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Psychedelics and Immunomodulation: Novel Approaches and Therapeutic Opportunities

Discussion in 'Other Health News and Research' started by Owl42, Jan 24, 2016.

  1. Owl42

    Owl42 Psychedelic bird

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    Hi guys, I'm back. I'm not taking DMT anymore for I have a new immunological treatment, but I think it helped me get in the state of recovery I'm right now. (I haven't been so good last week tho) I wanted to talk with you about the antiviral, antimicrobial and antifungical role of MAOis used in ayahuasca allonside DMT. They cross the BB barrier and I think it can be interesting for us and also explain why ayahuasca has been the ultimate medicine for some cultures.

    https://www.researchgate.net/profil..._harmala_L/links/02bfe5127249b122ea000000.pdf

    http://www.sid.ir/en/VEWSSID/J_pdf/119220080402.pdf

    http://bmcresnotes.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1756-0500-6-193

    This is the most interesting finding I've got to, reviewing the action of Harmaline on the lysine-specific demethylase-1 (LSD1), suppresing viral gene expression. http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0166354214000503 I've found other interesting articles on LSD1 and herpevirus after this.
     
    ChrisD, natasa778 and cigana like this.
  2. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    @Owl42
    Thanks for those links.

    Interesting though they are, often there may 5 or 10 or more different herbal or natural supplements that have antiviral effects against a specific virus.

    For example, you can see here the list of herbal (and pharmaceutical) antivirals I compiled that have antiviral efficacy against coxsackievirus B and echovirus (two viruses strongly linked to ME/CFS).

    And here you can see various other herbs that have antiviral effects against herpes simplex virus 1.

    But generally, herbal antivirals are not strong (in fact even most pharmaceutical antivirals are not very strong).
     
  3. Owl42

    Owl42 Psychedelic bird

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    I've been reading this article and thougt you guys would like it. Maybe @Hip can get more out of it. I think it is related to the things you were mentioning some time ago!

    "The data presented suggest that DMT may regulate intracellular calcium overload and pro- apoptotic gene expression via activation of Sig-1R recep- tors. This mechanism can result in a DMT-mediated neu- roprotection during and after ischemia and acidosis. The pathological consequences of hypoxic–anoxic damages can be further mitigated by DMT-facilitated Sig-1R dependent plasticity changes"

    A possibly sigma-1 receptor mediated role of dimethyltryptamine in tissue protection, regeneration, and immunity https://www.researchgate.net/public...n_tissue_protection_regeneration_and_immunity
     
  4. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    Thanks for the link, @Owl42.

    Just recently I found something interesting about the sigma-1 receptors: it seems that dextromethorphan, which like DMT agonizes the sigma-1 receptors, is a treatment for emotional lability (pseudobulbar affect), which is one of the emotional symptoms of ME/CFS:
    Emotional lability is a symptom of ME/CFS listed in the CCC definition of ME/CFS.



    It seems that dextromethorphan's ability to treat emotional lability may be connected to its agonism of the sigma-1 receptors:

    This study said that sigma-1 receptors

    Not that many ME/CFS patients seem to suffer from emotional lability, though; but most patients do suffer from emotional hypersensitivity (eg: witnessing even minor social discord can feel very unpleasant when you have ME/CFS). And some ME/CFS patients like myself experience flat emotions, which is also an ME/CFS symptom listed in the CCC.

    So I wonder if sigma-1 agonism might be generally helpful for all the emotional symptoms of ME/CFS?

    I have not yet tried high dose dextromethorphan, but when I do, I will be on the lookout to see if it can rectify ME/CFS emotional symptoms.
     
  5. actup

    actup Senior Member

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    I plan to plow through this wonderful research material. I have tried shrooms once ( fairly obtainable in my state- my nephew knows where to pick them and my 60 yr old brother is not big on alcohol but loves his shrooms). My lovely brother set up the experience for me on a deserted beach in Puget Sound on a beautiful day. Gave me what he judged to be a 1/2 dose and my experience was subtle and allowed me to enjoy the beautiful details of nature without distraction. I spent hours looking at shell fish in tide pools and reminiscing with my brother. I would be happy to use shrooms every day but for the cost. A second experience has just gone to the top of my to do list.
     
    Dufresne likes this.
  6. Dufresne

    Dufresne almost there...

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    Tolerance to psychedelics develops quickly. By the third or fourth day of dosing you'd get next to nothing from them. However normal sensitivity returns within 7 days.
     
  7. actup

    actup Senior Member

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    Thanks @Dufresne for this info. I wonder if tolerance can be controlled with weekly or monthly use. Dosage is of course difficult to control when you are eating dried mushrooms grown in the wild. We have a tolerant view of shrooms for personal use(still illegal in Wa) and pot( legal in state of WA) in the Pacific NW. When I moved here 29 yrs ago guests brought pot rather than wine. We need a break from the anhedonia.
     
  8. Owl42

    Owl42 Psychedelic bird

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    @actup when I was using shrooms I got very good results from dosing once a month, or once every three weeks. Shrooms doesn't seem to interact with sigma receptors tho, just serotonine receptors, so they won't modulate immune system, at least not so directly as DMT, for serotonin does affect immunity but in a total different level and scale.
     
  9. actup

    actup Senior Member

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    @Owl42 I've been reading through this thread from the beginning so your advice is much appreciated. I am evaluating the low dose DMT regimen. Thanks!
     
  10. knackers323

    knackers323 Senior Member

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    Aware of any other things aside from bmt that can lower these cytokines?
     
  11. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    I complied a list of things that lower IL-1β, TNF-α and IL-6.
     
  12. jengonwin

    jengonwin

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    Freebase DMT fries my adrenals.

    Going to try LSD. 50ug i guess then work up
     
  13. jengonwin

    jengonwin

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    Found this on the web.

    "
    Interesting, I think neuroinflammation could explain a huge part of what is going on. I’ve taken LSD 3 times since being ill with CFS/ME (been ill for 2 and a half years now, I am virtually housebound) and each time my symptoms have gone away COMPLETELY for 3 days afterwards. LSD is a powerful anti-inflammatory and I did feel very much like i had received a deep massage from the inside of my body out-wards, like cooling balm being rubbed on a hyperactive frazzled nervous system. I was able to walk a few miles and play the guitar and sing for hours with strong fingers and a strong voice (can’t usually do that at all!) as well as read much more during the 3 days post-tripping. My symptoms returned quickly however and a week later (on all 3 occasions) I was just as ill as before I took it, so it’s positive effects are short.

    This has led me to the theory that neuroinflammation is causing a lot of my CFS symptoms. Sadly one cannot take LSD regularly as the profound spiritual and emotional experience it induced need integrating in to daily life and it’s just not convenient. But I am curious about BROMO-LSD, a non-hallicinogenic form of LSD being developed for cluster headaches. Perhaps that would have the same effect and could be taken regularly enough to be beneficial long term for CFS/ME sufferers? I wonder if you have come across anyone else with similar experience, as I seem to be one of the only CFS sufferers to have tried LSD while ill…"
     
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  14. Owl42

    Owl42 Psychedelic bird

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    Some people are experimenting with microdosing LSD.
     
  15. Tunguska

    Tunguska Senior Member

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    I only see detailed posts about DMT... what mechanism is supposed behind LSD specifically helping? Sorry if it's been mentioned. (The closest I've tried were DXM and lisuride (both legally available), hard to gauge, though DXM is closer to ketamine anyhow)

    You mentioned sigma-1, it's modulated by steroids also (DHEA) and those are already altered in CFS/ME I believe.
     

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