I strongly need help!

[renski]

It's interesting, Vitamin A, E help the gut and help absorb zinc, Vitamin C also helps the gut. So that is likely the starting point

 

[renski]

unless you have spent time in North America, it's not all that likely anyway.
@Freddd can you suggest a good quality B-complex free of folic acid that's available in Europe? I use Jigsaw b-complex, but have to import from canada.

@girlfromeurope have you arranged anti-depressants - I understand you are in a bad place (I have been there) but you are not beyond help. However you do need to get your mind into a place where you will accept Freddd's help and mine.

If you have reacted badly to single vitamin supplements there are several possibilities here: allergy to one of the filler materials, wrong balance or b vitamins (more likely), correcting the B-Vitamins is aggravating other issues.

Start of with Vitamins A + C + E (strongest tablets you can buy).
Add a 1mg Vitamin C tablet (or similar).
Take a good quality B-complex as Freddd suggested.
Took a good quality multi-vitamin / multi-mineral.

As soon as you are used to those, and are on your anti-depressants, you need to give Freddd and me the chance to help you. you also need to talk to the other members (or us) about HOW YOU FEEL. This is clearly not just an issue of sorting your health out, you seem to need to communicate and let things out.

@Leopardtail

What's the reason for starting with Vit A/C/E? I thought it was minerals+b vitamins first?

thx

 

[triffid113]

[QUO
TE="Iain123456, post: 953304, member: 27840"]Thanks. Yes, I am not sure I have Pyroluria per say but functional b6, zinc have been found to be low in hair mineral and amino acid tests. Both zinc and b6 depend on each other for absorption so there’s a bit of a balancing act, I have tried high doses of both in absorbable forms before without luck 250mg zinc, 800mg b6. I have most recently been focusing on zinc only which appears to have increased my levels a bit with some improvements and will look to introduce a smaller dose of P5P. My symptoms are mostly brain fog, mood instability and lethargy.

Both items induce low potassium symptoms after ingestion so I am balancing that as well. Something which I haven’t been able to confirm through personal experience and would appreciate info on is, do you know how long it takes potassium in supplement form to reach serum/cells? I appreciate it’s quicker than food.

I just take those b vitamins in food form, previous supplementation caused issues with potassium as you say.[

Hi Lain123456,

A couple of things to consider. Some need for potassium with is a flag of cell formation and healing. However, EXCESSIVE amounts of certain b vitamins, b1, b2, and b3 under some circumstances and combinations, can drive the need for potassium much higher than simply supplies the amount needed. Cutting them to zero can stop much healing.

High levels of zinc can cause copper deficiency at the absorption process as they share a common absorption process. 800mg of B6 sounds just plain wrong. Something is out of whack.

When I had low copper, it might have been becasue of interference in absorption. Zinc and vitamin C can both do that. I had a severely inflamed stomach as well. That could also have been the variety of copper I took. When I changed copper supplement types (changed from amino acid chelate to copper citrate) the inflammation decreased and the copper levels increased. There is no good reason my doc could think of, just some idiosyncratic characteristic of my body perhaps.

"mostly brain fog, mood instability and lethargy." - That could be copper deficiency symptoms, other microminerals, and anything methylation or ATP all the way from the MeCbl-AdoCbl-L-methylfolate and L-carnitine (fumarate or effective for you) basis to secondary or tertiary problems.

https://www.quora.com/Has-someone-u..._filter__=all&__nsrc__=1&__snid3__=1808215186

In the part of this post under the "refeeding syndrome" symptoms, you will find the suggestions of those symptoms under possible induced deficiencies.

Let's start with potassium from food. Its take about 14 hours after eating to reach serum peal of potassium. The excess amount gets shuttled into the tissue by insulin. Getting potassium out of tissue and back in the serum can be a lot slower for many people, like me. So I get terrible spasms when my serum potassium gets too low. Keep in the back of your mind that it might be "speed of transfer to serum" rather than an actual deficiency of potassium. When I drink dissolved in water potassium gluconate, my symptoms can let up in 15 to 30 minutes on an empty stomach. I use about 2 teaspoons per 8-16 ounces of water (personal comfort consideration, doesn't mess up my digestion.). Excess potassium comes out with excess water very quickly in the absence of kidney problems. .

