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'Natural' antiretrovirals?


Senior Member
Victoria, BC
Quercetin sounds interesting, but seems it can suppress T3 production -so watch thyroid levels, maybe (this from Glenn S. Rothfeld, "Thyroid Balance"--seems a sound book). Chris


Senior Member
sorry if this is a repeat but i started taking virgin coconut oil,2 tablespoons a day.after 2 weeks i started feeling sleepy but not that fatigue we're all too familiar with.it was the only thing different that i was taking. a friend told me it was more than likely a die-off from either canadia or one of the mlv's.oy!
virgin coconut oil is anti-bacterial,anti-fungal,anti-viral,its raises good cholesteral.good for the heart,helps with energy also contains both monolaurin and lauricidin..the list goes on.
as others have mentioned it may be finding the right personal dose so as not to feel sleepy all the time.google this product and see what it's capable of doing.
i'm also on a low dose of ldn and it has definitley helped,not a cure for me but i do have more energy.
also i take allertec which may be called provigil in the states.its for narcoleptics and releases histamine in the brain..not in the body. it helps tremendously with clearer thinking,focus and energy.this has been a great addition.


Senior Member
Has anyone else heard of Moringa as an ARV? It's been recommended to me, but I haven't been able to do much research on it yet. Apparently health workers in Africa have seen amazing results from giving it to those with AIDS. This is the most relevant info I've found on it so far; anecdotal reports that cannot be confirmed.
Moringa used to raise T-cell count in HIV

Hello Danity,

Thanks for sharing this information. I never heard of the moringa tree before but I'm busy learning about it now! When I searched the net about it, at first it appeared to be just a beautifully nutritious supplement that was supporting HIV+ people by enhancing their daily nutritional intake and, in that way, giving them a good boost. However, it was great to read the article you linked. For those who haven't read it, this article focuses on the treatment of AIDS patients who were primarily using artemisia annua with moringa to treat AIDS. One 32 woman had a CD4 count of only 34 but after 3 months with these supplements her count had risen to 280.

Do you think you will try it out Dainty? Big big big good luck if you do!

I have read in a few different online articles that it gives no side effects but this would seem unlikely for us who are already so sick and would be experiencing what looks to be an immune jolt. Any thoughts anyone?


Daughters High School Graduation
Upstate SC, USA
I'm not to sure of its antiviral properties, but as antioxidant that is "fat soluble" and has the ability to cross blood brain barrier, would this be good supplement in addition to the natural antivirals?

"Ecklonia Cava"

There are a lot of articles on the internet, but I'm not very good at sorting out the "real" evidence from the "hype". This may be better posted in a different thread and will re-post if needed. Thanks


Senior Member
Phlorotannins from Ecklonia cava (Phaeophyceae): Biological activities and potential health benefits.

Wijesekara I, Yoon NY, Kim SK.

Marine Biochemistry Laboratory, Department of Chemistry, Pukyong National University, Busan, Republic of Korea.

The importance of bioactive derivatives as functional ingredients has been well recognized due to their valuable health beneficial effects. Therefore, isolation and characterization of novel functional ingredients with biological activities from seaweeds have gained much attention. Ecklonia cava Kjellman is an edible seaweed, which has been recognized as a rich source of bioactive derivatives mainly, phlorotannins. These phlorotannins exhibit various beneficial biological activities such as antioxidant, anticancer, antidiabetic, anti-human immunodeficiency virus, antihypertensive, matrix metalloproteinase enzyme inhibition, hyaluronidase enzyme inhibition, radioprotective, and antiallergic activities. This review focuses on biological activities of phlorotannins with potential health beneficial applications in functional foods, pharmaceuticals, and cosmeceuticals. (c) 2010 International Union of Biochemistry and Molecular Biology, Inc.


Watchoo lookin' at?


A new anti-HIV flavonoid glucuronide from Chrysanthemum morifolium.
Lee JS, Kim HJ, Lee YS.

Division of Life Sciences, Korea Institute of Science and Technology, Cheongryang, Seoul 130-650, Korea.


A new flavonoid glucuronide, apigenin 7-O-beta-D-(4'-caffeoyl)glucuronide (1), and the known compound, apigenin 7-O-beta-D-glucurnoide, were isolated from the flowers of Chrysanthemum morifolium, along with five known flavonoids. The structure of 1 was elucidated by the aid of spectroscopic analyses. Among isolated compounds, apigenin 7-O-beta-D-(4"-caffeoyl)glucuronide showed strong HIV-1 integrase inhibitory activity (IC (50) = 7.2 +/- 3.4 microg/ml) and anti-HIV activity in a cell culture assay (EC (50) = 41.86 +/- 1.43 microg/ml) using HIV-I (IIIB) infected MT-4 cells.

