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"Real" energy from Vyvanse, Strattera etc?

Leopardtail

Senior Member
Messages
1,151
Location
England
D-Ribose can get through the mucous membrane in your mouth, it might be worth halfing the amount (2.5mg or less), placing it under your tongue and resting the temptation to draw spittle until it gets through that membrane. It may be that bacteria in your gut are feeding on the B12 and Ribose.

Another possible issue might be low Cortisol levels, they can be associated with allergic reactions. Do you know where they are?
I wonder also have you tried Liqourice Extract? That is thought to help your body preserve the Aldosterone and Cortisol your body produces. It can cause minor stomatch upsets though.

Can you describe the 'allergic symptoms' you had with these things?
 

Ninan

Senior Member
Messages
523
I got a mild reaction from D-ribose first, started taking it sublingually instead and after a couple of weeks I got severe itching and instant diarrhea from it. So I guess it must be allergy? Same reaction to vit C and ALCAR, I took them orally (swallowing).

My cortisol is low, I have adrenal fatigue. Whole adrenal helps a bit but it has histamine in it. And I'm afraid of becoming allergic to everything that helps. Liqourice and Yohimbe helps a bit but same there, I don't want to take too much.
 

Dufresne

almost there...
Messages
1,039
Location
Laurentians, Quebec
NRI's do wonders for my blood pressure symptoms. They also work better for illness inflammation than anything I've tried. Whereas hydrocortisone had no discernible effect on my inflammation. Strange.

I've used Strattera, reboxetine, and methylphenidate. It's a complicated matter as at times I couldn't tolerate these meds, but with a few adjustments they worked very well and did things they hadn't in the past.

Several months ago I was taking fairly large doses of Ritalin and I was able to exercise and read books again for the first time in years. The thing is you can only push the receptors so far before they push back. When they did I ended up with complications that persisted for a couple months: depression, burning muscles and breathlessness with little exertion; decreased PEM threshold; and of all things, retrograde ejaculation. This last symptom is known to involve the alpha adrenergic receptor, and so I finally thought to take some reboxetine, which brought me back to baseline on all fronts.

From this experience I conclude the primary anti-inflammatory effect from these meds is connected to the norepinephrine reuptake inhibition. However I think methylphenidate and its effect on the dopamine/reward system helped raise my PEM threshold.

So in my case these drugs are ideal for symptom reduction as they work on 'sympathetic energy' as well as energy derived from their anit-inflammatory effect. But on the other hand they compromise my cellular immunity and hence my health recovery. I use them sparingly.

A nice bonus with intermittent stimulant use is I invariably receive flash solutions to the problems I've been obsessively turning over in my mind. This is especially true with the methylphenidate. For this alone it's invaluable. I don't get these insights when I'm taking stimulants regularly.
 
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Glycon

World's Most Dangerous Hand Puppet
Messages
299
Location
ON, Canada
Is it *real energy" or does it just make you overdo it, crash and burn?

Yes. :D

Strattera does neither. It is not a stimulant. In fact, it has more of a pacifying effect, if anything. And according to my doctor people don't bother prescribing it any more (at least here in Canada) because it basically doesn't work.

I have tried most legal stimulants to treat my ADHD. I currently take 45-60mg of Adderall XR daily. It is generally considered the strongest of the bunch. I've used Dexedrine and Vyvanse as inferior substitutes when I had no access to Adderall. Ritalin, Concerta, and other methylphenidates are the weakest of the stimulants prescribed for ADHD.

An article published in The Atlantic a year ago mentions a man with ME/CFS taking Adderall (off-label?) to counteract "mental torpor" (brain fog). Your mileage may vary, however.

My advice would be (1) to try extended, rather than rapid release versions first in order to minimize the "crash and burn" effed, (2) to aim low with the dosage, and (3) to take side-effects seriousl and make sure you discuss your situation and these medications with a knowledgeable physician or psychiatrist, who should also make sure to monitor you via regular blood and urine tests.
 

Sushi

Moderation Resource Albuquerque
Messages
19,937
Location
Albuquerque
Strattera does neither. It is not a stimulant. In fact, it has more of a pacifying effect, if anything. And according to my doctor people don't bother prescribing it any more (at least here in Canada) because it basically doesn't work.
Agree that Strattera isn't a stimulant. I found it extremely helpful though for orthostatic intolerance (NMH). It pretty much took it away--until it wore off and I had to take another dose.
 

Glycon

World's Most Dangerous Hand Puppet
Messages
299
Location
ON, Canada
Agree that Strattera isn't a stimulant. I found it extremely helpful though for orthostatic intolerance (NMH). It pretty much took it away--until it wore off and I had to take another dose.

