Tai Chi

[Effi]

Thanks for sharing @nial. I do believe these gentle movement exercises (yoga, tai chi, qi gong, whatever you feel most comfortable with) can be very helpful for some. This is why I tried yoga right after I got sick. It was adapted to my physical situation by the teacher who was the most gentle and caring person you can imagine. But I couldn't do it. I tried keeping up with some even lighter yoga exercises at home (even shorter and less intense than in a group session, think seconds and very little actual movement) but I couldn't even hold the dead man pose (Shavasana). I think that says it all.

I then tried Qi Gong as I've heard good things about it. I know a few people with mild to serious health problems (not all ME though) who've experienced benefits from Qi Gong. It was too much for me though.

I think for me it's the standing up, plus the concentration, plus the arm movements that goes way above my physical limits. Even just meditation is too much concentration and it wipes me out. Same for breathing exercises. Just trying to keep my baseline stable, and just being aware of what is going on in my body is the most I can handle right now.

 

[Snowdrop]

I had forgotten meditation practice which I also did and still try to do sometimes. Problem is, if I have even a little energy to spend then there are so many things that need doing.

In the past I did get some help from a restorative yoga class. Not very much happened per class. It used a lot of props and then you stayed in the pose.
Unfortunately it was at a place that was not close to home--we were on holiday.
I doubt it would help now anyway although it would be great if it did. I can also no longer afford it and someone else would have to do the whole prop set up which would be way too much effort for me.

@PeterPositive

Over the years I have tried many therapies including other than the ones mentioned here to do with yoga etc.
Supplements may yet offer some relief but that is a matter of being able to pay for them as well.
Most recently I have been taking Vitamin D which does help a little and needs to be used on and off. Vitamin C powder--it's inexpensive and can be ingested throughout the day, as well as B vitamins. I can't/don't take them every day as a) I'm not always well enough physically and cognitively to manage and b) I think it may be too much anyway.

I plan to start taking resistant starch as this should be easy and not expensive. I have spent a lot of time reading up on the thread here.
I hope this may also help.

But ultimately nothing I've done so far has been anything near to bringing me back to normal. As with any other disease I am starting to think that while it's nice to imagine healing coming from more natural sources real hope now lies with a more allopathic approach. Much the way there are drug treatments now for Arthritis and Diabetes.
Not to mention that if such an approach were accepted as mainstream medicine the treatment would be covered by prescription health insurance and therefore affordable. Natural treatments are always going to cost probably more than I can afford.

Sorry, answering this question has taken the thread off track.

With regards to anyone doing or wanting to try Tai Chi, the biggest hinderance is for those (which would be many of us) with orthostatic issues. Doing TC either standing or using our arms can be harmful. But if you don't have OI issues or PEM from gentle movement TC could possibly be very enjoyable. But even sitting TC is an issue for some of us and again using our arms for movement is absurdly hard. For me it's not even an issue of over the head. I don't know why.

Also, for @nial and @MikeM

I know I possibly sound cranky with regard to the suggestion of Tai Chi's benefits. I have no doubt that especially for neurotypical or basically well people with/out modest health complaints TC is wonderful. I'm actually always grateful when people show an interest in ME patients and offer practical assistance.

If you are at all interested in the latest ME news as to what is being found in science research and what is now known about ME may I suggest that you have a look at this thread:

http://forums.phoenixrising.me/index.php?threads/stanford-2015-spring-newsletter.38011/#post-606085

I hope you may find it useful.

 

[Little Bluestem]

I took a Tai Chi class years ago and really enjoyed it. It did not make me better. I had no idea what the problem was at the time and was doing everything wrong, partly because I was trying to keep my job. No way is Tai Chi going to overcome that degree of PEM! I was not able to keep it up.

The class I took was developed for people recovering from cancer, but was open to anyone. The instructor was expecting to be dealing with people who were not well. Health facilities would be a good place for someone with ME to look for a class.

I was doing a modern, medically oriented form of Tai Chi. In traditional Tai Chi, movement is always to the right. Medical Tai Chi does movements both directions.

If you do Tai Chi and feel better then you don't have a form of CFS or ME that has PEM. This is because exertion makes you feel better. With ME at least, we know exertion makes people feel worse as the doctors who described the disease found that.

Tai Chi, at least some types, does not require a lot of exertion. I think that a person with mild - moderate ME that gets PEM and understands pacing could do Tai Chi without exceeding their energy envelop.

