Rare Coenzyme Q10 gene variations in ME patients

[Leopardtail]

Extremely He also has a dim view of Access, as it's actually pretty much a spreadsheet as well and not a proper database program. The new PC is planned to have Linux installed as we both hate Windows 7 and 8, and XP is too old to work well with the 8 core processor. Though it sounds like Windows in general doesn't utilize multi-core processors very effectively anyhow.

I need to get around to having another crack at LINUX, it may have ironed out the creases by now - medical stuff to do first though.

 

[Valentijn]

Actually, maybe I can merge approximately half of the new and old 23andMe chips' data at a time, pending my new system being set up. It might work - if having the extra patients and controls doesn't kill Excel once the merged halves are then merged together

I can only merge about 10,000 SNPs at a time, so it would take forever using Excel Maybe if I get really really really bored.

 

[SOC]

These work out cheaper then those - http://www.iherb.com/Doctor-s-Best-CoQ10-with-BioPerine-100-mg-120-Softgels/10930

Those did nothing for me, even though I took them with fat. I finally ended up with the ubiquinone in the oil-filled gel caps, which do seem to have some effect.

ETA: Sorry, I didn't look carefully enough. The ones linked are oil filled capsules. The Doctor's Best CoQ10 with BioPerine that I took was a dry powder one. I'll have to try this softgel one to see if it works for me since it is cheaper.

 

[Mij]

@SOC I was under the impression that this brand/form was oil based, it states softgels. In the ingredients list it says oil soft based gel.

 

[Mij]

http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/infocenter/othernuts/coq10/#supplement


Does oral coenzyme Q10 supplementation increase tissue levels?

Oral supplementation with coenzyme Q10 is known to increase blood and lipoprotein concentrations of coenzyme Q10 in humans (2, 12, 15). However, it is not clear whether oral supplementation increases coenzyme Q10 concentrations in other tissues of individuals with normal endogenous coenzyme Q10 biosynthesis. Oral coenzyme Q10 supplementation of young healthy animals has not generally resulted in increased tissue concentrations, other than in the liver, spleen, and blood vessels (97, 98). Supplementation of healthy men with 120 mg/day for three weeks did not increase skeletal muscle concentrations of coenzyme Q10 (99). However, supplementation may increase coenzyme Q10 levels in tissues that are deficient. For example, oral supplementation of aged rats increased brain coenzyme Q10 concentrations (100), and a study of 24 older adults supplemented with 300 mg/day of coenzyme Q10 or placebo for at least seven days prior to cardiac surgery found that the coenzyme Q10 content of atrial tissue was significantly increased in those taking coenzyme Q10, especially in those over 70 years of age (36). Additionally, in a study of patients with left ventricular dysfunction, supplementation with 150 mg/day of coenzyme Q10 for four weeks before cardiac surgery increased coenzyme Q10 levels in the heart but not in skeletal muscle (101). Clearly, this is an area of research that requires further investigation.

 

[SOC]

@SOC I was under the impression that this brand/form was oil based, it states softgels. In the ingredients list it says oil soft based gel.

You are right, I goofed.

Unfortunately, the only Dr's Best CoQ10 that is oil-based seems to be the low doses. Since I take 600-1200 mg daily, 100mg capsules just won't work for me. I took 1200 mg for several months which seemed to noticeably improve my general energy level, but that's expensive. I cut back to 600mg, which is still good, but I notice the difference. I'm considering trying 800 mg to see if that's enough to get the full effect, but the cost is still the problem.

The CoQ10 I'm taking currently is approximately the same price (11 cents per 100 mg) as the Dr's Best if I buy the 600 mg capsules in the largest packaging (150 per bottle). Needless to say, it's a costly bottle but at least it lasts a while.

I continue to remind myself that $0.66 -$1.32 per day is not much to pay for noticeably more energy.

 

[Hip]

You can save quite a bit of money if you buy Q10 as a powder rather than capsules:

NOW CoQ10 Powder at Bodybuilding.com — 28 grams for $35

Amazon.com: BulkSupplements Pure Coenzyme Q10 — 25 grams for $28

Pure CoQ10 Powder | Bulk Coenzyme Q10 | Ubiquinone — 25 grams for $34

You can get some good deals on Q10 powder on eBay too.

 

[Mij]

@SOC I've recently increased my dosage to 200mg/day and for me it seems to be a quicker recovery time. So instead of needing to lie down for 40mins, I feel I can take only a 20min break and move around again. This includes cognitive recovery from reading too much.

 

[heapsreal]

vitacost brand q10 400mg x 240tabs cost me $45, but it was a buy 1 get 1 free, normally $45 for 120tabs.
Have to try different brands and find different specials i think because q10 is probably one of the expensive supps.

 

[Hip]

vitacost brand q10 400mg x 240tabs cost me $45, but it was a buy 1 get 1 free, normally $45 for 120tabs.
Have to try different brands and find different specials i think because q10 is probably one of the expensive supps.

That Vitacost Q10 400 mg x 120 for $46 is pretty good value — around $1 per gram.

 

[adreno]

That Vitacost Q10 400 mg x 120 for $46 is pretty good value — around $1 per gram.

You have to factor in shipping costs as well, not everyone lives in The States. Iherb has $4 international shipping. How about Vitacost?

 

[heapsreal]

You have to factor in shipping costs as well, not everyone lives in The States. Iherb has $4 international shipping. How about Vitacost?

iherb is $8 for me and vitacost was $14, but vitacost seem to have regular specials on some products like buy 1 get 1 free or the second at half price etc. Nothing beats iherbs shipping cost and speed but when there is a good special it the and not in a rush for your product then shipping isnt as important.

