valium makes fatigue go !!!

[Wayne]

Anybody have any suggestions for less addictive, fatigue lessening meds...

Non-Med Suggestions: Iodine, nettles, niacin, Vitamin C, DMSO, transdermal magnesium chloride, CoQ10.

Niacin = Valium (?)

I continue to experiment with niacin. I take it in different sized doses on different days, even abstaining at times for a few days. I'm getting a better sense for it all the time, and I'm finding it to be similar to my experiences with valium.

I recall finding valium to be calming (many years ago), but at the same time somewhat somewhat energizing. Niacin is feeling more and more like a great find for me. I only need a couple of doses of about 250 mg a couple times a day to get good results.

THIS ARTICLE lists some supplements that can help with benzodiazapine withdrawal. Niacin is one of them. If the supplements listed can help with withdrawal, it would make sense that they could be a good substitute for benzodiazapines to begin with.

Wayne
...............................................

For some reason, the link isn't currently working. Here's the article...

Supplements Accelerate Benzodiazepine Withdrawal
A Case Report and Biochemical Rationale

by W. Todd Penberthy, PhD and Andrew W. Saul

(OMNS March 18, 2014) A middle-aged male had success rapidly reducing fast-acting alprazolam (Xanax) dosage by taking very high doses of niacin, along with gamma aminobutyric acid (GABA) and vitamin C. The individual had been on 1 mg/day Xanax for two years, a moderate dose but a long duration. As a result, he had been presenting increased anxiety, personality changes, and ringing in the ears (tinnitus), all side effects likely due to long-term alprazolam use. Typical withdrawal from this drug would involve substitution medication, about a 10% dose reduction per week, and take a matter of months.[1] A fast withdrawal is a 12.5 to 25% reduction per week.[2] On very high doses of niacin, vitamin C, and also GABA, this individual reported being able to cut the dose 60% down to 0.4 mg in one week. The dose was reduced by 90% (to 0.1 mg/day) in less than a month. He reported residual anxiety, but that it was substantially less than when fully medicated. After a total of five weeks, the medication intake was zero, with minimal residual anxiety.

Dosage
Niacin doses were between 6,000 and 12,000 mg/day. The individual reported reduced anxiety when taking the highest levels of niacin. Bowel-tolerance levels of vitamin C were taken daily, along with 750 mg of GABA twice daily. The individual also drank a quart of beet/cabbage soup broth daily for the first week, took 400 mg magnesium citrate/day, and took sublingual methylcobalamin (hi-absorption B-12), 5,000 mcg twice a week. During the initial total withdrawal from alprazolam, intake of GABA was 750 mg three times daily. The patient experienced side effects of daily but manageable anxiety. He also reported occasional nausea, possibly attributable to the GABA and almost certainly attributable to the extremely high niacin intake. He experienced increased frequency of urination, especially at night. Evening niacin doses as inositol hexaniacinate (a semi-sustained release, no-flush niacin) reduced nighttime urination. The individual used regular flush niacin about three-quarters of the time; inositol hexaniacinate constituted the balance. Dosage was divided into eight to ten 1,000 mg 8-10 such doses in 24 hours. Niacinamide was specifically not used, as its nausea threshold is low (under 6,000 mg day)....

Read more here.​

 

[CFS_for_19_years]

Anybody have any suggestions for less addictive, fatigue lessening meds...

I forgot to mention PQQ, something that was recommended to me by a Life Extension naturopath.

I've found PQQ to be a useful supplement to get rid of some brain fog and increase alertness. I don't take it after 12 noon or it will keep me awake.

On the downside, some people have said it makes them feel speedy or wired. I've never had that problem, but I thought you should be aware of it.
Of all the supplements I've tried, PQQ feels like it makes my brain function better and makes me more alert without any jittery feelings.

Here are some inexpensive sources:
https://www.swansonvitamins.com/swanson-ultra-pqq-pyrroloquinoline-quinone-20-mg-30-veg-caps

www.amazon.com/Mind-Source-Naturals-Inc-Tabs/dp/B00BTNIJ0A (these are 20mg tablets)

The great thing about the Source Naturals tablet is that you can cut them if you have a pill cutter handy. I feel some energizing effects even at 5 mg.

 

[justy]

my cfs team have asked my gp to test for lymes so waiting to hear back.... its possible as my cfs started when we lived in the forest of dean..... i see you went for the eco living as we did but had to sell up as i could no longer manage the up keep with the fatigue.... i was gutted....

Yes - we have a smallholding and built an eco house - but will be selling this year. I cant do anything anymore and my husband works full time and cares for me and kids - the place is too much now, but we are gutted to leave.

