Supplements that Repair the BBB

[roller]

Can you heal a leaky gut without treating leaky brain? My gut is good one day and bad another. Do you get sensations and can you feel tingling in your brain? I feel this weird tingling in my brain. I'm not sure what it is.

i read somewhere, that during embryonic development the gut and the brain are made out of the same sheet.

..and shark liver oil would OPEN the bbb

..and that it has to do with tight junctions...it might be that d-mannitol (or d-mannose) would tigthen them/the bbb...

SOD superoxide dismutase has something to do with tight junctions as well, when i remember right

 

[roller]

its weird that an open BBB has to do with fatigue.

because at least until about 16 mine was definitely super-closed.
the anesthesia was pretty useless in the hospital, it took much too long,
when smoking cannabis i didnt feel anything, despite even taking more than friends.

 

[BadgerGB7]

Don't you wanna try supplements that increase gluthathione not just taking the supplements? What exotic antioidants. I'm reading, "Why Isn't My Brain Working?... but don't understand the most helpful supplements. There's so many and appreciate anyone's advise. Do you have to avoid grains to heal?

 

[BadgerGB7]

Wouldn't you want to take supplements to increase your glutathione? I'm taking some stuff but wish I knew something for my BBB. I'm really strugglign. I get this pulsing and feel weird sensations in my brain.

Has anyone ever healed leaky brain and leaky gut?

 

[BadgerGB7]

I'm taking gluthionine but get brain fogs. My doctor said to stay on grains. Any advice? Anything for brain inflammation?

 

[BadgerGB7]

I'm actually taking milk thistle to help support my liver and gluthathione.

 

[BadgerGB7]

https://www.google.com/imgres?imgur...d=0ahUKEwjZ8YOfpeLKAhUGKh4KHd4WBgMQMwghKAAwAA.

Anyone with leaky brain get this or ever see it before? Or is it a fungus? I got tested and nothing is showing up in terms of infection or anything. I'm just getting this brain tingling sensation like stuff is coming out of my brain. Any thoughts?

 

[Justin30]

Before you take any supplements to repair a leaky blood-brain barrier (BBB), you might first want to test to see if your BBB is actually leaky or not.

The GABA challenge test is a test for blood-brain barrier leakiness that can be performed easily and cheaply at home. This test uses the dietary supplement called GABA to determine if your BBB is leaky. I am not sure if this test has been properly validated by published studies, but the principle of it seems sound.

Here is some info on performing the GABA challenge test:

Thanks to @Ema for originally posting the link to the above info, on another thread.

More info on the GABA challenge test: Get The Right Diagnosis!: The GABA Challenge

Do you think this would also apply to GABAPENTIN.

For some reason I get more anxious and more headaches from taking this med, even though its used for anxiety. I used the lowest dose 100 mg.

@Hip do you think that this would be the same kind of idea or do you think its a sensitivity?

 

[Hip]

Do you think this would also apply to GABAPENTIN.

You mean using gabapentin as a test to measure blood-brain barrier leakiness? It would not work, because gabapentin can cross the BBB anyway.

The idea behind using GABA as a BBB leak test is that GABA does not normally cross the BBB. Thus if GABA provides a noticeable anti-anxiety effect, it suggest a leaky BBB. Though note this informal test has not been scientifically validated; it's just an idea.


If you are looking for a good anti-anxiety supplement, you might consider N-acetyl-glucosamine (see this thread).

 

[Justin30]

You mean using gabapentin as a test to measure blood-brain barrier leakiness? It would not work, because gabapentin can cross the BBB anyway.

The idea behind using GABA as a BBB leak test is that GABA does not normally cross the BBB. Thus if GABA provides a noticeable anti-anxiety effect, it suggest a leaky BBB. Though note this informal test has not been scientifically validated; it's just an idea.


If you are looking for a good anti-anxiety supplement, you might consider N-acetyl-glucosamine (see this thread).

Thank you for the info.

I have both supplements sitting in a bin. I will try both.

I added Reishi to my mix last night.

