Is it important to go to sleep before midnight?

[sensing progress]

I've read some articles saying that it is important to go to bed before midnight. My nutritionist told me before that I need to go to bed earlier to allow my adrenals to heal. I also found this somewhere on Dr. Myhill's site and made a note of it:

The average daily sleep requirement is nine hours, ideally taken between 9:30 pm and 6:30 am, i.e., during hours of darkness, but allow for more in the winter and less in the summer. An hour of sleep before midnight is worth two after – this is because human growth hormone is produced during the hours of sleep before midnight.

Can anyone speak to this? I usually go to bed after midnight, get lousy sleep, but late in the day is usually when I feel my best so want to stay up. I've tried, but I never can seem to reset to a "normal" sleep schedule.

 

[LaurelW]

It definitely works that way for me, but my S.O. never goes to bed before 2 a.m. and usually later--that seems most comfortable for him. I dunno!

 

[Sasha]

I attended a sleep clinic at a major hospital for an overnight study and was told by the specialist that we need 7 hours of sleep a night, but that most people falsely believe we need 9 hours.

I wonder what evidence there is for the various estimates. That's a very interesting question you're asking about sleep timing.

 

[Rafael]

I got same adrenal story when going through my daily schedule with my specialist.
I started going to sleep an hour earlier and it definitely helped.
Also I noticed a difference for the worse on days when I was tardy going to bed.
I am embarrassed to tell you night owls when I go to sleep.. but I get up at 6:00.
Also was important to actually lie down completely (horizontal) a bunch of times (# depends on your energy level, right) through the day for, say, 15 min... for longest time I was just resting in chairs ... not same thing.

Gotto go away for a few days so I can't defend my post, sorry.

 

[Sasha]

I got same adrenal story when going through my daily schedule with my specialist.
I started going to sleep an hour earlier and it definitely helped.
Also I noticed a difference for the worse on days when I was tardy going to bed.
I am embarrassed to tell you night owls when I go to sleep.. but I get up at 6:00.
Also was important to actually lie down completely (horizontal) a bunch of times (# depends on your energy level, right) through the day for, say, 15 min... for longest time I was just resting in chairs ... not same thing.

Gotto go away for a few days so I can't defend my post, sorry.

I went through a phase of virtuously going to bed at 11pm and also found myself waking naturally at 6am and not being wiped, amazingly. My sleep is chemically assisted with Pregabalin (Lyrica), don't know if that makes any difference. But previously I'd be sleeping ten hours and waking up feeling like death. It hasn't been completely reliable, though.

I should have gone to bed ten minutes ago!

 

[LaurelW]

My S.O. and my nephew think that they both have something called Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome. There's a wikipedia entry on it. Not only does it include the propensity to go to bed really late, they end up going to bed later and later because of being on a 25-hour cycle. The cure is supposed to be very low dose melatonin (.3-.5 mg) and light therapy. My nephew did this and now he has a regular sleep schedule.

 

[Wonko]

used to be 27hr cycle for me - no idea these days, as I havnet kept track for years, but it's longer than 24hrs - so my sleep problems could be easily cured by moving to a different planet - or gettign this one to spin slower - I'm easy - which evers easiest

as for the midnight thing - rationally it shouldnt make a difference but it does - in fact the best sleep cycle I found for me was 4pm-1am - felt better, was more productive, but impossible to maintain in the real world

 

[heapsreal]

how do u go to sleep before a certain time if u cant sleep. i try to go to bed before 10 but this is with medication, without meds i have had some crazy sleep cycles and gone extended periods without sleep and felt like death warmed up.

cheers!!!

 

[Sallysblooms]

People are different, but I do try to get in bed by 10:30. I sleep at least nine hours a night and I nap also. Sleep is when we heal so I try to do all I can to get plenty. I listen carefully to my body.

 

[caledonia]

I've read some articles saying that it is important to go to bed before midnight. My nutritionist told me before that I need to go to bed earlier to allow my adrenals to heal. ...An hour of sleep before midnight is worth two after...yadda yadda yadda

Lol - I just got told the same thing by my naturopath just yesterday. I also have horrible adrenal problems. They said I have just about the worst adrenal results they've ever seen - very low and flat, slight rise at night. Night time is definitely the right time for me.

