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Sulfur and Methylation

soulfeast

Senior Member
Messages
420
Location
Virginia, US
Does sulfur excess shut down methylation? or cause a "drain" on a methylation enzyme pathway? or is the issue with sulfur for some, excess and the effects of excess? with or without SUOX polymorphism (which causes a problem with sulfur metabolism) Thank you..
 

richvank

Senior Member
Messages
2,732
Hi, soulfeast.

I think that the reason some people have a problem with sulfur-containing foods or supplements is that their SUOX reaction is too slow, so that sulfite builds up in their bodies. In many cases supplementing with molybdenum can help this, because molybdenum forms a cofactor for the SUOX enzyme. I think that SUOX polymorphisms can also be a factor. Elevated sulfite can cause headaches, rashes, breathing problems, and further depletion of glutathione.

Best regards,

Rich
 
Messages
18
Are there other things you can do to speed up SUOX reaction addition to molybdenum? I have the hetero A1298C. We don't have tests on other mutations but from my symptoms my doctors says sulfur levels are probably high and COMT is not happy either. I know my Vit. C, B6 and Glutathione are low. My histamines are going crazy, which tells me I don't have enough methyl donors to manage my histamine reactions. Is a low sulfur diet necessary or will supplementation of co-factors be enough?
 
Messages
66
See if foot baths in strong epsom salt solutions helps with your symptoms, if so, try limiting salicylates/phenols in your diet and/or add houston no-fenol enzymes to meals.
 

richvank

Senior Member
Messages
2,732
Are there other things you can do to speed up SUOX reaction addition to molybdenum? I have the hetero A1298C. We don't have tests on other mutations but from my symptoms my doctors says sulfur levels are probably high and COMT is not happy either. I know my Vit. C, B6 and Glutathione are low. My histamines are going crazy, which tells me I don't have enough methyl donors to manage my histamine reactions. Is a low sulfur diet necessary or will supplementation of co-factors be enough?

Hi, Kimfm.

I don't know if you will need a low-sulfur diet or not. It depends to some extent on whether you have upregulating SNPs in your CBS (cystathionine beta synthase) enzyme. If you do, sulfite may be more of an issue for you, and you may have to minimize sulfur intake until you can get your methylation cycle working properly. Some people have benefited from taking molybdenum at 500 micrograms per day. This is below the upper limit for molybdenum recommended by the Institute of Medicine.
As always, I recommend working with your doctor.

Best regards,

Rich
 

Vegas

Senior Member
Messages
577
Location
Virginia
Rich, what about using AKG to inhibit CDO and thus sulfites? Maybe supplement with taurine & sulfate, as tolerated to make up for what you are losing.
 
Messages
18
Thanks, I am working with a doctor. He suggested the molybdenum and the low sulfur diet. I am not sure if its the moybdenum but I am getting a tight feeling in my neck and chest after I take it. In addition, the diet is really restrictive and so I was exploring if there are other ways to support things along.

If I am not oxidizing sulfur's, should I be using Epson Salt soaks?
 

caledonia

Senior Member
From another board, I found info that a low sulfur diet may not be necessary. Instead do a low free thiol diet. This allows you to still eat meat, so is not as restrictive, but should get you to the same place. http://livingnetwork.co.za/chelationnetwork/food/high-sulfur-sulphur-food-list/

You can test urine sulfate levels with urine test strips. If you do the diet and the sulfate levels start to fall, you know it's working. http://www.ctlscientific.com/cgi/display.cgi?item_num=91329 These are not quite as sensitive as Yasko's, but much cheaper and should be sufficient.

I'm looking into this for myself. I did 23andme testing and have CBS and COMT mutations. I'm having trouble tolerating liquid/sublingual hB12 and mB12 supplementation. Haven't tried molybdenum yet.

Ironically, I've taken MSM in the past and had no problems with it. Not sure of my SUOX status. Maybe that's -/- but with CBS+ and COMT+ is why I'm having apparent sulfate/sulfite problems?
 
