Vitamin D and coagulation

[tootsieroll]

Can anyone tell me what this study is stating? Is it saying it prevents coagulation? My blood is too thin and I don't want vitamin D to act as a blood thinner.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8111310/

Conclusions​

In severe vitamin D deficiency, a high-dose cholecalciferol supplementation was associated with a reduction in thrombin generation and an average decreased number of fibrin protofibrils per fibers and fibrin fiber size measured by turbidimetry. This suggests that severe vitamin D deficiency may be associated with a potentially reversible prothrombotic profile.

 

[linusbert]

i dont know if this is what the conclusion says. i think its about stabilizing a broken system from the last sentence "This suggests that severe vitamin D deficiency may be associated with a potentially reversible prothrombotic profile.".
so its not making the blood "thinner", it makes the blood "normal".
just me guessing though.

from my own experience i did not notice any effects for blood clotting with vitamin D. when i take other things like vitamin E i get easier nose bleeding, not so from vitamin D alone.
but in general, vitamin D increases calcium and calcium also works in regards with blood clotting, making it "thinner" , but again, i dont know if its just a normalizing effect.

so i dont think it will make much a difference for coagulation if it was already normal before.
but again, just me guessing, dont make your life depend on it.

 

[tootsieroll]

i dont know if this is what the conclusion says. i think its about stabilizing a broken system from the last sentence "This suggests that severe vitamin D deficiency may be associated with a potentially reversible prothrombotic profile.".
so its not making the blood "thinner", it makes the blood "normal".
just me guessing though.

from my own experience i did not notice any effects for blood clotting with vitamin D. when i take other things like vitamin E i get easier nose bleeding, not so from vitamin D alone.
but in general, vitamin D increases calcium and calcium also works in regards with blood clotting, making it "thinner" , but again, i dont know if its just a normalizing effect.

so i dont think it will make much a difference for coagulation if it was already normal before.
but again, just me guessing, dont make your life depend on it.

Thank you! I heard Vitamin E does have that thinning effect. But just a thought, I believe calcium causes clotting which means it would make blood thicker and more viscous. rather than thinner. Hope someone else can chime in on this! I did some experimenting with 1000mg calcium and it did make my blood darker and thicker, but now I'm experiencing heart palps and back pain. I think this may need to be balanced by magnesium but magnesium always thins my blood. Someone suggested I take them together, but I always thought Calcium and Magnesium opposes eachother.

 

[datadragon]

Other research shows Vitamin D at dosages of 4000IU reduced Von Willebrand Factor concentrations, preventing triggering of the formation of unnecessary blood clots. So it appears it has the ability to reduce clotting. Thrombin is implicated in the physiology of blood clots. Its presence indicates the existence of a clot. Your study mentions Vitamin D is associated with a reduction in thrombin generation so again related to reduction of clotting and a deficiency of Vitamin D can lead to enhancing blood clotting.

I believe I posted some things that thin blood I quickly put together you may consider lessening, many are due to having things like Vitamin E as an ingredient and talk it over with your health care practitioner https://forums.phoenixrising.me/thr...crease-bleeding-tendencies.90546/post-2441133

The pooled data from trials of vitamin D supplementation with dosage of 4000IU/day showed it significantly reduced von Willebrand Factor concentrations, WHILE THERE WAS NO EFFECT of vitamin D supplementation on vWF concentrations among trials with the dosage of intervention >4000IU/day (High vitamin D doses didnt work) https://nutritionandmetabolism.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12986-018-0320-9

 

[tootsieroll]

Other research shows Vitamin D at dosages of 4000IU reduced Von Willebrand Factor concentrations, preventing triggering of the formation of unnecessary blood clots. So it appears it has the ability to reduce clotting. Thrombin is implicated in the physiology of blood clots. Its presence indicates the existence of a clot. Your study mentions Vitamin D is associated with a reduction in thrombin generation so again related to reduction of clotting and a deficiency of Vitamin D can lead to enhancing blood clotting.

I believe I posted some things that thin blood I quickly put together you may consider lessening, many are due to having things like Vitamin E as an ingredient and talk it over with your health care practitioner https://forums.phoenixrising.me/thr...crease-bleeding-tendencies.90546/post-2441133

The pooled data from trials of vitamin D supplementation with dosage of 4000IU/day showed it significantly reduced von Willebrand Factor concentrations, WHILE THERE WAS NO EFFECT of vitamin D supplementation on vWF concentrations among trials with the dosage of intervention >4000IU/day (High vitamin D doses didnt work) https://nutritionandmetabolism.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12986-018-0320-9

HI! I'm not currently taking anything that things my blood but this thin consistency did start after i took single doses of Activated charcoal, colloidal silver and black seed oil. that was the point of no return. But I'm severely low in Vitamin D. but I don't understand how Vitamin D can thing the blood when it draws more calcium into the blood stream. And calcium is needed for the clotting cascade. This confuses me.