If you got better, more power to you. But even assuming that Strattera is what helped (and it wasn't just placebo effect) your response could well be highly unusual.

Given that common side-effects of Strattera greatly overlap with symptoms of ME/CFS (including fatigue), I would emphatically urge caution.
 

Sushi

Moderation Resource Albuquerque
Messages
19,937
Location
Albuquerque
But even assuming that Strattera is what helped (and it wasn't just placebo effect) your response could well be highly unusual.
Autonomic specialists regularly prescribe Strattera for the type of OI that is para-sympathetically mediated. Increasing the norepinephrine in the synapses was like a total cure--until the dose wore off.
Given that common side-effects of Strattera greatly overlap with symptoms of ME/CFS (including fatigue), I would emphatically urge caution.
Autonomic specialists prescribe tiny doses. I started with 1/3 of a 10 mg capsule (yes, my autonomic specialist told me to open the capsule) every other day. It took about a month to work up to a 10 mg dose, but doing it that way I didn't have side effects.
 

Glycon

World's Most Dangerous Hand Puppet
Messages
299
Location
ON, Canada
Autonomic specialists regularly prescribe Strattera for the type of OI that is para-sympathetically mediated. Increasing the norepinephrine in the synapses was like a total cure--until the dose wore off.
Autonomic specialists prescribe tiny doses. I started with 1/3 of a 10 mg capsule (yes, my autonomic specialist told me to open the capsule) every other day. It took about a month to work up to a 10 mg dose, but doing it that way I didn't have side effects.

Never heard of this before. Interesting.

Any idea what the success rate is?
 

Valentijn

Senior Member
Messages
15,786
Strattera does neither. It is not a stimulant. In fact, it has more of a pacifying effect, if anything. And according to my doctor people don't bother prescribing it any more (at least here in Canada) because it basically doesn't work.
I agree that it's not a stimulant. If trying to use it as one, it definitely won't work :p

If you got better, more power to you. But even assuming that Strattera is what helped (and it wasn't just placebo effect) your response could well be highly unusual.
I think it would be pretty helpful for most people who have OI and low norepinephrine. My blood levels tested low twice, and I found it to be quite helpful.

Given that common side-effects of Strattera greatly overlap with symptoms of ME/CFS (including fatigue), I would emphatically urge caution.
It didn't cause me much in the way of side-effects at the lowest dose (10mg), and nothing resembling my ME symptoms. I think it made me a little shaky or something at higher doses. I switched to Yohimbe, however, since it's a lot cheaper and might more directly address the problem (ADRA2A dysfunction found in ME patients after exertion).
 

knackers323

Senior Member
Messages
1,625
Anyone know where to get any of these adhd meds online without prescription?

Its enough that we have to put up with condition without having to move mountains just to try something thats relatively harmless compared to our situation
 

Glycon

World's Most Dangerous Hand Puppet
Messages
299
Location
ON, Canada
Anyone know where to get any of these adhd meds online without prescription?

I'm pretty sure that's illegal.

Its enough that we have to put up with condition without having to move mountains just to try something thats relatively harmless compared to our situation

As someone who has been using these meds for years (for ADHD that has been diagnosed independently from ME/CFS), I must stress that they may be "relatively harmless" compared to ME, but their side-effects are not necesasrily "relatively harmless" compared to the ME symptoms they can help manage.

Stimulants won't cure you and can easily do more harm than good.
 

knackers323

Senior Member
Messages
1,625
I'm pretty sure that's illegal.



As someone who has been using these meds for years (for ADHD that has been diagnosed independently from ME/CFS), I must stress that they may be "relatively harmless" compared to ME, but their side-effects are not necesasrily "relatively harmless" compared to the ME symptoms they can help manage.

Stimulants won't cure you and can easily do more harm than good.

It may be illegal but doesn't mean its not available. It may not be a cure but any improvement would be welcome.

I have heard reports that these meds can significantly improve Peoples condition if not cure.

There is a thread on here about it somewhere
 

Glycon

World's Most Dangerous Hand Puppet
Messages
299
Location
ON, Canada
I have heard reports that these meds can significantly improve Peoples condition if not cure.

Oh, for sure! IACFSME's Primer for Clinical Practitioners even lists several stimulants among recommended medications for fatigue as well as for cognitive symptoms! (See pp. 22-23).

It could be helpful to refer your doctor to this document if you have been diagnosed or the diagnosis of ME/CFS is being considered.