Methionine/b6/b12/mfolate supplimentation Vs Sam-e

[Adster]

Sam-e really helps me, in many ways. Energy, joints, mood and overall wellbeing. It does however affect my sleep, and also in doses above ~200mg makes me spacey and "detached". I was thinking about dropping the sam-e, going back one step in the cycle and trying supplementing methionine. Does anyone have any thoughts or experience in this? I'm on 25mg of p5p, 2mg of mb12, 400mcg of methylfolate, plus mg, zn, taurine, C, occasional multi b(no folic acid). Is L-methionine the form to take? Thanks

 

[richvank]

Sam-e really helps me, in many ways. Energy, joints, mood and overall wellbeing. It does however affect my sleep, and also in doses above ~200mg makes me spacey and "detached". I was thinking about dropping the sam-e, going back one step in the cycle and trying supplementing methionine. Does anyone have any thoughts or experience in this? I'm on 25mg of p5p, 2mg of mb12, 400mcg of methylfolate, plus mg, zn, taurine, C, occasional multi b(no folic acid). Is L-methionine the form to take? Thanks

Hi, Adster.

L-methionine is the feed material for the methylation cycle. If you are low in methionine, yes, it's a good idea to supplement it. It's important that you are supplementing the substances needed by the methylation cycle and the transsulfuration pathway, so that the homocysteine that is generated will not build up. People who supplement methionine when they are low in the B vitamins can endanger their health by raising homocysteine.

Best regards,

Rich

 

[Adster]

Are there symptoms of elevated homocystein? Is it possible to have all the precursors in place by supplementing, but still not make enough Sam-e?

Thanks for your time Rich, much appreciated!

 

[richvank]

Are there symptoms of elevated homocystein? Is it possible to have all the precursors in place by supplementing, but still not make enough Sam-e?

Thanks for your time Rich, much appreciated!

Hi, Adster.

Elevated homocysteine is a biomarker for cardiovascular disease occurring over time, but I am not aware of observable symptoms early on.

Yes, if there are serious polymorphisms in enzymes associated with the methylation cycle, the production of SAMe can be hindered. However, if we are talking about a person who was healthy earlier in their life, and then developed ME/CFS later on, it is not likely that they have serious genetic polymorphisms of this type.

I favor doing some testing in cases in which puzzling things are happening. The Health Diagnostics methylation pathways panel combined with the Metametrix plasma 40 amino acids panel will go a long way toward sorting out what the issues are. Given what you have reported, I would suspect low methionine. This can be caused by a diet low in methionine or problems with protein digestion and/or amino acids digestion by the digestive system.

Best regards,

Rich

 

[Valentijn]

Elevated homocysteine is a biomarker for cardiovascular disease occurring over time, but I am not aware of observable symptoms early on.

Depending on what causes the high homocysteine, could symptoms of underlying vitamin defincies, etc be helpful? It sounds like B12 deficiency only has pretty vague symptoms, but folate has a few according to wikipedia, and B6 can include quite a few as well. Some symptoms (MSG/E621 induced migraines, seborrhoeic dermatitis, intertrigo) I've had for over a decade prior to getting M.E.! Pretty hard to put together "migraine and skin problems" and come up with a likely shared cause though, especially since they're both really common and treated (though not cured of course) seperately.

 

[Adster]

Thanks for the help. I've ordered some methionine to try. I've been on a lower dose of SAM-e now for 4 days, 133mg down from 200mg. My head is clearer, but it was clearly really helping my body. My joints are becoming much more painful and I have less strength. Actually quite amazing the difference after such a short time and not a huge change in dose.

 

[Adster]

Quick question Rich if you have time(or anyone that knows) - could the SAM-e be giving me more energy because it frees up some ATP by not using it to make SAM-e in the body?