Tissue stretching causing crash anyone else?

xebex

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Can anyone relate to this symptom - it’s one of my worst symptoms and basically stops me living any kind of life. If I sit hunched over playing a board game for instance (cooking is the worst as I have no choice but to do that, but even sitting in the car causes it) I can feel all my muscles/ligaments/fascia in my mid/upper stretching and pulling. If I do this for too long maybe more than 10minutes I will crash ie get very sleepy , nauseated, back of head pain, lose words, get irritable etc and wake up then next day with flu like symptoms muscles aches reduced stamina. I really have no idea what is going on other than some kind of laxity in those tissues that’s causing histamine release or something? I also feel that possibly it’s a collagen issue as my spine at the T4 hurts more and more the more I stretch these muscles, maybe it’s moving out of place?. Maybe you get similar in your neck if you have CCI? Any thoughts?
 

wabi-sabi

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It strikes me that there could be at least two different things going on here (and probably other things I can't think of right now).

1) this might be cause by stretching unhappy muscles or 2) it might be a manifestation of orthostatic intolerance or 3) might be caused by the muscles having to work so hard to hold you up.

Do you get the same sort of crash if you stretch or work the muscles in a similar way while lying down? If not, this suggests an orthostatic issue. If so, it suggests a muscular issue, either with stretching or contracting.

Not sure how to advise you on a potential CCI issue.
 

xebex

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Thanks yes I think it’s a combination of all 3 but I don’t know why the muscles are like that other than they just damaged from spasming so bad after an injury (it’s been like this for 2 years!). I do have orthostatic intolerance but it’s not really obvious POTs, but it still happens even if I manage to stand completely upright without hunching the muscles seem to pull down instead , it’s got better since I improved posture so now I can stand for 10mins instead of 2 but no further improvement. Ritalin seems to help a little bit not sure why and camphor patches also help.

If I work the muscles lieing down it will cause a crash because ther is some spinal irritation triggered by “neural strain”, but it absolutely is worse when upright.
 
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xebex

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I thinkni mivht have this when i lay in a weird way with my spine.
interesting - i have to lie flat on my back and its painful to lie on my side thought i have been "training" myself to lie on the painful side as doing this doesn't seem to cause a crash so i was hoping i could desensitize myself but doesn't seem to be working so far! lol.
 
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Hi. I have such a problem after a back injury. The tube fell in the area of T 3, T 4. Hemangioma on the MRI, I think from a blow. Nothing helps. If you stretch or relax, it gets worse, maybe the vertebrae are displaced, I don't know. At first there was the right side, but about five years have passed and now the left too. Sometimes the vertebrae crack and click. I was at Hiro, I did physiotherapy. Nothing. I drink ketorol when it's already very hard. Any stretch of the neck, arms or back causes an aggravation. and spasm for three days. Maybe someone solved this problem. I'm also interested. I apologize for the English :)
 

xebex

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@natkea wow this sounds very similar to me, so I’ve found myofascial massage helpful (I do it on myself using a small hard rubber ball) but it does always come back eventually. Muscle relaxants help and camphor patches with Methyl salicylate (Salonpas) but nothing has really improved it. Are you crashing when you stand up and do you think your crash is directly related to the spine problem?
 
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Oh, yes. It's better for me to just lie on my back, without a pillow. I can't stand or sit for a long time. It's hard to straighten my back. Raising my arms for more than 30 seconds, they become weak. I did a test for myasthenia gravis. Nothing was found, only a 30% decrease in neuro muscle conduction. But they cannot explain what it is and where it came from. But I know that before the injury I have never had pain, spasm and muscle weakness. Yeah, I also try the ball and it helps, but for a very short time. I also have ultrasound, ems, infrared light, I am being treated but I do not see any improvement. By the way, on MRI I see the displacement of the entire thoracic and cervical region in one direction. It is strange that the doctors are silent about this. All my ribs, collarbones, and shoulder blades still hurt. it feels like it's some kind of protective spasm.
 
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I forgot to mention that when I lie on my back, quietly, without moving, the pulse almost immediately drops to normal and what I cannot understand is that the temperature drops from 37 to 36.6. This is a mystery to me.
 

xebex

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@Nat kea i haven’t tried the temperature test interesting! It sounds like the problem is giving you orthostatic tolerance caused by autonomic dysfunction, I’m pretty sure that’s what the injury is doing to me, but I can’t find a way to fix it! Pretty much any stretching or weight training or movement with arms, I do causes stress on The spine and triggers a crash. I’m at a loss! I’m going to get an MRI but from what you’ve said it’ll probably not show anything! Or nothing the docs will understand!
 
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Yes, try the temperature test, I wonder if I'm the only one so mysterious? :) And what was your injury? I had a severe pain shock. As they write, a vicious circle was formed, pain in the brain, muscles, spasm. Maybe it is, because there is a reason why complete relaxation and recovery does not occur ...
 

xebex

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Yes, try the temperature test, I wonder if I'm the only one so mysterious? :) And what was your injury? I had a severe pain shock. As they write, a vicious circle was formed, pain in the brain, muscles, spasm. Maybe it is, because there is a reason why complete relaxation and recovery does not occur ...
Yea I do believe there some kind of sensitization going on but Ive tried desenstization several time and thoiugh it does help it always come back again. I lifted a sofa and felt a pop, I instantly had racing heart drop in blood pressure, near fainting, weak arms etc, doc refuses to investigate, Over time the extreme reaction went away (that lasted about 6 weeks) but I’ve been left with not being able to stand up for over 2 years now. I had ME before this and I was actually starting to improve until this happened.
 
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I also had CFS before, about 10 years. But never pain and problems with movement. Apparently these are two different problems. My 7 cervical vertebra is very bulging, and my neck is tilted to one side from spasm. In general, after a blow to the back. I was twisted all over. The pelvis is also twisted, this is very evident from the clothes, the buttons and the seams. I don't know how to help myself anymore.
 

xebex

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I also had CFS before, about 10 years. But never pain and problems with movement. Apparently these are two different problems. My 7 cervical vertebra is very bulging, and my neck is tilted to one side from spasm. In general, after a blow to the back. I was twisted all over. The pelvis is also twisted, this is very evident from the clothes, the buttons and the seams. I don't know how to help myself anymore.
Yes I think two separate issues but the pain and spasms are directly causing me to crash so that’s not the case for you?
 

Wolfcub

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@xebex I find any stresses, whether they be physical or mental can bring on crash symptoms if I am heading that way to start with.

I don 't know if a study has been done anywhere about this, but it takes a tremendous amount of energy and burns a lot of calories....just to have tension in muscles. Muscle tension can bring on plain tiredness even in healthy people.

For us, sitting in a car etc, can mean such a lot of energy usage.
 
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Yes I think two separate issues but the pain and spasms are directly causing me to crash so that’s not the case for you?
All this is so much mixed that it is already difficult to understand, fatigue and fog are always with me, pains too, but they are of different intensity, but constant. Spasms and pains of course make the tolerance of CFS completely unbearable. But still the worst thing for me personally is brain fog I have a feeling that the brain is so badly out of order and suffering.