T-cell / B-cell ratio

[cfs since 1998]

I am not sure where to post this since there is not a lab test/diagnostic section.

Has anyone ever had, or heard of a doctor suggesting, a T-cell/B-cell ratio lab test? This is not the same as Th1/Th2 ratio. Anyway, this test is widely available (e.g. through Labcorp) and apparently AIDS patients sometimes use it, but is pretty expensive at around $500. I am just wondering if any useful information could be found by having this test. It would be interesting if anyone ever had an abnormal result. A second look at the B-cell depletion (rituximab) study from Norway prompted me to think about this. I don't think I've seen any published research which tested this parameter in their patients.

 

[Hysterical Woman]

T cell/B cell

I am not sure where to post this since there is not a lab test/diagnostic section.

Has anyone ever had, or heard of a doctor suggesting, a T-cell/B-cell ratio lab test? This is not the same as Th1/Th2 ratio. Anyway, this test is widely available (e.g. through Labcorp) and apparently AIDS patients sometimes use it, but is pretty expensive at around $500. I am just wondering if any useful information could be found by having this test. It would be interesting if anyone ever had an abnormal result. A second look at the B-cell depletion (rituximab) study from Norway prompted me to think about this. I don't think I've seen any published research which tested this parameter in their patients.

Hi CFS.....

Is that the CD4/CD8 ratio? If that is the case I did in fact get these tests done by a neurologist in NYC and they were abnormal. I wish I could find copies of the lab results, but that was in 1992 and I suspect I wouldn't be able to find them.

I don't believe the neurologist I saw is currently in private practice (Kristina Dahl), I believe she only does research now. She was a CFS patient herself.

As to whether this test is worth the cost? I think it allowed her to give me a dx of CFS, but I don't think it lead to any treatment options. Again, this was in 1992 so there weren't exactly treatment options jumping out of the woodwork.

Hopefully others will have more recent test results.

Thanks again for you incredibly interesting posts, you have really been drilling for information.

Good Luck,

Maxine

 

[heapsreal]

hi

My last blood test showed a low cd4/cd8 ratio, this is suppose to indicate a weak immune system. So far all my tests have shown an above normal total cd4 lymphocytes as well as cd8 and a few other lymphocyte classes. My doc assumed this was from reactive EBV and after treatment with famvir these have steadily come down, but still not in normal range, so maybe its xmrv thats keeping it abnormal?? cd8 lymphocytes are suppose to be the main lymphocytes that attack viruses, so an elevation of these means possible ongoing viral infection.

Keep in touch.

 

[cfs since 1998]

Thanks for your responses. I looked it up and CD4/CD8 is the ratio of T-helper cells to T-killer cells, and doesn't look at B cells. This test is considerably cheaper (less than $100) than the T/B cell test. It seems that doctors and researchers do not usually measure the T/B cell ratio of their patients, maybe because it is so expensive and they haven't thought to try it. It would be interesting to know if CFS patients in general, and patients that responded to ritixumab, had an abnormal number of B cells or abnormal T/B ratio.

 

[consuegra]

immuknow test

I do not know about the specific test of which you are asking. However I am familiar with a test made by Viracor called Immuknow. It is used to measure immune system strength in AIDS patients and transplant patients and is a simple blood test. I have written more about it on my blog.

Chris

http://cfspatientadvocate.blogspot.com

 

[cfs since 1998]

I do not know about the specific test of which you are asking. However I am familiar with a test made by Viracor called Immuknow. It is used to measure immune system strength in AIDS patients and transplant patients and is a simple blood test. I have written more about it on my blog.

That is a really interesting test. I'll have to think about getting it. Any idea how much it costs? It's too bad it's not used more in CFS.

 

[consuegra]

immuknow test

This immuknow test from Viracor lab costs $185.

Chris

http://cfspatientadvocate.blogspot.com

 

[perovyscus]

I got a test from www.directlabs.com called T & B Lymph/Natural Killer Short. It includes B-Cells and T-Cells and NKCs. It is $289, and you can find coupons to make it $260.

It's run by Labcorp and I got the results within the week. It's one of the reasons I skipped on rituximab, no B cell problems per se.

 

[cold_taste_of_tears]

Thank you to everyone who has given details here about this test.
Very useful.

 

[Solon]

I tested too for this 11 years ago when i was initially infected. CD4 cells were low back then and constantly declining through the years yet at a much lower ratio than AIDS patients. CD8 cells are ok though and so are NK cells which is really weird, so i know my cellular immunity is compromised but in contrast to other CFS (and most of them) patients who have low NK cell function mine are ok.

I also have low B cell count, and low total T+B+NK consistency check.

So i wonder if immune modulators work for me.

I wonder too what is the connection of B cells to TH1 and TH2 responses
Does low B cell count mean low TH2 response or is it irrelevant. Surprisingly those simple issues are not described in my immunology book

I talked with Dr.CHIA because i have a severe enterovirus infection + CMV +(??? maybe HHV6 or XMRV) about a treatment like Oxymatrine for the enterovirus and he told me that my picture is typical of enterovirus infection and that the only way to determine a TH1 to TH2 shift is via gene microarray test or something.

 

[perovyscus]

You can get a pretty good idea of Th1/Th2 balance just by an ESR, assuming several criteria are met:

-no clotting disorders
-no lupus
-other things that I may be overlooking.

Low ESR: zero to one (th2 dominance)
Normal ESR: Most normal individuals
High ESR: Th1 inflammation

The test costs about $20.

 

[Solon]

Wow, didnt know that about the ESR!!!
I have to redo this test next time i go to the university lab. I tried to convince my Immunology Professor to help me and he promised me to take any test i want for free, he is my last help reservoir in my university, all the rest ditched me after they found out how complicated patient i was and didnt follow their antidepressant treatment suggestions.

He is also skeptical of me as a patient and med student at the same time, since he sees me so stressed and also may think its psychological, its so hard to convince someone of the stress system derangements this disease causes. If i cant get my intestines debloated i feel really stressed since i cant sit properly on a chair and relax. Doctors dont understand that, nor do they realise the levels of hypoglycemia i have or mental fog.