 

[linusbert]

Someone suggested I take them together, but I always thought Calcium and Magnesium opposes eachother.

they use the same transporters. and they are antagonists in the body, calcium can be antidote to too much magnesium.
in generall its good to have balance with electrolytes and not take a thing isolated in high dose.
i actually wouldnt worry about this, just mix it up, spread over the day. Sango has lots of both , in 2 ca : 1 mg ratio.


i am not sure about your understanding of "thin/thick" blood. you say one time its about clotting, and another time the fluidity of the blood. i am not sure they are related. clotting is one thing, but the flow properties of you blood seams for me to have more to do with hydration.
why does this worry you? do you feel side effects when its "too thin"?

 

[tootsieroll]

they use the same transporters. and they are antagonists in the body, calcium can be antidote to too much magnesium.
in generall its good to have balance with electrolytes and not take a thing isolated in high dose.
i actually wouldnt worry about this, just mix it up, spread over the day. Sango has lots of both , in 2 ca : 1 mg ratio.


i am not sure about your understanding of "thin/thick" blood. you say one time its about clotting, and another time the fluidity of the blood. i am not sure they are related. clotting is one thing, but the flow properties of you blood seams for me to have more to do with hydration.
why does this worry you? do you feel side effects when its "too thin"?

Oh I've been bleeding profusely for 6 years (I'm female). It doesn't stop bleeding. Ferritin is tanking and so are my hemoglobins. I was bleeding for 5 years thick blood and easier to stop but now that it is thin and watery, I can sit on the toilet and listen to it come out of me like a faucet. My blood has lost it's ability to clot. But it seemed I clotted better when blood was more viscous. Now I can't get up without it rushing out and from sides of my pants. I don't wear pants any more. Just a garbage bag around me as I shift from bed to toilet. I know the nonstop bleeding is a progesterone issue and most likely my naturopath detoxed estrogen into my blood stream when he used glutathione on me. But only this past year the blood became like water after I used activated charcoal, colloidal silver, and black seed oil. I had a protruding gut so I assumed my bleeding was caused by sulfuric property of glutathione. I was wrong, the protruding gut was my inflamed uterus from too much estrogen. I have progesterone coming in but this will not fix the wateriness of my blood. I know those three products changed the iron or the calcium status of my blood. Taking the calcium has definitely changed the colour but I think my thyroid is not allowing me to take large doses or an imbalanced dose. I have taken iron to initiate a change, but it didn't do much. So calcium should be a higher ratio than magnesium?

 

[linusbert]

Oh I've been bleeding profusely for 6 years (I'm female). It doesn't stop bleeding. Ferritin is tanking and so are my hemoglobins. I was bleeding for 5 years thick blood and easier to stop but now that it is thin and watery, I can sit on the toilet and listen to it come out of me like a faucet. My blood has lost it's ability to clot. But it seemed I clotted better when blood was more viscous. Now I can't get up without it rushing out and from sides of my pants. I don't wear pants any more. Just a garbage bag around me as I shift from bed to toilet. I know the nonstop bleeding is a progesterone issue and most likely my naturopath detoxed estrogen into my blood stream when he used glutathione on me. But only this past year the blood became like water after I used activated charcoal, colloidal silver, and black seed oil. I had a protruding gut so I assumed my bleeding was caused by sulfuric property of glutathione. I was wrong, the protruding gut was my inflamed uterus from too much estrogen. I have progesterone coming in but this will not fix the wateriness of my blood. I know those three products changed the iron or the calcium status of my blood. Taking the calcium has definitely changed the colour but I think my thyroid is not allowing me to take large doses or an imbalanced dose. I have taken iron to initiate a change, but it didn't do much. So calcium should be a higher ratio than magnesium?

calcium : magnesium should be whatever ratio is good for you. in general a 2:1 ratio seams favorable but that doesnt apply to everyone. i do not tolerate calcium at all no matter the ratio.

what you describe doesnt sound like a problem of too "thin" blood. (it might be aggravating because if more viscosity it doesnt flow as easy and then might clot easier.)
this sounds like a more serious disturbance in blood coagulation.
the first thing which comes to mind is higher dose of vitamin K1 (not k2). also whatever other cofactors are required for coagulation (sadly i dont know).
and you probably shouldnt take aspirin under that conditions.

also what can make your blood more "thin" is histamine and allergic reactions, that can be endogenous production or from external sources. every time your body releases histamine it also releases heparin.

