How do I know if my fatigue is psychosomatic or physical?

[Booble]

I think the best way to think about it is that anxiety, depression and CFS have similar symptoms but are three different things. Just like a stomach ache might be from anxiety, food poisoning or appendicitis.

To the original poster it IS hard to know what is the cause of your symptoms. It also doesn't help that having CFS/ME will sure as heck cause anxiety and/or depression.

It's unfortunate that there is not an easy way to discover the cause of your symptoms.

I would say it you think it's possible that your symptoms are from anxiety or depression, which they certainly could be, then you could try treating them since there relatively successful ways to treat those conditions. With luck it might cure the way you are physically feeling.

None of this negates the fact that sometimes the biological basis for these symptoms is from some unknown leftover inflammation or screwed up sensitivities or whatever is the cause of CFS/ME.

 

[Rufous McKinney]

To the original poster it IS hard to know what is the cause of your symptoms. It also doesn't help that having CFS/ME will sure as heck cause anxiety and/or depression.

I was dealing with alot of anxiety associated with going out- so there is sometimes this extra tax I know I pay, if only I was real calm BEFORE that darn dental visit (for instance), I'd be much better off.

so there are simply times when I sort of call it: Placebo myself. I do something that I actually really did not expect it to bite me, and in fact it reared its awful head and Bit Me Big Time. So often, I'm a bit shocked. I didn't expect or predict this would happen, but it did.

Its at those times I'm more assured that- this stuff happens regardless of what I think about it.

so why can't I survive taking my husband to a medical procedure? All I had to do was drive six blocks, sit in a waiting room, then teleport 38 miles back home.

We got a motel room, I took a Xanax, I'm fine, its bedtime- I never slept the whole nite. Not ever not once. By the time its his scheduled procedure, I'm hallicinating and leaving my body. I proceeded to also get a severe cold at the very same time. Like a complete physical melt down.

My husband has six eye procdures he seems unable to achieve. And I'm supposed to help him somehow.

 

[livinglighter]

I also think it’s the other poor health physical symptoms that happen as well as the fatigue, which helps distinguish between the two.

 

[Rufous McKinney]

which helps distinguish between the two.

yes, well thats the biggest issue- the notion our symptoms are merely: tiredness...its WAY WAY more than that.

 

[DLTooley]

What benefits do you see when your step count has decreased? For me, I would interpret being able to take fewer steps as getting worse.

Yeah, My mind is clearer, but my steps have decreased. At first I put it down to getting older, but I’ve heard it opined that you can still be doing damage with a reasonably well paced program.
I’ve definitely also gotten a better handle on stress.
It used to be I would crash if I didn’t do some exercise every day. In hindsight I put that down to needing to burn off my particular cocktail of stress hormones. That lack of regularity may also be contributing to the step loss.

 

[Booble]

>>>That lack of regularity may also be contributing to the step loss.<<<

I know that's something that is key for me. My body needs to get used to whatever level and then it seems to be able to maintain it. It's like I unconsciously/involuntarily pace my energy production or some body processes that I don't even know about.

 

[DLTooley]

>>>That lack of regularity may also be contributing to the step loss.<<<

I know that's something that is key for me. My body needs to get used to whatever level and then it seems to be able to maintain it. It's like I unconsciously/involuntarily pace my energy production or some body processes that I don't even know about.

I think brain fog correlates with dysautonomia, that they are perhaps exactly the same thing. The unconscious nervous system has sympathetic and parasympathetic sub systems. The sympathetic is more active while the parasympathetic is about resting, and digesting.

 

[Booble]

I think brain fog correlates with dysautonomia, that they are perhaps exactly the same thing. The unconscious nervous system has sympathetic and parasympathetic sub systems. The sympathetic is more active while the parasympathetic is about resting, and digesting.

So maybe our parasympathetic wants to know exactly what the sympathetic has in mind.
Either that or our parasympathetics are telling our sympathetics to F#@* off.

 

[wabi-sabi]

I think brain fog correlates with dysautonomia, that they are perhaps exactly the same thing.

Having the sort of dysautonomia that makes for orthostatic intolerance means that there's not enough blood, and therefore not enough oxygen, in the brain. Being starved of oxygen has got to makes the brain a bit foggy.

 

[wabi-sabi]

Here's a good video of Dr. Peter Rowe explaining how the orthostatic intolerance/dysautonomia works.