I also had the added problem of a moving sleep cycle - moving forward as much as an hour per day. I've finally conquered that by discovering I have a corn allergy and totally and completely avoiding all corn. There can even be corn in your meds (cornstarch). I'm getting my Armour Thyroid compounded because of that.

I've tried every supplement there is for adrenals and I can't tolerate enough of them to make a difference. Now they want me to try Cortef. First I have to get that compounded too because of, you guessed it, cornstarch. Here's hoping I will be able to tolerate Cortef because otherwise, I'll be up the creek without a paddle.

By the way, something wierd/cool I've noticed at night - I can actually see my fingernails grow at night. I look down and it's like - sproing! - they've grown a 1/16 of an inch all of a sudden. This happens regardless of where my sleep cycle is.

 

[L'engle]

I think healthy people probably need 7-9 hours, but I know I need at least 10, and usually bookended by a couple of hours lying down on the end/beginning of that, plus sometime more lying down in the day due to OI/POTS. I've heard of delayed onset sleep phase. People who have that without CFS go to bed late and get up late, but the difference is, they can function that way because their sleep is restful. My brother has that, and though he doesn't like the schedule it puts him on, he is OK to go to work every day without feeling ill. A person with CFS may or may not have delayed onset sleep phase, but either way, our sleep is less restful, so we likely need more of it.

The sleep doctor I saw said it wasn't so much when you got the sleep, as long as you get deep restorative sleep. So I would think if you try getting up earlier and it makes your symptoms worse, then it is better to sleep when it is natural for your body. I tend to feel awful if I try to stay up past 10-11pm... but I also can't get up early. I think my earlier sleep hours are better than the later ones, but I need the later ones as well.

I would see if going to bed earlier improves your symptoms or not and go from there.

 

[heapsreal]

agree, i function best of 9-10hrs sleep. ive had 6 hours sleep last night and now face 10hrs at work, aarrrggghhh. i think in a previous post talking about sleep meds i stated how well its been going and i said touch wood, the touch wood didnt work, bugger.

cheers!!!

I think healthy people probably need 7-9 hours, but I know I need at least 10, and usually bookended by a couple of hours lying down on the end/beginning of that, plus sometime more lying down in the day due to OI/POTS. I've heard of delayed onset sleep phase. People who have that without CFS go to bed late and get up late, but the difference is, they can function that way because their sleep is restful. My brother has that, and though he doesn't like the schedule it puts him on, he is OK to go to work every day without feeling ill. A person with CFS may or may not have delayed onset sleep phase, but either way, our sleep is less restful, so we likely need more of it.

The sleep doctor I saw said it wasn't so much when you got the sleep, as long as you get deep restorative sleep. So I would think if you try getting up earlier and it makes your symptoms worse, then it is better to sleep when it is natural for your body. I tend to feel awful if I try to stay up past 10-11pm... but I also can't get up early. I think my earlier sleep hours are better than the later ones, but I need the later ones as well.

I would see if going to bed earlier improves your symptoms or not and go from there.

 

[Mya Symons]

I actually feel worse if I get too much sleep. I meant to talk to my doctor about this because it is strange. I feel the best if I do not get more than 8 hours sleep or less than 7, so I force myself to wake up earlier or stay up late. For some reason when I get more than 8 hours of sleep I have a harder time sitting up and standing up during the day. I will get more dizziness and black spots in my vision when I stand up. Also, my heart will beat faster and I sweat. This also happens with too little sleep. So I guess for me, it is better sometimes if I stay up past 12 p.m.

 

[serenity]

i try to head to bed at 11pm but this often gets pushed, i stay up as late as i want & my sleep doc doesn't seem to care - but i need at LEAST 10 hours & usually more like 12 or more.

