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Disappointing Visit to Dr. Montoya's PA

rosie26

Senior Member
Messages
2,446
Location
NZ
I think pumpkin seeds are high in phosphorus - if you do some research you'll find what foods are highest.
I think it was this post of yours @Mary that made me write pumpkin seeds down on my grocery list last week. I haven't eaten them for a long time. I used to make up my own muesli and put some in but I haven't been doing that for a couple of years. I bought about 200g worth of pumpkin seeds and have put in a jar in the pantry.

Last night about a hour before bed ( and I did think it was a strange time to be eating them as well but..) I tipped out a handful of pumpkin seeds and slowly worked my way through them. This morning I felt better than I had and wasn't expecting to as I had had a big day yesterday. It was so noticeable that I thought about all the things I had eaten yesterday. I thought maybe it might have been the dried mixed herbs in the chicken stuffing I had made but then I remembered the pumpkin seeds. So, I might keep up with them. Thanks for mentioning it.
 

rosie26

Senior Member
Messages
2,446
Location
NZ
This morning I felt better.... I remembered the pumpkin seeds. So, I might keep up with them. Thanks for mentioning it.
Excuse me for being off-topic? Just to add quickly... I have unpleasant indigestion and IBS after eating too many pumpkin seeds - 2 handfuls over a 2 day period. Didn't think I needed to start slow and low with these. Will experiment at a later date to see if it these really are a problem.
 
Messages
69
New here, Bella, did Dr Montoya suggest any anti-virals, like valtrex or others?

Thanks.

Jim

Hi Jim,

Yes, I was taking Valacyclovir (Valtrex) for several years and a year or two back, was switched to Famcyclovir.
I'm able to tolerate both.

I'm also a patient of Dr. Chia and he strongly discouraged me from using Valcyte which is a much stronger
anti-viral with more side effects.

Bellasc
 

BBB

Messages
6
I feel as if I'm at a new crossroads after 8 years with CFS....I would love feedback/ support.
Ive been a patient of Dr. Jose Montoya at Stanford for 8 years now.

Last week I had a follow-up visit with one of his PA's -Physicians Assistant who specializes in CFS.
Definitely not what I would expect from a Chronic Fatigue practitioner at all....and Ive seen her many times before.
After she asked me how I was doing and I explained that I spend at least 50% of my waking time in bed, she expressed surprise. REALLY??!! You're a Chronic Fatigue Practitioner and you're surprised that I'm in bed
this much??! I was so unbelievably disappointed and have never felt so dismissed and depressed since I was diagnosed. She also asked if I was on disability. YES, Ive been on disability ever since you've known me.
She somehow acted like I was still so sick because I wasn't cooperating and taking the meds she and Dr Montoya had prescribed. I don't do well at all with meds and had a horrible reaction to an anti-inflammatory they prescribed last year. It changed my personality and I started to lose my hair. So not a big fan of random meds.

She had prescribed Naltrexone months ago and I had a horrible experience when I took it as directed- at bedtime. I was lucky if I slept 4 hours that night. It took me a week to recover.
So after my visit last week and now feeling very insecure about being on SSDI, my illness and the lack of support I just experienced, I decided to have another go with the Naltrexone. I took it this time during the day and became horribly unbelieveably sick. Nausea like Ive not experienced before. All I could do was get into bed and hope I didn't die. It was THAT bad!! At one point I thought if I did die, that I'd certainly feel better.

So I'm wondering what others experience has been with Dr Montoya and his team over the last year or so?
Ive been very disappointed.
The last time I actually saw Dr. Montoya I had to wait almost 2 hours and when he finally came in to see me, one of his staff kept interrupting to tell him when and where the staff meeting was that he was now running late for. I was angry to say the least and did not feel cared for nor very important as his patient.
The last thing I thought Id be dealing with is feeling unsupported and dismissed by Chronic Fatigue practitioners.
 

BBB

Messages
6
I see you are already seeing Dr Chia and OMI. We have given up on our expectations for Stanford. And their success rate is about 30%. I read that some people have been on antivirals for 7 to 10 years before they had good results.
Regarding LDN, a lot depends on the fillers the pharmacy uses to mix it with. You can also ask them to just use sterile water. But it does say to start with .5 mg. some people stay on that dose.
 
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ebethc

Senior Member
Messages
1,901
I see you are already seeing Dr Chia and OMI. We have given up on our expectations for Stanford. And their success rate is about 30%. I read that some people have been on antivirals for 7 to 10 years before they had good results.
Regarding LDN, a lot depends on the fillers the pharmacy uses to mix it with. You can also ask them to just use sterile water. But it does say to start with .5 mg. some people stay on that dose.


1. have you had good luck w Dr Chia?

2. hard to say if success after 7-10 on AV's is due to AV's or just a natural remission!