Please be aware that testing for Lyme disease has a very high false negative rate - especially if you have been ill for some time. I was probably bitten about 20 years ago. I had private testing, but that was negative. I was diagnosed on the basis, by the private Dr, of co infections (I tested positive for a past infection of Tularemia and you can really only get that from a tick bite) and the fact that my immune system is messed up and on symptoms. There is no gold standard test for Lyme so a clinical diagnosis (which you will never get on the NHS), from an experienced physician is the best way to go. There is no one in the UK who can, or will do this.

I guess what im saying is that even if the test is negative it doesn't mean you don't have Lyme.

good luck

 

[barbc56]

Clonazepam is the benzo often used for neurological symptoms. I use it for RLS and anxiety. I've been on it for almost 20 years and actually take less than first prescribed. But if I did go off it, I would surely get withdrawal symptoms. Other meds can give you something called discontinuation syndrome which is not as bad but your body may become acclimated to the medication.

I say to hell with addiction! If you need relief, you need it. Unfortunately, anxiety can be self feeding and sometimes that cycle needs to be broken so it won't get worse. A good

If something natural has medical properties, then it will also carry the side effects of addiction.

But with the prescription meds. at least you have the assurance of quality control which you don't with the others.

Obviously, this is my opinion of "natural" medications. But it's certainly an issue of personal choice.

Keep us postec and hope things improve quickly.

 

[Dr.Patient]

I say to hell with addiction! If you need relief, you need it. Unfortunately, anxiety can be self feeding and sometimes that cycle needs to be broken so it won't get worse.

I agree- to hell with addiction! While addiction may be a possibility in the future, enormous, crushing fatigue is a clear and present danger- that we need to deal with- now and today!

It is reassuring to see that there are a lot of patients who have been on ambien, xanax, and with you, klonopin- for 10 years or more. Thank you for sharing that information!

If we do get better with this mecfs in a few years, then we will have the energy to deal with any addictions at that time. There are treatments for addictions- but none for the crushing fatigue we feel today!

We have picked our battles.

 

[heapsreal]

I agree- to hell with addiction! While addiction may be a possibility in the future, enormous, crushing fatigue is a clear and present danger- that we need to deal with- now and today!

It is reassuring to see that there are a lot of patients who have been on ambien, xanax, and with you, klonopin- for 10 years or more. Thank you for sharing that information!

If we do get better with this mecfs in a few years, then we will have the energy to deal with any addictions at that time. There are treatments for addictions- but none for the crushing fatigue we feel today!

We have picked our battles.

People can mixed up between dependence and addiction. Is a diabetic addicted to insulin? Is someone with hypertension addicted to blood pressure meds? Even though many of us use a sleep med for years and used the same dose during that time and we don't do it to get high but treat a medical condition or symptom, is that addictive?

For most of us with cfsme, certain symptoms won't go away until there's a cure. Mostly all we have is symptomatic treatments. For me without sleep it's a whole different crappier level of cfs. I'll take the drugs.

Agree Dr Patient

 

[minkeygirl]

Discontinuation syndrome is withdrawal. It just doesn't sound as bad.

 

[Ninan]

Same for me. I got lots of energy from valium and before also from certain dosages of Gabapentin. The gabapentin energy effect disappeared when I tried Valium though.

 

[outdamnspot]

I notice increased energy the next day from Imovane/Zopiclone. However, a GP I saw yesterday wouldn't prescribe it and gave me Valium instead. I notice people say they get increased energy from benzos; however, while I slept well on the Diazepam (10mg), the fatigue is crippling today. Any guesses why? Do benzos significantly impact cortisol levels?

 

[Wayne]

while I slept well on the Diazepam (10mg), the fatigue is crippling today. Any guesses why? Do benzos significantly impact cortisol levels?

Hi @outdamnspot -- I would be VERY cautious about starting a benzodiazapine like valium, particularly without doing extensive research on it first. For some people who have ultra sensitive natures (many of us on this forum), very serious long-term "side effects" can happen in relatively short order, with recovery sometimes months or even years away--if ever. It sounds like your doctor gave you this prescription without thinking through some of these possibilities. I encourage you to do your homework. You may want to check out a benzodiazapine withdrawal support group: Benzobuddies.

Take care!

 

[outdamnspot]

Hi @outdamnspot -- I would be VERY cautious about starting a benzodiazapine like valium, particularly without doing extensive research on it first. For some people who have ultra sensitive natures (many of us on this forum), very serious long-term "side effects" can happen in relatively short order, with recovery sometimes months or even years away--if ever. It sounds like your doctor gave you this prescription without thinking through some of these possibilities. I encourage you to do your homework. You may want to check out a benzodiazapine withdrawal support group: Benzobuddies.

Take care!

I only use prescription sleeping aids in emergencies to get out of severe crashes, which they're very helpful for. Just confused why Imovane tends to have an energizing effect whereas a regular benzo like Diazepam severely increased fatigue (esp. when very severe/catatonic patients often report feeling temporarily better om benzos).