Its a matter of keeping an eye on the specials but also shipping specials sometimes. I herb recently had a free shipping but it wasnt their usual DHL shipping and orders were taking 4 weeks.

Some products which are expensive can sometimes be alot cheaper if u cap them yourself and buy bulk powders, this was good for me with phosphatidylserine and OKG but q10 in bulk wasnt any better then the vitacost special.

Vitacost dont seem to have all their rules sorted out as they wont ship nac to australia for some reason so i mention thied to vitacost and they were going to look into it, so missed out on my buy1 get 1 free.

got to be a bargin shopper.

 

[Hip]

Some products which are expensive can sometimes be alot cheaper if u cap them yourself and buy bulk powders

Rather than capping the powder supplement yourself (which is time consuming, even if you use a capping machine), another option is to buy one of those cheap milligram digital wighting scales that you can purchase for as little as $10, and you can weigh out the powder and then swallow it with some water. I do this for several supplements I take daily. Note that some digital scales are only accurate down to 0.01 gram (10 mg), but others are better and have 0.001 gram (1 mg) accuracy.

 

[heapsreal]

Rather than capping the powder supplement yourself (which is time consuming, even if you use a capping machine), another option is to buy one of those cheap milligram digital wighting scales that you can purchase for as little as $10, and you can weigh out the powder and then swallow it with some water. I do this for several supplements I take daily. Note that some digital scales are only accurate down to 0.01 gram (10 mg), but others are better and have 0.001 gram (1 mg) accuracy.

Yes it is a pain in the butt even with the capping machine, so i only use it for the powders that work out alot cheaper then pre made capsules etc

I need to invest in a set of scales u mention, although that would really make me look like a druggy. my teenage daughter said i looked like a druggy when i was capping my supplements the other day, lol. i said to her, hey man this ornithine ketoogluturate is good shit, but dont tell the cops, lol.

 

[Hip]

I need to invest in a set of scales u mention, although that would really make me look like a druggy. my teenage daughter said i looked like a druggy when i was capping my supplements the other day, lol. i said to her, hey man this ornithine ketoogluturate is good shit, but dont tell the cops, lol.

Yeah, if the police ever searched my house, I am sure they would think I was selling illicit substances, as I have more than one digital milligram scale here.

 

[Valentijn]

Yeah, if the police ever searched my house, I am sure they would think I was selling illicit substances, as I have more than one digital milligram scale here.

Oddly we can't even seem to buy tiny measuring spoons or empty capsules in the Netherlands, without being part of a registered medical-type company. Other European countries won't deliver them here at all, though we were able to get stuff from China. Not sure if it's official policy or law, or whatever, but it was quite bizarre.

 

[Hip]

Oddly we can't even seem to buy tiny measuring spoons or empty capsules in the Netherlands, without being part of a registered medical-type company. Other European countries won't deliver them here at all, though we were able to get stuff from China. Not sure if it's official policy or law, or whatever, but it was quite bizarre.

That seems very strange that they would restrict the import of things like empty gelatin capsules. Though buying from China is often a good option; I bought my digital scales from China at a very good price.

 

[Valentijn]

That seems very strange that they would restrict the import of things like empty gelatin capsules. Though buying from China is often a good option; I bought my digital scales from China at a very good price.

We did too, in the same delivery, as an afterthought. But the scale was already unusable, due to the weighing part having been abused at some point. It only cost 10 euros, so we threw it away and gave the shipper a bad review

 

[end]

Those did nothing for me, even though I took them with fat. I finally ended up with the ubiquinone in the oil-filled gel caps, which do seem to have some effect.

ETA: Sorry, I didn't look carefully enough. The ones linked are oil filled capsules. The Doctor's Best CoQ10 with BioPerine that I took was a dry powder one. I'll have to try this softgel one to see if it works for me since it is cheaper.

These: http://m.iherb.com/Doctor-s-Best-CoQ10-with-BioPerine-100-mg-120-Softgels/10930 are the most effective softgel CoQ10 I have ever taken and the lowest price I could find - apart from opting to go the "dry powder version" and capping them yourself!

Have not felt additional improvements on doses above 400mg/day, so I stick to that dose. Good luck

 

[end]

You have to factor in shipping costs as well, not everyone lives in The States. Iherb has $4 international shipping. How about Vitacost?

True. VitaCost is a rip off for postage, when compaired to iHerbs rates. VitaCost restrict NAC, Metafolin & countless other benign products from being sent to Australia. Why?

Update: 02/08/14
VitaCost replied to my email regarding the above mentioned supplements restrictions this morning with a full paragraph of a "non answer"

"Thank you for contacting Vitacost.comwhere we take the cost out of healthy living. My name is Quaid and I will be happy to assist you.

Thanks for your inquiry. While Vitacost tries to ensure that products restricted in certain countries are unavailable for purchase by customers residing in those countries, we cannot guarantee our restriction information is always up to date.

We strongly recommend checking with your local customs authorities to make sure there are no restricted items in violation of your locations import laws."


I think having to effectively DOUBLE your shipping costs - because VitaCost do not send Metafolin NAC and other benign supplements which has you go else where, also needs to be taken into account...

@heapsreal

"iherb is $8 for me and vitacost was $14, but vitacost seem to have regular specials on some products like buy 1 get 1 free or the second at half price etc. Nothing beats iherbs shipping cost and speed but when there is a good special it the and not in a rush for your product then shipping isnt as important."

- You will find that iHerbs $8 postage is NOT the equivalent of VitaCosts $14.99 postage, as iHerbs postage is superior in multiple aspects

Vitacosts website via App had multiple deficiencies, it has been recently updated to include website registration after personal correspondence with there "CEO". Overall I think iHerb is a better option, but each to there own! Good luck