strange observation - can't believe I'm posting this

[Tammie]

Ok, this is really weird and may be a bit too much (& too gross) info, but I am seriously wondering if there's some kind of clue to all my stomach issues in this observation......

Over the last few yrs my stomach has become increasingly more and more upset and unable to tolerate most foods; however, it has been during the last maybe 8 months or so that things have become extremely bad (cannot keep most foods down, wind up with diarrhea with the few foods I can keep down)....anyway, I have also noticed that in those last 8 months, my toilet bowl starts to grow mold within a couple of days after I clean it.....have lived in the same place and used the same stuff to clean for 13 years, and never had this issue until the stomach problems got so bad (& I did have regular BMs, just not the diarrhea, so it was not like it was due to a lack of use or anything).....so I am wondering if the mold in the toilet bowl is resulting from whatever is causing the stomach problems & if so if that would be give me some sort of clue as to what's going on internally

sorry if this is too gross, and maybe I am just really weird to even be thinking about this, but I am getting desperate to figure this stomach stuff out

 

[gracenote]

Oh Tammie, this is the first time I've laughed today!

I've not had your particular problem, but I've called a few ME/CFS friends when O Blessed Event! my bowels moved! We would laugh that nobody but us would be interested, but to us it was worth CELEBRATING.

And THIS is worth discussing. Just no pics, please. :Retro smile: :Retro smile:

 

[Andrew]

Tammie, don't worry about this being gross, it is an important question to ask.

Could you get a gastroenterologist to check this mold. Or for that matter, has a gastroenterologist checked a bowel sample from you.

 

[Tammie]

gracenote.....glad I could make you laugh.....your response actually made me laugh, too : )

andrew, that may be possible....I actually have not been to a GI doc yet.....my CFS doc has run a bunch of tests and has finally referred me to a GI specialist bc he is at a loss....however, in the last few weeks since I was given some docs' names, I have not been able to wake up and be functioning well enough early enough to even call to try to make an appt (let alone get there) (I have big time circadian rhythm issues, too )....the one day I did make it out of bed early enough, I wound up in the ER before I was able to call, and by the time I got out of there it was far too late.....so when I finally do manage to get to a GI doc I will definitely bring it up with him (though I think he may decide I am totally nuts!)

 

[Misfit Toy]

I do not think it is gross at all, but then again I am the girl who discusses her periods in detail. Perhaps the water? Do you drink this water is toxic and do you consume it? Also, perhaps you are harboring a lot of yeast and this has something to do with mold overgrowth..because of the bacteria that is in you. I think you need a non tradtional doc who will test you via a Great Smokies test of the stool. Or, Doctors Data testing. I rarely ever get help from traditional GI docs. Go though and see what the doc has to say.

 

[Mark]

This doesn't sound so way out to me at all, based on my experience I suspect one can be subject to attack by a subtype of mold that shows up in your environment as well and that this is sometimes related to digestion. I have had a kind of fluff that gets everywhere, and pockets of that fluff near air vents etc, every so often I really blitz it and clear it all away, seems to make quite a big difference and I think I'm getting on top of it now.

Paying attention to what you eat does make a difference in my experience, in chinese terms you have too much "heat and damp" and you need more "cooling" foods...avoid pork, wheat, concentrated juice and bananas (as some of the less obvious ones); onion and garlic are good I think. I did personally find that the chinese model of dampness was a good starting guide for what foods to have (cooling foods): there are loads on the list. It's also trial and error, figuring out what the mold thrives on. Also depends what foods your sensitive to etc. General food and diet advice really goes out the window, you have to find what works for you. Elimination diet; I found fruit smoothies, beef, potatoes and broccoli are my core diet that is OK.

But you do need to also attack the mold in the environment at the same time, never have condensation on the windows (open the window at that point) but don't have windows open all the time because certain times of day (and year) spores are more likely to come in from outside. Dehumidifier and ait filter is crucial. And try to get someone else to clean out any trace of mold in the house.

Finally, for loads loads more about mold this thread should point you in the right direction:
http://www.forums.aboutmecfs.org/sh...oach-to-Address-CFS-Viruses&highlight=control
...might be a good idea to repost your observation there...

Hope you find this helpful... it's not n easy problem to tackle at all, you have to do lots of things at about the same time which is of course very tough, but I did manage to get a lot of benefit from focusing on detox and avoiding mold.

