pulse diagnosis.
 

Adlyfrost

Senior Member
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NJ
I have had geographic tongue since puberty- when all my symptoms began! I only got rid of it once- when I had a horrible virus and couldn't eat for 3 weeks. It returned when I started eating again. Grain free diets helped but I was never able to get rid of it completely again.

Finally I think I know what is causing it and will be testing my theory and keep you updated. I think all grains, legumes and food from all living things that eat grains and legumes have RNA or DNA similiar to the virus. I think the virus causing CFS survives becuase these foods are a decoy that cause an autoimmune response that weakens the lining of our gut and keeps us from fending off the virus. I am going off everything with these things in it- on a VERY strict diet of just fruits and veggies. Nothing with corn, soy, wheat, pea, legume, milk, or any food with grain or legume genetic material. I will let you know my results.
 

peggy-sue

Senior Member
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As an aside, and being a little "tongue-in-cheek", at a recent visit to the dentist, I was asked about my tongue because she thought there was something very wrong with me.
When I got home and stuck it out in front of a mirror, I was horrified to see that it was black and furry. :eek:
However, simple deduction told me it might have something to do with my morning coffee, which I make with a very high roast of beans; the "black fur" came away with judicious application of a toothbrush and toothpaste. :D

I do sometimes get a swollen tongue, I can tell because I keep biting it and I get a lacey edge to it where it is in contact with my teeth.
Also, sometimes all my fingers all swell up. Bits of me keep swelling up, same as bits of me sometimes stop working properly, or bits of me hurt.
I don't pay too much attention, it's just "a.n. other ME-thing" and it will pass in a few days.
 

tyson oberle

Senior Member
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tampa, florida
I have had geographic tongue since puberty- when all my symptoms began! I only got rid of it once- when I had a horrible virus and couldn't eat for 3 weeks. It returned when I started eating again. Grain free diets helped but I was never able to get rid of it completely again.

Finally I think I know what is causing it and will be testing my theory and keep you updated. I think all grains, legumes and food from all living things that eat grains and legumes have RNA or DNA similiar to the virus. I think the virus causing CFS survives becuase these foods are a decoy that cause an autoimmune response that weakens the lining of our gut and keeps us from fending off the virus. I am going off everything with these things in it- on a VERY strict diet of just fruits and veggies. Nothing with corn, soy, wheat, pea, legume, milk, or any food with grain or legume genetic material. I will let you know my results.
Yes please let us know your outcome. Also, where or how did you get that theory?
 

Adlyfrost

Senior Member
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NJ
My theory as I stated above is somewhat erroneous. I was just beginning to form it. I have new information now. 1)Viruses, candida and parasites weaken the lining of the gut causing inflammation. As it tries to heal itself it attacks foods that irritate it further. OR- 2) An autoimmune response to foods I listed above such as grains, dairy, legumes, nightshades, etc. causes inflammation and weakens the lining of the gut and makes one susceptible to enteroviruses, parasites and yeast.(This is the theory behind leaky gut syndrome). With either theory- it is a question of which came first- the chicken or egg? The pathogens or the food intolerances? But the results are the same. And both pathogens and the damaged gut have fixed in order to cure the tongue and CFS. The tongue I believe is a MIRROR IMAGE of the lining of the gut. Fix the tongue, fix the gut. Fix the gut get 70% of your immune system back and functioning. But it is NOT EASY! I have posted in leaky gut threads about my attempts to do this. I am making good progress so far. Will post here when I have something definitive.
 

Sparrowhawk

Senior Member
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West Coast USA
I have white coated tongue except in the middle which is not coated but is red/inflamed. Edges tooth marked. FWIW nothing I have tried has changed this over the last 18 months. I'm eating very low carb, so find it hard to believe this is yeast (I'm not eathing anything that woudl feed the yeast??) but who knows.

Adlyfrost that is an interesting theory and I look forward to learning more about your experimentation on that!
 
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Location
Europe
Have a very white tongue for more than one year now. Non smoker, not long doses of antibiotics, not a reason for this.

It came 4 months after a sexual contact with a girl of unknown status (this happened in Feb 2012). Several HIV tests (negative), Hep B negative, Hep C negative. WBC ranged from 4,500 to 5,500 (normal but low). The tongue is swollen, all white, foamy saliva, and have irritated tastebuds in the border, which are very painful sometimes (and more often in the last weeks).

Several tests all negative. Endoscopy scheduled for September and I also plan to go to an infectious disease doctor to look for answers. Three dermatologists didn't have a clue of what this could be.