EDIT:
so according my follow up reply, calcium is crucial for formation of stable blood clots.
so if lack of calcium is your issue, than taking calcium might help or even better, taking vitamin D will help because it increases calcium absorption and calcium in your body.
so in your case if calcium is the issue, vitamin D would improve clotting aka make it more and not less.

so i would recommend taking vitamin D, vitamin K1 and K2mk4 and let the body regulate itself.
you might provide a bit of calcium and magnesium to help the regulation but maybe not do high doses or concentrate on food rich in those.

 

[linusbert]

what chatgpt has to say about blood clotting cofactors:


The co-factors for blood clotting, in addition to Vitamin K1, include various essential elements. Here are some key co-factors for blood clotting:

1. Vitamin K:
   • In addition to Vitamin K1 (Phylloquinone), Vitamin K2 (Menachinone) and Vitamin K3 (Menadione) are also crucial. These vitamins are essential for the synthesis of clotting factors in the liver.
2. Calcium:
   • Calcium ions are crucial for the formation of stable blood clots. The blood clotting process requires calcium as a co-factor for various clotting factors.

Spoiler

1. Thrombin:
   • Thrombin is an enzyme that plays a central role in the conversion of fibrinogen to fibrin, the main component of blood clots.
2. Fibrinogen:
   • Fibrinogen is a protein that is converted to fibrin during blood clotting. Fibrin forms the framework of the blood clot.
3. Clotting Factors:
   • Various clotting factors such as Factor VIII, Factor IX, and others are proteins involved in the cascade of blood clotting.
4. Antithrombin III:
   • Antithrombin III is a natural anticoagulant that inhibits the activity of thrombin and other clotting factors.
5. Protein C and Protein S:
   • These proteins are also important regulators of blood clotting and act as anticoagulants.
6. Glycoproteins:
   • Various glycoprotein-containing structures on the surface of blood cells and in blood plasma play a role in the adhesion and aggregation of blood cells during clotting.

These factors work together to ensure balanced blood clotting. An imbalance in this system can lead to bleeding disorders or excessive blood clotting. It is important to note that a variety of genetic and acquired conditions can affect blood clotting, leading to different disorders. If you have health-related questions, it's always advisable to consult a qualified healthcare professional.

 

[datadragon]

My blood has lost it's ability to clot.

Again, the research shows that Vitamin D will further contribute toward reduced clotting or at least breaking up existing clots. So would zinc and Vitamin A acccording to the below research.

Black seed oil may decrease blood clotting risk because it is known to have blood-thinning effects. This may be advantageous for those with a history of blood clots or other health issues that raise the risk of blood clots. However, consuming black seed oil can increase your risk of bleeding. Antiplatelets keep blood cells from sticking together to become a clot. Anticoagulants cause clotting to occur more slowly. Both need to be reduced right now working with your medical provider until the problem is resolved. Here are some others https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/322384 The previous link I gave mentioned many others to investigate. Aspirin is a well known one, the ingredient salicylic acid is in other things however.

The ADAMTS13 enzyme cuts von Willebrand factor into smaller pieces. By processing von Willebrand factor in this way, the ADAMTS13 enzyme prevents von Willebrand Factor from triggering the formation of unnecessary blood clots. If ADAMTS13 is lacking, unusually large multimers of von Willebrand factor can accumulate and trigger intravascular platelet aggregation and microthrombosis (blood clotting).

ADAMTS13 is a zinc-containing metalloprotease enzyme so it requires zinc to function and would not function with a zinc deficiency. An active metabolite of Vitamin A (all trans retinoic acid) regulates the balance of ADAMTS13 and VWF in endothelial cells. ATRA significantly upregulated the expression of ADAMTS13 which explains the known antithrombotic property of ATRA and ATRA can reverse the inhibition of Adamts13 by TNF-a production. TNF-α is a cytokine involved in systemic inflammation, secreted by activated macrophages. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0026286215300145 So that is also suggesting that reducing inflammation (TNF-a) greatly is normally helpful for excessive clotting, but makes things worse if you are heavily bleeding. Lowering homocysteine at this time (methylation supplements) may also work against your current bleeding problem.

Plasma zinc levels increased significantly only in the group receiving the combination of zinc and vitamins A and D (in RDA concentrations not high doses).
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11011-006-9023-4 Many on this forum may have problems with excessive clotting going the other way due to their lowered zinc and Vitamin A from inflammation/infection.