Mark

 

[Sunday]

I agree with Mark, mold has been known to cause all kinds of bad illness, and this may be something that's really complicating things for you. There is a natural remedy called Thieves' oil which some studies have shown will remove mold from your environment. Here is a post that gives a lot of info about different kinds of mold and mentions remediating it with the Thieves' oil. If you have sensitivities, you'll want to know the Thieves' oil ingredients (it's a blend of different essential oils; you dilute it with water and spray, or you can use the premade product. There's a lot of info on what types of fungi, bacteria, and pathogens it kills here, and on this page there's also a link to a downloadable .pdf that tells you how to get mold out of your environment, there's a protocol). The ingredients in Thieves' oil are: Clove (Syzygium aromaticum), lemon (Citrus limon), cinnamon (Cinnamomum verum), Eucalyptus radiata, and rosemary (Rosmarinus officinalis).


As for TMI - we seem to be a pretty down-to-earth bunch here. Although I agree with gracenote: no pictures. Unless they're microscopic and identify the mold type...

 

[Stone]

I want to second the motion on the dehumidifier. I used to have multiple chemical sensitivity in a very bad way accompanied by wicked IBS. When I hooked up the dehumidifier, the MCS almost disappeared as did the IBS. If it's possible, get a dehumidifier that has a knock-out in the bottom where you can attach a hose so that you can have it continually drain into a pump box or some other set up so you can just set it and forget it and never have to empty it, which can be a royal pain. I put mine in the basement set up high so the drain hose went down into the washing maching drain. It cycled on and off as needed and I never had to fool with it. The health benefits were amazing. It took about a month to get the full benefit, but I could tell a diference within a few days of using it. Best of luck.

 

[Athene]

I recently made the lovely discovery that we have mould infested water pipes in our house. You can smell mould when you're under the shower, coming from the stream of water.
My husband is preparing to flush the whole system through with bleach to (hopefully) disinfect it. Apparently the horrible stuff can form lumps inside the pipes.
Just wondering if you have infested plumbing too?

 

[FernRhizome]

I had a mold infestation problem one summer when the weather hit a 100% humidity patch and also got much worse, gi-wise. I happened to try taking papaya enzymes and it had a miraculous impact for about six weeks and then the papaya became too toxic for me. But in the first week of going on them I lost 10 lbs of "crap" just like that. It was quite amazing. Have you had a mold blood test done? That's how I realized I had a problem going on. I now have a similar problem going on again, but no I can't do the papaya enzymes so trying to find something else to try.

 

[Francelle]

I cannot comment about your mystery of the 'mould-in-the-loo' but I do suggest that you get tested for delayed gastric emptying. Delayed gastric emptying may also be called Gastroparesis, which can be present to varying degrees of severity.

Do some research on this before your appointment with the GI doctor. Let us know how you get on!

 

[Tammie]

just wanted to thank all who responded....I love how brilliant and helpful so many people on here are.....too exhausted to write more now, but thank you all!

 

[Athene]

FernRhizome,
You could try bromelain. I used papain for a while and developed a horrible allergy to it -apparently lots of people do. (papaya popped up unexpectedly in a food allergy screening). I find bromelain a decent substitute.

 

[Catseye]

Sounds like you need some digestive enzymes with every meal and betaine hcl with meals that include a concentrated protein such as meat, fish, chicken or eggs. Probably like most, your stomach and pancreas are not putting out what you need to digest your food. And if you have been deficient in stomach acid (what the betaine hcl replaces) for some time, then it's also a sure thing that your gut is overpopulated with bad bacteria and probably yeast, too.

 

[slayadragon]

Ok, this is really weird and may be a bit too much (& too gross) info, but I am seriously wondering if there's some kind of clue to all my stomach issues in this observation......

Over the last few yrs my stomach has become increasingly more and more upset and unable to tolerate most foods; however, it has been during the last maybe 8 months or so that things have become extremely bad (cannot keep most foods down, wind up with diarrhea with the few foods I can keep down)....anyway, I have also noticed that in those last 8 months, my toilet bowl starts to grow mold within a couple of days after I clean it.....have lived in the same place and used the same stuff to clean for 13 years, and never had this issue until the stomach problems got so bad (& I did have regular BMs, just not the diarrhea, so it was not like it was due to a lack of use or anything).....so I am wondering if the mold in the toilet bowl is resulting from whatever is causing the stomach problems & if so if that would be give me some sort of clue as to what's going on internally

sorry if this is too gross, and maybe I am just really weird to even be thinking about this, but I am getting desperate to figure this stomach stuff out

I would like to suggest that the general toxic mold problem in your house (it seems clear that you have one) has gotten worse, and that this is leading to both a) satellite colonies of toxic mold in various places (such as the toilet) and b) your increased gut problems.