Was going to try Vinoceptine today but have a SIBO test tommorow which requires a bit of a fast so I dont want to shock myself to much.

I already have most supps to try the leaky gut protocol just need the Colostrum.

 

[Marc_NL]

You mean using gabapentin as a test to measure blood-brain barrier leakiness? It would not work, because gabapentin can cross the BBB anyway.

The idea behind using GABA as a BBB leak test is that GABA does not normally cross the BBB. Thus if GABA provides a noticeable anti-anxiety effect, it suggest a leaky BBB. Though note this informal test has not been scientifically validated; it's just an idea.


If you are looking for a good anti-anxiety supplement, you might consider N-acetyl-glucosamine (see this thread).

@Hip
What about PharmaGABA, is this really something different? Would this normally cross the BBB?

So far my reaction seems different to PharmaGABA and GABA.

 

[Hip]

@Hip
What about PharmaGABA, is this really something different? Would this normally cross the BBB?

According to the blurb here, PharmaGABA is GABA, but manufactured by bacterial fermentation, rather than by a chemical process. So I don't think it is much different.

If you want a form of GABA that does cross the blood-brain barrier, you might want to look at picamilon, which is a supplement / drug comprising GABA bonded to niacin (vitamin B3), which enables GABA to cross the BBB.

I've tried picamilon, and while I did not find it particularly strong as an anti-anxiety supplement, it did not seem to have any tolerance build up (unlike the supplement phenibut, which some people say is worse than benzodiazepines in terms of tolerance and withdrawal).



As an aside: I just came across this very interesting paper, which says:

It has long been thought that GABA is unable to cross the blood–brain barrier (BBB), but the studies that have assessed this issue are often contradictory and range widely in their employed methods.

Hundreds of people report that these supplements have helped them alleviate anxiety and/or improve sleep quality, in addition to other beneficial effects. Interestingly, GABA has long been thought to be unable to cross the blood–brain barrier (BBB), which raises questions about the mechanisms of action behind such beneficial effects.

Through what mechanisms do these products exert their action? Do they rely on a placebo effect only? Do they exert an effect through peripheral effects outside of the brain? Or is GABA able to cross the BBB after all?

One limitation of this field is that there have been no studies with humans that directly assessed GABA’s BBB permeability. This is not so surprising given the limited number of methods for measuring GABA levels in the human brain.

Interestingly, evidence has been found for the presence of a GABA-transporter in the BBB (Takanaga et al., 2001). The expression of such a transporter indicates that GABA can enter and/or exit the brain through facilitated transport.

In this paper we have discussed the conflicting evidence with regards to GABA’s BBB permeability. There are both a number of studies that were unable to show that GABA crosses the BBB and a number of studies that did show GABA’s ability to cross.

it is not possible at this time to come to a definite conclusion with regards to GABA’s BBB permeability in humans.

 

[Marc_NL]

According to the blurb here, PharmaGABA is GABA, but manufactured by bacterial fermentation, rather than by a chemical process. So I don't think it is much different.

If you want a form of GABA that does cross the blood-brain barrier, you might want to look at picamilon, which is a supplement / drug comprising GABA bonded to niacin (vitamin B3), which enables GABA to cross the BBB.

I've tried picamilon, and while I did not find it particularly strong as an anti-anxiety supplement, it did not seem to have any tolerance build up (unlike the supplement phenibut, which some people say is worse than benzodiazepines in terms of tolerance and withdrawal).

Thanks.
My experience with both is a bit different but this can be completely coincidental.
PharmaGABA put me in a relaxed state and made me sleep good
GABA gave me a heavy head and eyes
I will try some more in the future.

This was the GABA I tried:
http://www.powdercity.com/products/gaba-powder-supplement

I guess since I experience some effects from both that in my case they already cross the BBB (sort of BBB leak test)?

 

[Hip]

sort of BBB leak test

Either that, or as the study I quoted above indicates, it possible that GABA is transported across the BBB in even healthy people with an intact BBB.

 

[u&iraok]

i read somewhere, that during embryonic development the gut and the brain are made out of the same sheet.