 

[Rufous McKinney]

I used my hair washing/trip to the shower as an informal lean test, confirming my heart rate amped dramatically after about 10 minutes. My blood pressure at that particular time was rather low. It can, earlier in the day, be high, I'm one of those.

 

[gbells]

I used my hair washing/trip to the shower as an informal lean test, confirming my heart rate amped dramatically after about 10 minutes. My blood pressure at that particular time was rather low. It can, earlier in the day, be high, I'm one of those.

How about ablutophobia?

Ablutophobia is the overwhelming fear of bathing, cleaning, or washing. It’s an anxiety disorder that falls under the category of specific phobias.

https://www.healthline.com/health/ablutophobia#:~:text=Ablutophobia is the overwhelming fear,the category of specific phobias.

It seems these mental disorders are nothing but symptom naming.

 

[Rufous McKinney]

How about ablutophobia?

Well, knowing that the mold creature is likely forming below the shower, and I'm the only one likely to ever open up that drain and tackle the issue, well there is also THAT terror.

abluto, eh?

 

[DLTooley]

So maybe our parasympathetic wants to know exactly what the sympathetic has in mind.
Either that or our parasympathetics are telling our sympathetics to F#@* off.

Inquiring minds want to know. My guess is both.

 

[wabi-sabi]

How about ablutophobia?

Yep, I'm afraid of showering just like I'm afraid of exercising! Do they have fear of standing up? I must have that too.

 

[gbells]

Well, knowing that the mold creature is likely forming below the shower, and I'm the only one likely to ever open up that drain and tackle the issue, well there is also THAT terror.

abluto, eh?

Yes, mold is quite terrifying.

 

[Mary]

I don’t even know if what I’m facing is real with so many people claiming CFS is psychosomatic.

These people don't know what they're talking about. They've been lied to by the authors of the PACE trial, which has been proven to be fatally flawed.

I think @wabi-sabi answered it very well here (quoting you):

For me, this is your best indicator of what is mental health versus physical health. Exercise helps people with depression. Exercise hurts people with ME/CFS, even though both diseases come with a symptoms of fatigue.

And I think it's that simple. People who are simply depressed may not feel like exercising, but they have the physical capability of doing it, and exercise generally makes them feel better. People with ME/CFS generally would kill to be able to exercise, but are physically incapable of doing it - or if they do it, they pay a huge price. PEM is not depression.

 

[wabi-sabi]

People who are simply depressed may not feel like exercising, but they have the physical capability of doing it, and exercise generally makes them feel better. People with ME/CFS generally would kill to be able to exercise, but are physically incapable of doing it

Yes, exactly. Before ME/CFS I managed much of my mental health stuff with exercise. Now that that's no longer possible it makes the mental issues so much harder to deal with. I've been lucky to find a therapist that understands chronic illness, but it's still not the same as being able to take a nice walk in the woods.

 

[lenora]

It seems we are simply exchanging sets of symptoms.

Forced by necessities to walk more, I got stronger muscle wise, and my lymph improved.

I proceeded to then develop a whole new list of intensified neurological symptoms. Yucky and unfun (tachycardia, intense OI, visually cannot process sensory inputs).

So is that an improvement? It didn't feel like it at the time.

Because of my age, and not being able to walk the way I used to (outside every day) and a lot of hospitalizations in a short period of time, I really felt myself physically losing strength. I've been to myofascial therapists, and the last one did give me some good exercises and didn't force me to use bikes or treadmills. For that I was grateful b/c I've had major setbacks when using them in the past. This was most definitely not psychosomatic....it was real. Of that I'm sure.

I feel that we're the best judges of how much our bodies can handle. I also believe that in order to take care of ourselves in old age we have to work muscle groups...not even all at once, but throughout the day. There are times when I simply can't do what I feel I need to. And yes, we often exchange one symptom for another.

I wish it could be easier for all of us. I'm rather housebound at the moment, but I'm working on regaining strength and hope to be able to walk again in the fall. I certainly walk in the house (bad foot at the moment), so that's why the fall is my new goal. In the meantime, I'll keep exercising and doing what I can to stay mobile. It means a lot to me, @Rufous, and I know it means a lot to you also. Yours, L.

 

[Booble]

I think it might be more complicated for ANXIETY vs CFS than the "taking a walk" test.
Anxiety releases a lot of chemicals that cause very similar bodily reactions to CFS/ME.
Taking a walk can also deplete you further with anxiety, though it can help mop up some of that extra adrenaline.