3. which fillers are supposed to be good w LDN?
 

bertiedog

Senior Member
Messages
1,743
Location
South East England, UK
I had a bad reaction to naltrexone. I first took it 6 years ago and it made me very spacey such that I couldn't function properly (I think I was on 1.5 mg., can't remember exactly), I stuck it out for several days and finally gave up.

I had a similar experience a couple of years ago. Think I lasted one month but the horrible spacey feeling would make me quite anxious so I was glad to stop it. I never have anxiety thankfully so this drug must have been very bad for me.

Pam
 

Biarritz13

Senior Member
Messages
699
Location
France
Hi Jim,

Yes, I was taking Valacyclovir (Valtrex) for several years and a year or two back, was switched to Famcyclovir.
I'm able to tolerate both.

I'm also a patient of Dr. Chia and he strongly discouraged me from using Valcyte which is a much stronger
anti-viral with more side effects.

Bellasc

Hi!

Did Dr. Chia propose something else instead?
 

ebethc

Senior Member
Messages
1,901
Hello Theodore-
Dr Chia has tried multiple anti virals with me....HIV Meds. One was Epivir and the other AZT.
I had a reaction to AZT and went off of that pretty quickly. Epivir did not do much.
I saw him last May and he did not have any new ideas.

did valcyte help w brain fog? (if that's an issue for you)... One of the benefits of valcyte over other AVs is that it supposedly can be very effective in clearing brain fog, due to to some interaction w brain microglia
 

Biarritz13

Senior Member
Messages
699
Location
France
Hello Theodore-
Dr Chia has tried multiple anti virals with me....HIV Meds. One was Epivir and the other AZT.
I had a reaction to AZT and went off of that pretty quickly. Epivir did not do much.
I saw him last May and he did not have any new ideas.

You mean only HIV meds or you also tried Oxymatrine?
Do you know if he still gives Interferon?
 
Messages
8
I'm new here. Anyways, yes, I also was not impressed with Stanford. I went for the first time last summer . I saw a Physician's assistant. I believe there is only 2 of them, hence they have a very large patient load. I don't think Dr. Montoya actually sees the patients himself or at least I only had the possibility of seeing a P.A.(apparently some patients on here have seen him in the flesh???)

Anyways, I was thoroughly unimpressed with my visit. It was a one hour visit the majority of which I brought the P.A. up to speed on my patient history, my symptoms, etc. That took about 40 min. Then she talked about the importance of diet, and probiotics, etc....general health stuff. We talked a bit about prognosis and how pacing was important. And then five minutes before my appointment ended she wrote me a prescription for Naltrexone. She explained how it helped regulate the immune system and how it benefited 70% of Stanford's CFS patients to some degree. And she gave me a prescription for Amitriptyline to help improve my sleep. She did not go over how to take them, we didn't discuss in depth all the benefits and risks. And then I was wisked out of there. My head was spinning it all happened so quickly. We did NOT discuss any other treatment therapies. I was given a Stanford email account and she said she would fill me in on the rest via email. Then I went downstairs at the clinic to get my blood taken which took 4 minutes (to test for viruses, etc.) And then I left. It was a crazy whirlwind experience.

I was also very disappointed when I asked the doctor's assistant if Montoya's protocol included the drugs Ampligen or Rituximab. These are two drugs that are showing great promise for a subset of CFS patients. I don't even know very much about CFS (I haven't read extensively due to cognitive disfunction and having received my diagnosis relatively recently), but even I know about these drugs. She had never heard of them. She clearly doesn't know too much about CFS then....she obviously just follows Montoya's protocol. I imagine he has a manual or some such thing which the P.A.'s are to follow with clear instructions: Step 1....step 2.....etc..... first treat all patients with Naltrexone and Amitriptylne. When blood work comes back, treat patients between the ages of 18-60 who tested positive with CMV or HHV6a with Vistide, patients 60 years + are to be treated with blah, blah, etc., etc. I don't really know, I'm just imagining.

The P.A. I saw also spent several minutes discussing how candida could potentially be indicated in the expression of CFS symptoms and how I could potentially have that. Candida....seriously? I was expecting to see someone who practices rigorous science and who's treatments are based on patient trials and hard data. Now I know nobody knows much about CFS at this point and it's all largely just hypotheses, but as far as I know (published studies in reputable scholarly journals) Candida is only a problem for folks who's immune systems are so compromised that they are dying ie. in hospice. Important Note: she did mention that the candida theory was hers and wasn't part of Dr. Montoya's protocol. She also mentioned that I should consider going gluten free, again her idea, not endorsed by Montoya. As far as I know the protocol is entirely that of Montoya, but these P.A.'s do add in their two cents ie. try taking this supplement, etc.