By the way, tested negative for yeast through oral swab (tested neg. 3 times in different months, although the first time, in June 2012, it was positive for candida albicans - at that time I tried fluconazole and it didn't change anything).

Tongue photos can be seen below. Anyone with a similar aliment?

http://www.medhelp.org/user_photos/list/2076759?personal_page_id=2596706
 

Thinktank

Senior Member
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I've exactly the same problem!
The coating is a bit thicker on my tongue though and more dense in the back. Tongue feels a bit swollen with red tastebuds. I can't produce normal saliva and it's always foamy.

I have systemic candida, 5 different species in fact but i don't think it has to do anything with the coating. The oral swab test came back negative for C. albicans.

My best guess is bacterial dybiosis or a problem with the liver, which i have both...
Treating the dysbiosis has not helped the tongue issues so the next thing to do on my list is a liver flush.

Please do let me know what the infectious disease doc. had to say.
 
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perhaps similar symptoms but not a similar origin.

I relate all my problems to this sexual exposure (I was healthy as a horse before that happened), while you wrote before in another post "I've had asthma and bronchitis myself when i was young. All those steroids and antibiotics i received have completely messed up my whole system, leading toall kinds of chronic symptoms"

so I am not sure if we're dealing with the same problem.
 
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I have geographical tongue too since birth. Interesting!. I do get white tongue when I crash. Always go away by Kefir and extra Electrolyte supplementation, sorry but when I crash I do both so not sure which takes care of it. White tongue was one of the low potassium symptoms. I have OI also, so the need for extra potassium.
 

Adlyfrost

Senior Member
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Location
NJ
I find oral nystatin and bone broths and staying off grains, nightshades, dairy, soy, sugar or other allergens have been the best medicine for my tongue so far (and for my CFS).
 

Adlyfrost

Senior Member
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Location
NJ
Athene: I notice my tongue breaking out in bleeding geographies and herpes simplex lesions (I think they are) on my lips going hand in hand too. But I just got the sores last winter but had the GT for 30 years now. Very strange.
 

jimmy86

Senior Member
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Interesting. I got a geographical tongue with the virus infection onsetting CFS and it is there since then. I am shure once I am healthy, it will be gone....
 

she

Practically perfect
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The Netherlands
I am a Traditional Chinese doctor and I have chronic fatigue!
In clinic it is part of our practice to look at patients tongue and see how it relates to their symptoms. Then we will determine their disease pattern and provide acupuncture and chinese herbs accordingly
Swollen tongues are a sign of what we call dampness in the body, meaning usually the person is fatigued, ESP in the morning, foggy thinking, loose stools, feels cold (ESP if the coating on the tongue is white and the tongue is pale). Person feels sluggish, can have dull headaches as if head is wrapped in a bad etc.
Teethmarks often can be even on swollen tongues. Meaning is same. So please avoid cheese, raw food such as lettuce, try to eat warm food so that your stomach can digest week, drink warm ginger tea with your food.. Avoid raw juices and raw fruits and veggies ESP if with loose stools you can see undigested food in them! It s all the food you have not digested, all the energy not used by your body

Red tongues with a yellow coating are a sign of heat or inflammation in the body, person will be more thirsty, hot of course, angry maybe depending on shape of tongue and the Chinese pulse diagnosis.
Hi Nanou,
Theonly thing that helped me was TCM - I got some herbs & within 3 months I was symptoms free for about 1,5 year - just as my chinense doc said.
I thought i was cured (i did not know then I had CFS/ME). But it returned after 1,2-2 years, and due to sports& diet I crashed big time & never got well again.
I went to the TCM doc again, been there for 6 weeks and felt no change, so I chose to start LDN insteed.
I still think there is something there - got the same advice :consume only warm foodand got few herbs (do not know which) to help immuunsystem, pain, fatigue and kidnies.
Is there any chance u know which herbs these might be ?
thnx
 

A zombie

Senior Member
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gracenote

lol!! Yes that's how I feel. I think mine is related to detox too, many of my sympoms seem to scream "poisoned!!".
Anyway when I found the magic cure, I'll let you know!!
Until then ....
:tongue::tongue::tongue:
i agree, poisoned. I feel it could be detox too, but my go d, mines been going on for a year.
 
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I developed gographic tongue after developing ME/CFS/Dysautonomia. It doesn't look like white stuff normally. It is more like spots that are extra red. The rest of the tongue can look white a little depending on how white your tongue is. But that is because that is the regular part of your tongue. The spots are red.

I wonder if it is related to reflux, or just the immune system doing it more by itself in reaction to food, or plastic or something, which I've read about.

I'm eating an elimination diet, so I'm not really exposed to much though.