It may also be that you have an aspergillus or other internal mold infection. But if so, that likely is secondary to toxic mold growing buried in walls or the attic of your home.

As Mark notes, I've spent a good deal of time putting a variety of information about toxic mold on the following thread:

http://www.forums.aboutmecfs.org/sh...l-Points-quot-Approach-to-Address-CFS-Viruses

There's a lot of information, but this is a really complex subject that takes a lot of time to explain.

If you want to any of the material on that thread further, or if you have any questions, please let me know.

Best, Lisa

 

[alex3619]

Hi Tammie

I have had the same problem for something like five years now. I am not convinced that it has much to do with mold per se, I think it has to do with a lot of nutrients not being absorbed but lost to you know where. Then the mold grows. This would make it more a digestive problem, perhaps linked to leaky gut issues. Just a suspicion of course, I would certainly like to learn more from others with this problem.

Bye
Alex

 

[Tammie]

Thanks for the info, Lisa......I know we talked about mold quite awhile back on pro health....I was really hoping to be able to do something abotu it, but thoguh I have looked for the last 4 yrs for a better palce to live, I have not found anything I can afford (can't afford where I am now, but it's still cheaper than anything esle I have found), and also I have been so sick I just don't have the ability to move myself either (I could get help if I ddi find a place, but the prospective helper does not really get it and would still expect me to do much of the work......still if I could find some place I would figure out some way to move)

anyway, as a result, I have done as much as I can in my current apt to remmedaite the problem and have otherwise tried to ignore it (I know it is not possible or safe to really ignore mold, but I am really stuck and was getting so stressed about the whole situation I decided not to focus on it for awhile)....it's looking like I will have to try to resume figuring something out

I have not yet gone to the thread you posted here, bc I am too wiped, & have been dealing will power outages, but will try to do so soon

thanks again

 

[Tammie]

Alex, Your theory certainly has merit and I do know that I am not absorbing a lot of the nutrients I try to take in (blood tests made that clear)......have been trying to treat leaky gut, but so far things keep getting worse

 

[Wayne]

Ok, this is really weird and may be a bit too much (& too gross) info, but I am seriously wondering if there's some kind of clue to all my stomach issues in this observation......

Over the last few yrs my stomach has become increasingly more and more upset and unable to tolerate most foods; however, it has been during the last maybe 8 months or so that things have become extremely bad (cannot keep most foods down, wind up with diarrhea with the few foods I can keep down)....anyway, I have also noticed that in those last 8 months, my toilet bowl starts to grow mold within a couple of days after I clean it.....have lived in the same place and used the same stuff to clean for 13 years, and never had this issue until the stomach problems got so bad (& I did have regular BMs, just not the diarrhea, so it was not like it was due to a lack of use or anything).....so I am wondering if the mold in the toilet bowl is resulting from whatever is causing the stomach problems & if so if that would be give me some sort of clue as to what's going on internally

sorry if this is too gross, and maybe I am just really weird to even be thinking about this, but I am getting desperate to figure this stomach stuff out

Hi Tammie,

I finally got around to finding an old post of mine that I think addresses some of the issues you raise. I'll paste it below.

Best, Wayne
.............................................

Hi Forbin,

I've read a number of anecdotal stories of people achieving significant improvement with ME/CFS by taking probiotics. I think this could easily tie in with the immune system dysfunction part of this illness.

I'm going to share a quick little story here tonight. It's a bit humorous, but I think it also has some elements to it that are well worth considering. My brother, who has relatively mild CFS, had been having a bit of a problem with his GI tract the past 1-2 years. He could very easily get loose bowels or diarrhea, no matter how carefully he ate and took care of himself. One day he was at a local health food store and they recommended he try their most potent probiotic. It was a 7-day supply of a refrigerated product called "Ultimate Flora Critical Care 50 Billion".

Well, he took it, and it quickly cleared up his GI distress. What followed was as interesting as his own health improvement. It also improved the health of the septic system next to his house. He lives in a rural area in Arkansas and has his own septic system. Every couple weeks or so, he could begin to "detect" that his system needed some maintenance, and would add some kind of septic system enzymes or bacteria.

After fixing his own GI tract, he has not "detected" the need for ongoing maintenance of the house septic system. Apparently it's been several months now. His experience sure made me think about how beneficial it would be to have our own GI system well stocked with the necessary bacteria that are needed to keep it running properly. Doing so would seem to have some far ranging consequences.

Best, Wayne