Anyways, the replies to my long, in-depth inquiries to my P.A. via my Stanford email account are very short and sometimes unhelpful. I have on several occasions had to repeat a question two or even three, yes, three times. My P.A. gives me the impression she isn't very knowledgeable about CFS or makes me nervous that she might not even entirely understand the science behind all the therapies on offer at Stanford. For instance, my blood work revealed that I have an infection and my P.A. wrote me a prescription for such and such as per Montoya's protocol. So I make inquiries....what are the benefits/risks and I get one line replies. I had to go see my family doctor to get info about the drug in question and they know nothing about CFS and these treatments.....that's how exasperating my Stanford experience has been thus far. I'm frustrated. Maybe my P.A. really is a smart and knowledgeable clinician, but I would never know because I get very short (I'm talking two sentence) replies.

I'm not giving up on Stanford yet. If they can help me, then dealing with the P.A.'s will have been worth it. But so far it hasn't been the world class experience I had been hoping for. I guess the P.A.'s- all two of them- are overworked....have huge patient loads. Perhaps, it's not the P.A.'s that are to blame at all. Perhaps, it's the Chronic Fatigue Clinic at Stanford's budget, organizational issues, etc, underfunding, etc. Because the P.A.'s are the face of Stanford, no doubt they get all the blame. In any case it's been very exasperating at times.

Anyone else exasperated by Stanford?
 
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8
Way too much to fast. It took me to go from 0.5 to 4.5 about 4 years if that helps you!!!! The way I know is becuAse I get super sleepy. I cannot stay awake ( not in a good way) That is my tell tell.

I had really bad anxiety starting with 1.5mg and had to stop. I had just discounted it. So maybe it could work for me? Did you have anxiety?

Hello, yes, like this other reply I am very interested in getting more info about your experience/directions with LDN. I recently visited Stanford the first time this summer past. I was told by my P.A. to start my LDN at 1.5mg and that if I was tolerating well that I could increase to 3mg and then to 4.5mg. She told me I could increase to the next dosing every 3-4 days. I started having severe anxiety at 1.5mg. So I stopped. I inquired to my P.A. if I should just discount Naltrexone altogether. She didn't seem to care what I did. I suggested to her that perhaps I could try starting at a smaller dose and go slower. She said to give it a try. Very exasperating.
 
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8
I HATED HATED HATED HATED LDN, at $85 dollars / month I still do. To be honest @Shushi was the one that gave me hope so I sticked with it and I am glad I did (another thing to thank you for @Sushi).

I reacted so strongly to LDN, I slept for days to no end and not in a good sleep was like me being out completely in the brain. But kept awake during the day. But I think some time in I was like this crap is good for nothing and I noticed that I had less energy. So no I did not noticed anything on it. I noticed bad when off of it after a while. So I still keep on it. Another thing is I struggle with low Ts and NKs cells and when I did up the LDN my numbers came up a bit and that was the only changed I did.

It was given to me for pain, to be honest did nothing for my pain. I just feel more energy while on it so I am glad I stayed w it. I had to increase SLOWWWWWWWWWWWWWW I mean years so I didn't follow what others said and just did what felt ok. I react extremely severly to medications so I start very low and slow.


This gives me hope. I started at 1.5mg at started having severe anxiety so I stopped. But maybe I should try going slow and low???
 
Messages
8
Thanks for your feedback @Sushi ...After I took the Naltrexone last week, I was so incredibly ill, I could have probably been in a hospital. It was awful. It took me calling the pharmacist who said to start with .5mg and very slowly work up from there. I'm pretty nervous to even take any of it -even at.5mg after the extreme bad reaction I had.
Seems a bit irresponsible of Stanford to start at 4.5mg...unless I'm an anomaly and everyone else adjusts to it just fine.
I had a bad experience to. Stanford told me to start at 1.5mg than if tolerating go to 3mg, then ending up at 4.5. I started having severe anxiety at 1.5 mg. After several weeks I stopped and started having crazy withdrawals!!!! Couldn't sleep, panic attacks. Went to see my psychiatrist and she told me it wasn't possible.....it was placebo effect. After 6 or 7 day I took 0.5mg and within an hour I felt better. I'm still at 0.5mg 6 weeks later, but am afraid to go up for fear of the anxiety. Maybe I'll try. Could someone who also had anxiety advise, please!
 

ebethc

Senior Member
Messages
1,901
Messages
8
Hi, just wondered if those who have reacted badly to LDN have considered it might be the filler? Some are filled with lactose so if you're intolerant, it might make you unwell. LDN May also deplete lithium so can make you a little miserable until it balances out so because of that I take lithium orotate.

http://www.lowdosenaltrexone.org/gazorpa/LDNFillers.html

http://www.cpnhelp.org/lithium_orotate_mood_enha
No, its not the filler. I went to my compounding pharmacy and they made me up a 0.5.mg Naltrexone tab. My 0.5mg tab is the exact same sized tab as the 1.5mg tab- that means I'm taking even more filler. I have no anxiety on the 0.5mg tab. So it can't be the filler.