These can easily be found at Chinese apothecaries, and are very cheap. They make a tea that some people find quite pleasant.

They are also easy to find in pretty much any garden you look at. These may not be C. moriflorum, but I think they all have the active flavonoids.

Here is a description of the TCM uses;


Coronary blood flow Effects.
Cholesterol Metabolism.
Antimicrobial Effects.Detoxifying.
Common colds due to pathogenic wind-heat, fever and headache.
Conjunctivitis with blurring of vision.
Dizziness and convulsions.
Furuncles (skin infection) and pyogenic (having pus) infections.
Hypertension.Blood Pressure Lowering.
Prostate cancer and precancerous lesions.


The flower comes in several varieties but originally the chrysanthemum was just a small yellow flower. After generations of cultivation, the number of varieties grew rapidly. In the Chrysanthemum Book of the Song Dynasty (960-1279), 35 varieties were noted but by the time of the Yuan Dynasty (1271-1368), the number had risen to 136. In Li Shizhen's famous book, "Ben Cao Gang Mu", finished in the Ming Dynasty (1368-1644), more than 900 varieties of chrysanthemum were listed. Today more than 3,000 varieties are blooming in China.
Decoct the ingredients for drinking. Yellow chrysanthemum (Hangzhou chrysanthemum) is mostly used to dispel pathogenic wind-heat, while white chrysanthemum (Chuxian chrysanthemum) is largely used to calm the liver and improve eyesight.
Nutritional Value:Chrysanthemum contains a volatile oil with such ingredients as borneol, camphor,chrysanthemum amino acids,also contains chrysanthemin, adenine, stachydrine, micro-vitamin A, vitamin B1, amino acids and acaclin,etc.
Dosage:5-12 grams or 10-15 grams.Chrysanthemum may be drunk as an infusion, 200 ml (8 fl oz), taken three times a day. The Chinese dosage is 4.5 - 15 g (1/4 - 3/4 oz).

Safety and Toxicity:

Acute toxicity.Chrysanthemin.LD50-lethal dose,50 percent kill.Intraperitoneal.Rodent-rat.2 gm/kg.Details of toxic effects not reported other than lethal dose value. Safety:Those who are weak or have diarrhea should not use chrysanthemum flower.

ETA: A decoction (rather than infusion) is recommended. This means you should actually boil the flowers to extract the active compounds. Simply steeping them after removing the water from the heat (like tea) won't really do the trick.


Watchoo lookin' at?
As an integrase inhibitor, it could be used as a 'poor man's' substitute for raltegravir in a HAART regimen. Ralt is the most expensive (by a huge margin) of the three so far shown to be effective.

Now I am debating whether to start trying this, or to wait till more is know so as to avoid developing drug resistance.


Watchoo lookin' at?
I just found this very interesting work, I can't see it anywhere else on thus thread so I will post it. It's a very long document, so I will just post the title, authors and link here.

Naturally Derived Anti-HIV Agents

Kaleab Asres1, Ameha Seyoum1, Ciddi Veeresham1, Franz Bucar2 and Simon Gibbons3*
1Department of Pharmacognosy, School of Pharmacy, Addis Ababa University, P.O. Box 1176, Addis Ababa, Ethiopia
2Institute for Pharmaceutical Sciences, Department of Pharmacognosy, University of Graz, Universitaetsplatz 4/1, A-8010 Graz,
3Centre for Pharmacognosy & Phytotherapy, The School of Pharmacy, University of London, 29/39 Brunswick Square, London
http://www.fiocco59.altervista.org/nacci/anti-AIDS plants.pdf


Senior Member
Great Plains, US
natural Actos

In case anyone is interested, I did some research into natural alternatives to the drug Actos, which Dr. Shoemaker often gives to people with Lyme Disease. The supplement PGX appears to do one of the things Actos does -- it prevents insulin spikes after eating.

I just thought I'd add this since Dr. Deckoff-Jones' daughter Ali has been taking Actos.