Messages
18
I did an epsom salt soak on my feet and seemed to have no ill effects.

Thank you for the link to the test strips, I will give those a try.

How accurate is the 23andme test? My doctor didn't recommend it because he says you can get false positives.
 

richvank

Senior Member
Messages
2,732
Rich, what about using AKG to inhibit CDO and thus sulfites? Maybe supplement with taurine & sulfate, as tolerated to make up for what you are losing.

Hi, Vegas.

That's a new one on me. How would that work? How does AKG inhibit CDO? Have you tried this and found it to work?

Thanks.

Rich
 

Vegas

Senior Member
Messages
577
Location
Virginia
Hi, Vegas.

That's a new one on me. How would that work? How does AKG inhibit CDO? Have you tried this and found it to work?

Thanks.

Rich

I understand that it acts as a structural analog. AKG, like the cysteine substrate, has a negatively-charged side chain, which is apparently necessary for binding at the active site. Homocysteine, aspartic acid, and A-Ketoglutarate do too. The analogs without the negatively-charged side chain (like Serine and the methylthioethers of homocysteine & cysteine) have no effect on the enzyme.

So apparently, AKG, aspartic acid, & homocysteine slow it down and obviously, methionine and cysteine, make it go. Interestingly, Cysteamine (from pantethine), which is also a structural analog, significantly enhances CDO without acting as a substrate. It's mechanism of action is not known. I have to wonder if this is why the large doses of pantethine picked me up when my cysteine was in the basement.

I haven't tried AKG, but it just struck me as something someone might be able to use to mitigate some of the symptoms. My plasma cysteine is apparently way up from what it was before, which is a bit of a double-edge sword when you still have mercury on board. Thiol foods are killing me, but otherwise I have the best energy I have had in a long, long time.
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caledonia

Senior Member
I did an epsom salt soak on my feet and seemed to have no ill effects.

Thank you for the link to the test strips, I will give those a try.

How accurate is the 23andme test? My doctor didn't recommend it because he says you can get false positives.

23andme is supposed to be about 97% accurate. So far I've heard of maybe two people who had one methylation SNP different when they compared it to Yasko. One was actually a false negative. Not sure what the other one was.
 

UM MAN

Senior Member
Messages
106
Location
Florida
This morning's Sulfate was >1400.....
Is there anyway that high free S, could lower PST or SAMe?
I'm going to avoid high S foods, and check my Sulfate every morning.
I supplement twice RDA Magnesium and Molyb.
 

freshveggies

Senior Member
Messages
196
This morning's Sulfate was >1400.....
Is there anyway that high free S, could lower PST or SAMe?
I'm going to avoid high S foods, and check my Sulfate every morning.
I supplement twice RDA Magnesium and Molyb.

I don't know. I checked mine and they are >1200 and I have been low sulfur for 2 months now. I don't know what is causing this.
 

UM MAN

Senior Member
Messages
106
Location
Florida
FV, my last two morning Sulfate tests were >1600, and I'm avoiding all sulfur foods and supplements.
My wife, who still eats sulfur containing foods and supplements, is <200.
Wow, how much suphate can I store?
Have you tested your blood level of sulfate?
 

freshveggies

Senior Member
Messages
196
FV, my last two morning Sulfate tests were >1600, and I'm avoiding all sulfur foods and supplements.
My wife, who still eats sulfur containing foods and supplements, is <200.
Wow, how much suphate can I store?
Have you tested your blood level of sulfate?

I have not tested blood. I am wondering where my sulfates are coming from too. Keep me posted if you figure anything out.
 
Messages
18
I received my Quantofix strips today. I am not sure how to read the results. Is anyone else using these?

If anyone else is using these, here is my question. There are 4 blocks on the strip. But when I match the results up to the back of the bottle, the top two are lighter than the bottom two. What should I be using as my reference for results.