What's your CD4/CD8 ratio?

TrixieStix

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@sorin Haven't discussed the results with the immunologist yet. When I do I will post what he says. It was discovered in February that I have very low Complement C3 (30% of normal) and low CH50 so that is being looked into. The T Cell Panel was done as part of figuring that out.
 

TrixieStix

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What are the values for CD4 and CD8 (count, not percentage)?
CD4 Count: 0.798 (normal range 0.730-2.250)
CD8 Count: 0.941 (normal range 0.250-1.240)

from what I've read the %'s are deemed to be more accurate and reliable because it's more stable than the count is.
 

sorin

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CD4 Count: 0.798 (normal range 0.730-2.250)
CD8 Count: 0.941 (normal range 0.250-1.240)

from what I've read the %'s are deemed to be more accurate and reliable because it's more stable than the count is.
Is strange that your values are < 1. Mine are expressed like numbers higher than 1 , i.e 824. Probably yours are divided by 1000? Anyway in my results reports is written that normal CD4 is [332; 1642] that would be 0.332 - 0.1642 in yours. So you do not have to worry about CD4, 798 is quite normal, the minimum is about 350.
 

TrixieStix

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Is strange that your values are < 1. Mine are expressed like numbers higher than 1 , i.e 824. Probably yours are divided by 1000? Anyway in my results reports is written that normal CD4 is [332; 1642] that would be 0.332 - 0.1642 in yours. So you do not have to worry about CD4, 798 is quite normal, the minimum is about 350.
Are you in the US also? Here is you look up "low CD4/CD8 ratio" most posts use the same measurements as mine and many articles are about how a ratio below 1 is often found in people with HIV.
 

sorin

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Are you in the US also? Here is you look up "low CD4/CD8 ratio" most posts use the same measurements as mine and many articles are about how a ratio below 1 is often found in people with HIV.
I am in Europe. I tested many many times fot HIV and always the result was negative (I did about 6 tests during a 6 year period, including PCR, Western Blot, anti-bodies, all what I could test). I suppose you are in the same situation, right? The question is - what is that if it is not HIV?
 

TrixieStix

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I am in Europe. I tested many many times fot HIV and always the result was negative (I did about 6 tests during a 6 year period, including PCR, Western Blot, anti-bodies, all what I could test). I suppose you are in the same situation, right? The question is - what is that if it is not HIV?
there are other things besides HIV that cause low CD4/CD8 Ratio. Also HIV does so because it causes a drop in CD4. In my case the ratio is low because I have elevated CD8. I was first tested for HIV as a young child because I received blood transfusions in 1981.

Just found this interesting information...

"The absolute counts of lymphocyte subsets are known to be influenced by a variety of biological factors, including hormones, the environment, and temperature. The studies on diurnal (circadian) variation in lymphocyte counts have demonstrated progressive increase in CD4 T-cell count throughout the day, while CD8 T cells and CD19+ B cells increase between 8:30 a.m. and noon, with no change between noon and afternoon. Natural killer cell counts, on the other hand, are constant throughout the day.(8) Circadian variations in circulating T-cell counts have been shown to be negatively correlated with plasma cortisol concentration.(9-11) In fact, cortisol and catecholamine concentrations control distribution and, therefore, numbers of naive versus effector CD4 and CD8 T cells.(9) It is generally accepted that lower CD4 T-cell counts are seen in the morning compared with the evening (12), and during summer compared to winter.(13) These data, therefore, indicate that timing and consistency in timing of blood collection is critical when serially monitoring patients for lymphocyte subsets."

http://www.mayomedicallaboratories.com/test-catalog/Clinical and Interpretive/88826
 
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sorin

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there are other things besides HIV that cause low CD4/CD8 Ratio. Also HIV does so because it causes a drop in CD4. In my case the ratio is low because I have elevated CD8. I was first tested for HIV as a young child because I received blood transfusions in 1981.

Just found this interesting information...

"The absolute counts of lymphocyte subsets are known to be influenced by a variety of biological factors, including hormones, the environment, and temperature. The studies on diurnal (circadian) variation in lymphocyte counts have demonstrated progressive increase in CD4 T-cell count throughout the day, while CD8 T cells and CD19+ B cells increase between 8:30 a.m. and noon, with no change between noon and afternoon. Natural killer cell counts, on the other hand, are constant throughout the day.(8) Circadian variations in circulating T-cell counts have been shown to be negatively correlated with plasma cortisol concentration.(9-11) In fact, cortisol and catecholamine concentrations control distribution and, therefore, numbers of naive versus effector CD4 and CD8 T cells.(9) It is generally accepted that lower CD4 T-cell counts are seen in the morning compared with the evening (12), and during summer compared to winter.(13) These data, therefore, indicate that timing and consistency in timing of blood collection is critical when serially monitoring patients for lymphocyte subsets."

http://www.mayomedicallaboratories.com/test-catalog/Clinical and Interpretive/88826
That is very interesting and is exactly what I guessed it happens, some variations of CD4 during the day or caused by some factors. However, I presume that these variations are not high, maybe they are not significant?
 

TrixieStix

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That is very interesting and is exactly what I guessed it happens, some variations of CD4 during the day or caused by some factors. However, I presume that these variations are not high, maybe they are not significant?
it must significant enough to matter as it states... "timing and consistency in timing of blood collection is critical when serially monitoring patients for lymphocyte subsets."
 
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Mine has been around 0.6, 0.7 from past 1 year. High cd8 percentages and low cd4 percentage. Tested negative for hiv with DNA, P24 antigen and antibodies.
 
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Mine has been around 0.6, 0.7 from past 1 year. High cd8 percentages and low cd4 percentage. Tested negative for hiv with DNA, P24 antigen and antibodies.
I also have a low cd4 and higher cd8 count. Henrich kremers work may be helpful in understanding this phenomena. Based on his work and in this limited subset of patients, robust supplementation of thiol/glutathione precursors, mitochondrial support and co-factors as well as cox-2 inhibitors may be of use.