Fredd, so u take copper citrate? (or was it zinc citrate?) My question 2 you is whether u took / take copper separately from zinc? I am finding taking it before bed helps my sleep feel more restfil. I also take 2 caps of sploray cal-mag and 10mg melatonin
I think the calcium might intetfete with copper absorption somewhat and cettainly would buffer things. So not sure it's a hood idea, but it feels right.

To the giy whom Freddd was replying to... one important cause of brain fog is hypothyroid. Get your TSH measured. It should be < 2.0 (ignore the reference range from the lab, it's not based on science). There are thyroid support supplements. I take Thyrocsin by Thorne and 45 mg ZINC. Zinc is like a dial to turn up your thyroid. You also need iodine, selenium, b12, etc. Also, I've been dieting (lost 25 pounds!) and can tell u if u do not eat enough protein to make neurotransmitters, u can't make them. u also need either b6 or b3 for neurotransmitter production (I forget, but someone here will know). Goid luck!

Um, I take 45mg zinc, your amount may vary. 90% of men age 70-80 get bph and you need a goodly amount of zinc to fend it off. I am guessing 30-50mg. Maintaining copper status is important and may govern your choices.

 

[Freddd]

Fredd, so u take copper citrate? (or was it zinc citrate?) My question 2 you is whether u took / take copper separately from zinc? I am finding taking it before bed helps my sleep feel more restfil. I also take 2 caps of sploray cal-mag and 10mg melatonin
I think the calcium might intetfete with copper absorption somewhat and cettainly would buffer things. So not sure it's a hood idea, but it feels right.

To the giy whom Freddd was replying to... one important cause of brain fog is hypothyroid. Get your TSH measured. It should be < 2.0 (ignore the reference range from the lab, it's not based on science). There are thyroid support supplements. I take Thyrocsin by Thorne and 45 mg ZINC. Zinc is like a dial to turn up your thyroid. You also need iodine, selenium, b12, etc. Also, I've been dieting (lost 25 pounds!) and can tell u if u do not eat enough protein to make neurotransmitters, u can't make them. u also need either b6 or b3 for neurotransmitter production (I forget, but someone here will know). Goid luck!

Um, I take 45mg zinc, your amount may vary. 90% of men age 70-80 get bph and you need a goodly amount of zinc to fend it off. I am guessing 30-50mg. Maintaining copper status is important and may govern your choices.

Hi Triffid,

I was diagnosed hypothyroid when I was 8 years old and started thyroid extract at that time. I never went through what that was like. I have been on various thyroid medications during the 64 years I've been on. I haven't been through that.

I take copper at a different time with a bunch of vitamins. The zinc I take at a different meal. I take copper Sebacate. I tried multiple different copper formulations. None worked initially but some irritated my stomach. About 2 years into titration of Lithium Orotate my copper went up fast and my copper bottlenecks ceased being a problem. I had years of problems with copper bottlenecks/deficiencies and nothing worked for nearly a decade. Then as the lithium reached a certain level various aspects of homeostasis started up and everything improved after a batch of tests that made no sense.

 

[triffid113]

I tried copper by itself and it did not irritate my stomach. Idk what form. Mostly zinc and b vitamins are irritating to me. But they never used to be. I am going to switch to zinc carnosine... formulated for your gut so less likely to irritate. Zinc amino acid has been proven to stay in your system longer, so this would be a good form on two fronts. In fact, it is vitamin gut irritation driving me to take fewer supplements than I should. I am wondering if carnosine might be the key, since it trails off with age.

I'll look up your form of copper, see what I find out.

 

[Freddd]

Hi Triffid,

I had to get MeCbl, AdoCbl, Methylfolate and l-carnitine all working noticeably at healing and making cells. I was able to be guided through all the basics and copper by how zinc and copper (not together) and all the other micro nutrients are needed at same time, by the daily effects on things like cracked skin around nails, acne type lesions all over the body, cracks at the corners of my mouth and so on. That carried me all the way through copper, by daily healing visible. When those were working so were the interior. Using the information takes one right through the choice of minerals by what symptoms are form or clearing up. It take a day are two if copper is "working" and the same for each things. And lithium takes it's time but will help bring copper and other things in basic homeostasis.