 

[SOC]

Tai Chi, at least some types, does not require a lot of exertion. I think that a person with mild - moderate ME that gets PEM and understands pacing could do Tai Chi without exceeding their energy envelop.

We probably need to add that mild-moderate PWME with OI (which is a lot of us) would probably not be able to do Tai Chi, either because of standing or the arm motions involved.

I think the bottom line here is that while a few people diagnosed with CFS could do well with Tai Chi, those who fit the SEID criteria with PEM and OI probably can't (and/or shouldn't) do it unless their PEM threshold is quite high and their OI is under excellent control. That's not many of us.

Tai Chi is a wonderful activity for people at many different health levels. It's on my list to try if I ever get healthy enough. Unfortunately, major features of it are not suitable for PWME, especially those with OI.

 

[Snowdrop]

I think the original posters that suggested Tai Chi or Qigong could be helpful have left the thread after our rather unfortunate (but understandable) negative posts. They were all new and probably not aware at the level of disability experienced by many of us if they even had any real idea of ME. I'm sorry if we pushed them away. It's unfortunate when that happens.

I keep thinking that there should be some sort of information blurb that one has to read when signing up as a member. Something brief but helps new people who come to the sight looking for help/or to offer it who we are as ME patients.

I'm sorry if @nial , @blue-sky , @MikeM felt they weren't welcome here.

 

[SOC]

I think the original posters that suggested Tai Chi or Qigong could be helpful have left the thread after our rather unfortunate (but understandable) negative posts. They were all new and probably not aware at the level of disability experienced by many of us if they even had any real idea of ME. I'm sorry if we pushed them away. It's unfortunate when that happens.

I keep thinking that there should be some sort of information blurb that one has to read when signing up as a member. Something brief but helps new people who come to the sight looking for help/or to offer it who we are as ME patients.

I'm sorry if @nial , @blue-sky , @MikeM felt they weren't welcome here.

Let's hope that if they were here to get knowledge and assistance about ME they would have stayed given the vast amount of information here. If they were here simply to impart their wisdom about Tai Chi, Qigong, or other alternative therapies, they have probably achieved their end and happily moved on to share their wisdom on other health sites.

Fortunately, telling the truth and honest discussion rarely chases away people trying to do the best they can to learn and share information, so I doubt there is a problem. Whether those people are still here or not, they probably stayed or left according to what satisfied their personal needs, rather than were pushed away by civil discussion. Now if we'd called them names and slapped them around a bit, that might have been a different matter.

 

[Little Bluestem]

I am fortunate in that I don't really have OI. I will get light-headed if I am not well-hydrated (low blood volume) or if I get up early in the morning and just stand around.

I think those with an early diagnosis would be good candidates for Tai Chi. It is sometimes described as moving meditation. I think it has a calming effect on the autonomic nervous system.

It is also recommended for (healthy) older people because it builds core strength with low-impact exercise.

 

[hellytheelephant]

I am unable to do a full session of tai chi but I can do 15 mins in 5 min chunks on a good day. I use a Don Fiore DVD aimed at seniors/Parkinsons patients.

For me I find the exercises wonderfully calming and balancing. I feel more aware of my body and how I use it. My posture is noticably better and it is a good aid to a clogged digestive system.

For me one of the worst aspects of cfs is not being able to exercise. I know I am not going to get fit doing this, but on the positive side I am doing up to 60 mins of exercise a week I wasn't doing a year ago.

I would suggest anyone thinking of trying it just do a minute to start and listen to your body.- another important thing for me is the time of day, for some reason it is easier for me in the afternoon/evening even though my brain fog is worse. then.

 

[*GG*]

I am unable to do a full session of tai chi but I can do 15 mins in 5 min chunks on a good day. I use a Don Fiore DVD aimed at seniors/Parkinsons patients.

For me I find the exercises wonderfully calming and balancing. I feel more aware of my body and how I use it. My posture is noticably better and it is a good aid to a clogged digestive system.

For me one of the worst aspects of cfs is not being able to exercise. I know I am not going to get fit doing this, but on the positive side I am doing up to 60 mins of exercise a week I wasn't doing a year ago.

I would suggest anyone thinking of trying it just do a minute to start and listen to your body.- another important thing for me is the time of day, for some reason it is easier for me in the afternoon/evening even though my brain fog is worse. then.

Stumbled upon the link for this:

GG

 

[hellytheelephant]

Thanks for posting that.Yes- that is exactly the one I use!