 

[Sing]

used to be 27hr cycle for me - no idea these days, as I havnet kept track for years, but it's longer than 24hrs - so my sleep problems could be easily cured by moving to a different planet - or gettign this one to spin slower - I'm easy - which evers easiest

as for the midnight thing - rationally it shouldnt make a difference but it does - in fact the best sleep cycle I found for me was 4pm-1am - felt better, was more productive, but impossible to maintain in the real world

Hi Wonko,

You made me laugh! It is getting harder and harder for anyone to do. I am becoming a clamp jawed, tight lipped older person on a tough slog.

I ought to be camping out, lying on the earth and going to sleep at 9:30, but instead I stay up to at least 11. I wake up once or twice, then, for the day just before dawn, because my eyes have become so light sensitive. I see the most heart touching and beautiful dawns, but then I drink coffee throughout the day to stay as alert as I am going to get.

I am almost never able to go to bed at an earlier hour. When I do, I feel better! What is the matter with me? My brain got set in an 11 pm to 7:18 am sleep pattern for years and years. Now I can't seem to give up the 11 pm part, even though I am waking two hours earlier. Part of this resistance to bedtime is also negative anticipation. I am slightly awake a lot of the night, just enough to feel the pain in my body. I don't want to go to bed because I will have to go through this again.

 

[Victoria]

In recent weeks/months I've slept the most restful sleep in years. I put it down to .......

1. Not working (quite Feb 2010 due to chronic ill health)
2. No Stress
3. No Stress
4. No Stress
5. No Stress
6. Getting my life back
7. A new Bed, doona etc
8. More fresh air
9. Plenty of regular, slow walking & enjoying myself (took me quite a while to work up to 2-3 hours of slow walking 4 times a week I might add).
10. No Stress
11. No Stress
12. No Stress
13. No Stress

And finally, letting go of Anger & negative emotions.

And most importantly, being Happy for the first time in the last 20+ years (despite pain, fatigue & chronic health problems).

Being Happy, Pacing my day, doing whatever I want (up to financial limitations) whenever I want, getting up around 8.30-9.30 (when my body feels it's had enough restful sleep).

Everyone is different.

You need to find your own rhythm (or cycle) & try to stick to it.

 

[Sing]

Victoria, what a wonderful message!

It is not only what you say but how--it is all of one piece, and so I feel it...

Sing

 

[L'engle]

I actually feel worse if I get too much sleep. I meant to talk to my doctor about this because it is strange. I feel the best if I do not get more than 8 hours sleep or less than 7, so I force myself to wake up earlier or stay up late. For some reason when I get more than 8 hours of sleep I have a harder time sitting up and standing up during the day. I will get more dizziness and black spots in my vision when I stand up. Also, my heart will beat faster and I sweat. This also happens with too little sleep. So I guess for me, it is better sometimes if I stay up past 12 p.m.

Hi Mya,

I would guess that this is something to do with OI/POTS. The other side of orthostatic hypotension(standing up low blood pressure) can be supine hypertension (lying down high blood pressure), where your body can't tolerate lying down either! I wonder, do you sleep with your head flat or with your head raised? My head feels better if I sleep with it raised several inches above the level of my bed. Actually my upper back and shoulders are also raised up, there's so many pillows. I think that makes the strain of being more upright during the day less dramatic. Sometimes I think it would be best if I could somehow do everything in life at a 45o angle!

 

[*GG*]

I actually feel worse if I get too much sleep. I meant to talk to my doctor about this because it is strange. I feel the best if I do not get more than 8 hours sleep or less than 7, so I force myself to wake up earlier or stay up late. For some reason when I get more than 8 hours of sleep I have a harder time sitting up and standing up during the day. I will get more dizziness and black spots in my vision when I stand up. Also, my heart will beat faster and I sweat. This also happens with too little sleep. So I guess for me, it is better sometimes if I stay up past 12 p.m.

Do you have dysautonomia?

 

[*GG*]

I've read some articles saying that it is important to go to bed before midnight. My nutritionist told me before that I need to go to bed earlier to allow my adrenals to heal. I also found this somewhere on Dr. Myhill's site and made a note of it:



Can anyone speak to this? I usually go to bed after midnight, get lousy sleep, but late in the day is usually when I feel my best so want to stay up. I've tried, but I never can seem to reset to a "normal" sleep schedule.

I totally relate to this, Do you take any sleep meds?