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I think that is probably good advice. Is think minimizing risk is important for people in very poor health such as ME/CFS patients.
Incredible improvements with Helminthic Therapy
- Thread starter Gyre
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I think that is probably good advice. Is think minimizing risk is important for people in very poor health such as ME/CFS patients.
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Good luck man. Just remember that helminthic therapy takes time. No one likes to wait and least of all myself, but give it at least three month to show any effect.
ChookityPop
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Wow. This was a fascinating read for sure. Anyone else tried this?
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Would anyone in the US or Australia be willing to help DHL/UPS some worms for me? I got two orders stuck in limbo for six months and I'm looking for options since regular mail isn't working. I will reimburse whoever is doing it for their time and cost and I'll send money upfront.
Cipher
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Hey guys, quick update.
I have not had much trouble with handling the 3NA, I was quite surprised actually since I am usually so sensitive to treatments, especially so when it affects the immune system.
I didn't keep a detailed log but just took note of times when I was different to baseline.
There was about 5 days of feeling much more tired than normal and wanting to spend more time in bed and not able to talk much from day 9 to day 14. Then bounced back to baseline.
Then in week 5 I had another couple of days of being much more tired again.
After that, nothing much else to report. Haven't had any improvements either, but most people seem to suggest not to expect that till at least after 3 months.
I've finished 11 weeks, usually you wouldn't redose for at least 12 weeks, but since I've handle it fine, I re-dosed already. I took 6 NA this time. Will post more updates when I have something to report.
I have not had much trouble with handling the 3NA, I was quite surprised actually since I am usually so sensitive to treatments, especially so when it affects the immune system.
I didn't keep a detailed log but just took note of times when I was different to baseline.
There was about 5 days of feeling much more tired than normal and wanting to spend more time in bed and not able to talk much from day 9 to day 14. Then bounced back to baseline.
Then in week 5 I had another couple of days of being much more tired again.
After that, nothing much else to report. Haven't had any improvements either, but most people seem to suggest not to expect that till at least after 3 months.
I've finished 11 weeks, usually you wouldn't redose for at least 12 weeks, but since I've handle it fine, I re-dosed already. I took 6 NA this time. Will post more updates when I have something to report.
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I appreciate the effort, but as far as I know there is no other supplier that does DHL either. So considering the current pandemic they would all have the same problem? I would love to find out I was wrong however so if I have missed anything please let me know.
Cipher
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I'm curious to know more about what happened with the packages? Have 2 different packages from 2 different providers not arrived in 6 months? What does the tracking information say?
Have you asked all of the providers in the list if they can send using either DHL, UPS or FedEx?
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I'm in Sub-Saharan Africa. I think if I was in the US or Europe I'd be fine. The suppliers are telling me that the customers within the same continent are recieving the packages albeit a bit slower than usual. Also I've found someone in Europe that is willing to re-ship it for me so I think I should be okay now.
Oh, yeah I could see that it could be more difficult getting it to where you are. Hope your contact is able to get it to you. Have you thought about trying your hand at incubating your own NA?
It's now been 8 weeks since my second inoculation (6 NA). This time has been even easier than last time (3 NA) with not even a few days of being more tired than baseline. Obviously I am not the norm when it comes to how most CFS patients react, so I'd advise people to still be very cautious when beginning therapy and start with a low dose of 3NA.
I also still haven't had any benefits from the therapy, but as many have told me, it could take quite awhile. Some people, with some conditions, don't get the benefits until in their 2nd year or even close to the end of the 2nd year, but then suddenly start feeling a lot better. Obviously it would be preferable to get an indication much earlier. So I'm just going to keep redosing every 3 or 4 months, and hope something changes down the track. Will keep you updated if I have any improvements.
I also still haven't had any benefits from the therapy, but as many have told me, it could take quite awhile. Some people, with some conditions, don't get the benefits until in their 2nd year or even close to the end of the 2nd year, but then suddenly start feeling a lot better. Obviously it would be preferable to get an indication much earlier. So I'm just going to keep redosing every 3 or 4 months, and hope something changes down the track. Will keep you updated if I have any improvements.
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Hi again.
It’s been 15 weeks since my 2nd inoculation (6NA).
I still don’t have any improvements in symptoms but as yet I am still to test if my body’s immune reaction to certain things has been lowered yet.
I had a bit of a set back to my health and have had to hunker down a lot the last few weeks. However I had pushed myself a lot when I went away for a week so it makes sense to connect that with that rather than the worms. Although , there was a sense of being a little bit more tired for a week before hand. I am starting to feel a bit better now. I decided not to increase my dose this time just to be safe. So I will be taking my next dose of 6 NA today.
It’s been 15 weeks since my 2nd inoculation (6NA).
I still don’t have any improvements in symptoms but as yet I am still to test if my body’s immune reaction to certain things has been lowered yet.
I had a bit of a set back to my health and have had to hunker down a lot the last few weeks. However I had pushed myself a lot when I went away for a week so it makes sense to connect that with that rather than the worms. Although , there was a sense of being a little bit more tired for a week before hand. I am starting to feel a bit better now. I decided not to increase my dose this time just to be safe. So I will be taking my next dose of 6 NA today.
Daffodil
Senior Member
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@BenFromNZ any updates? what people say....dont expect improvements for 3 months...some take 2 yrs...exactly what i have found with FMT.
a couple of people in other groups are urging me to try helminths so i am curious. i havent found THAT many improvement testimonials with helminths for me/cfs. There are many for RA it looks like.
a couple of people in other groups are urging me to try helminths so i am curious. i havent found THAT many improvement testimonials with helminths for me/cfs. There are many for RA it looks like.
cheeseater
Senior Member
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Extensive NIH article on hookworm therapy. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6799527/
12 week mark
I inoculated 20 NA exactly 12 weeks ago. Didn't get any benefit through this period for my cfs, except for the period between day 11-18, when I could do 30% more than I usually do and in day 11 I woke like I had no fatigue (and in the hyperactive mode), full of energy, but it lasted only a few hours.
[Maybe it was only the effect of continuous dose of prednisone, that I used to alleviate side effects]
Since day 18 beside I haven't had no benefit, I still have varying levels of side effects (currently mild) . So, I'm terminating my colony today.
I inoculated 20 NA exactly 12 weeks ago. Didn't get any benefit through this period for my cfs, except for the period between day 11-18, when I could do 30% more than I usually do and in day 11 I woke like I had no fatigue (and in the hyperactive mode), full of energy, but it lasted only a few hours.
[Maybe it was only the effect of continuous dose of prednisone, that I used to alleviate side effects]
Since day 18 beside I haven't had no benefit, I still have varying levels of side effects (currently mild) . So, I'm terminating my colony today.
Cipher
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Consistent improvements from NA can begin anytime from 3 to 24 months according to the helminthic therapy wiki. It seems premature to make a conclusive evaluation after just 12 weeks.
There's a known phenomenon called the 'bounce' that can happen around that time:
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i found the dose has a much bigger impact than initially thought, especially with me-cfs. i only dosed with 3NA for the first 10 months (maybe 4 doses with 3NA each) and had a much better effect than with the 5NA i took last time (basically no improvement). so even just two worms make all the difference for me.
edit: my best guess in regards to the bounce is the type 2 immune response can be triggered just from a disruption of the epithelium (skin) alone (https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciimmunol.aat1604). usually the worms aren't even attached to the intestinal walls yet when the bounce occurs.
edit: my best guess in regards to the bounce is the type 2 immune response can be triggered just from a disruption of the epithelium (skin) alone (https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciimmunol.aat1604). usually the worms aren't even attached to the intestinal walls yet when the bounce occurs.
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