Senior Member
forebearance, great idea, thanks for sharing, I am putting PGX on my grocery list. I took that for awhile last year, forget why, it was supposed to have some health benefit for cfs, maybe its just what you said, but i sort of freaked out today when I tried on some old dress pants and couldnt zip them up, I remember when they hung off me 5 years ago! wth, pgx worth a try :)
Thanks forbearance! I thought Shoemaker was just using Actos to regulate leptin levels, but at the site below, it says "Treatment for biotoxins will often incorporate targeted gene therapy using Actos. Actos is a drug approved for the treatment of diabetes that also has a significant number of benefits for those with biotoxin-associated illness. Beyond being anti-inflammatory, Actos lowers leptin, lowers MMP9, raises VEGF, and positively affects other markers not discussed in the scope of this article. It is one of the most important interventions known in treating biotoxin illnesses."

It goes on to say Actos can prevent a cytokine storm (but I'm sure other natural anti-inflammatories can deal w/that, too).



Senior Member
Great Plains, US
You are very welcome! You're supposed to take PGX with meals to prevent insulin spikes. Last year I tried some on an empty stomach, because it is soluble fiber, after all. I hoped it would suck up biotoxins. It worked so well it was actually too strong for me! I would have to get some in powdered form so I could take a smaller dose.

Sorry for the digression. Back to antiretrovirals.


Senior Member
I have an anti xmrv protocol of sorts I recently started, any comments?

FunkOdyssey said:
Here's what I've come up with, I've taken all of these things individually before but never in combination or for any sustained length of time.

EGCG 400mg tid
Quercetin 500mg tid
Resveratrol 300mg tid
Curcumin (BCM-95) 400mg tid
OLE (whatever I can tolerate, up to 1000mg of 20% oleuropein 5x daily)

There's some interesting synergy between those polyphenols as far as increasing the bioavailability of each other. I started all of those except the OLE which I'm scared of and am going to wait until the weekend for. I'm also going to incorporate Lauric acid, either as macaroons, coconut oil, or a combination of the two.

Other things I'm taking that aren't directly anti-viral but support immune health:

Whey Protein (large amounts)
Selenium 200mcg
Vitamin C Time-Release 1000mg tid
Vitamin E mixed tocopherols/tocotrienols
Vitamin D 4000iu
Moderate DHA / Low EPA Fish Oil 250mg/100mg bid
CoQ10 100mg bid
Alpha Carotene / Beta Carotene 4mg/6mg bid
Leutein / Zeaxanthin 20mg/1mg qd
Lycopene 15mg qd
Astaxanthin 6mg bid
Zinc 30mg qd
Magnesium malate 140mg tid
Acetyl-L-Carnitine 500mg tid
Escitalopram 5mg (natural killer cell activity)
Mirtazapine 30mg (slow wave sleep enhancement)

We'll see what happens.


Senior Member
Great list, Funkodessey

Had a quick look and some of the things on your list make my symptoms much worse and don't ever improve over time - whey protein, OLE for example, fish oils. But you are already taking them (not the OLE) so they obviously don't have that effect on you.

Quite a few other things I've taken in the past but have noticed no good effects (or too little good effects) so gave up as I have difficulty swallowing tablets and digesting them / not enough money (Escitalopram, magnesium m, zinc, al-carnitine, lycopene, co10)

Wishing you all the very best and hope that the OLE doesn't make your stomach too painful or sick!



Senior Member
There's a lot of discussion about Lauricidin at the beginning of this thread. Has anyone tried it since then? If so, what have your experiences been?

Also, right now I'm taking a product called Rizols Gamma, which is an "ozonated oil" with herbs (clove, artemisia, walnut) that's supposed to treat Lyme and some co-infections. I think I like it, but it's quite strong! (The people on the Lyme boards often have a hard time taking even one drop.) Klinghardt recommends it, and I learned about it from a doctor who was Klinghardt-trained.

There's also a product called Rizols Zeta, which is supposed to treat various viruses. It has clove, artemesia, walnut, black cumin and moxa in it. Does anyone have any thoughts about whether it might be appropriate for retroviruses?

Thanks, Lisa


Lisa...I haven't made it beyond Monolaurin, which is just a lower dose of the Lauric acid (with a low dose of Inosine) found in both. Monolaurin has a very noticeable impact on my symptoms, but I haven't stuck with it long enough to give a good review. I can only say that I would recommend starting out low dose....and I have heard this from others as well.


Senior Member

I followed Klinghardt's Rizol protocol for some time, and they didn't do much for my retrovirus (I say my because there are multiple strains and some may be more easily treated than others). If you're looking into herbs for retroviruses, I would look at Raintree formulas or something with mistletoe.