Interesting! Looked it up: (bolding in article mine)
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6123986


Linkage of the brain-skin-gut axis: islet cells originate from dopaminergic precursors.
Teitelman G, Joh TH, Reis DJ.
Abstract
A population of cells containing the enzymes tyrosine hydroxylase (TH) and dopa-decarboxylase (L-AADC) but not dopamine-B-hydroxylase (DBH) nor phenylethanolamine-N-methyltransferase (PNMT) can be detected with immunocytochemical techniques in the pancreas of mouse embryos at the 11th day of development (E 11). The presence of TH in embryonal pancreas is transient: TH is not observed after E 15. By use of a method for simultaneously detecting two antigens in the same section both TH and glucagon were visualized in the same cell on E 12. Double labelled cells comprised 10% of all stained cells. At E 14.5, some of the cells stained for TH also contained insulin. However, at the time somatostatin appeared no embryonal cells containing TH remained. We conclude that two cell types of the APUD series, i.e., the glucagon and insulin cells of pancreas, arise from transformation, in situ, of cells that transiently express a dopaminergic phenotype. These results suggest that peptide-containing cells in skin, brain and gut are linked by a common embryonic origin. They also raise the prospect that other peptidergic cells of the APUD series may have aminergic precursors.

 

[frozenborderline]

According to the blurb here, PharmaGABA is GABA, but manufactured by bacterial fermentation, rather than by a chemical process. So I don't think it is much different.

If you want a form of GABA that does cross the blood-brain barrier, you might want to look at picamilon, which is a supplement / drug comprising GABA bonded to niacin (vitamin B3), which enables GABA to cross the BBB.

I've tried picamilon, and while I did not find it particularly strong as an anti-anxiety supplement, it did not seem to have any tolerance build up (unlike the supplement phenibut, which some people say is worse than benzodiazepines in terms of tolerance and withdrawal).



As an aside: I just came across this very interesting paper, which says:

Does picamilon have advantages over phenibut? I always liked phenibut but the more ill I got the more I got these odd, glutamatergic hangovers from it (had this w ghb too). I wonder if it wouldn’t cause those issues at a smaller dose but the other inconvenient thing is the amount of time it takes to kick in. It says on this site that picamilon is used for cerebral venous insufficiency so I guess low blood volume? I am always concerned about tolerance but it seems that rotating different gabaergics/gabapentinoids could be a way to get the benefits without the downsides

 

[Hip]

Never tried phenibut; I was scared away by stories of horrible withdrawal symptoms as bad as benzodiazepines can produce.

 

[frozenborderline]

Never tried phenibut; I was scared away by stories of horrible withdrawal symptoms as bad as benzodiazepines can produce.

I actually don’t think it’s much more addictive than alcohol, but you have to moderate w it and set rules. I took it for about a half year and this was as someone w a moderately addictive personality. I just followed rules like taking it two times a week max, never broke them, never experienced withdrawal despite using fairly high doses. Your mileage may vary but I was someone who had drinking problems in the past so I think it is possible to do even with an addictive personality. However the hcl form is hard on the stomach

 

[Hip]

I actually don’t think it’s much more addictive than alcohol, but you have to moderate w it and set rules.

I imagine it will probably vary a lot from one person to the next. If you look at this survey on long-term benzodiazepine users, about a third of patients had hideous withdrawal symptoms that lasted for 6 months sometimes; yet another third had no withdrawal symptoms at all.

 

[frozenborderline]

I imagine it will probably vary a lot from one person to the next. If you look at this survey on long-term benzodiazepine users, about a third of patients had hideous withdrawal symptoms that lasted for 6 months sometimes; yet another third had no withdrawal symptoms at all.

I imagine those were daily users, though? Of course any gabaergic you will use will cause awful dependence. Phenibut is not immune from that. But I’ve not heard of anybody getting withdrawals from anything less than daily use. I’m not saying it doesn’t cause dependence, I’m saying it’s not that addictive. Many people on benzos get them prescribed to take daily , without being told they cause dependence