Sleep getting off track

[kushami]

I am fortunate in that I can usually get to sleep at roughly bedtime for roughly eight hours (stll feel terrible when I wake up).

But after appointments or other exhausting duties, my sleep schedule often goes awry and I find myself awake all night or sleeping at random times for a few hours.

Is there any medication you could suggest for occasional use, say once a month, that could get me back on track?

I have tried a couple of things, but they seem to stick around too long, and I end up sleeping all night but then most of the next day as well.

 

[Mary]

I don't have any prescription drugs to suggest - the only one that worked for me was a benzo.

But here are some OTC things that can help a lot, especially if you don't take them every day:

doxylamine succinate - generic for UNISOM - an old antihistamine which is very effective. It's also quite strong, I suggest starting with 1/4 tablet

lemon balm - most lemon balm does very little for me but this particular brand helps me noticeably

magnolia bark - Several ineffective brands of magnolia bark are available, but this one actually works

Sleepeace

shui de an (Sleep Easy)

 

[kushami]

Thank you, @Mary, that’s great.

I could ask my doctor about a prescription. He might give me a small packet. Can you take those occasionally?

 

[kushami]

I was thinking of asking my GP about clonidine, not only for sleep purposes but because it might do something for my autonomic problems. It’s one of the few vasodilators I haven’t tried yet.

He might prescribe it for sleep purposes if I don’t mention the autonomic angle. And then if it does happen to help, it can be a big surprise and “Oh, how fortuitous!”

It came to mind after reading this study:
https://forums.phoenixrising.me/thr...a-syndrome-during-head-up-tilt-testing.92928/

And thinking maybe I am having adrenergic vasoconstriction.

 

[sb4]

I think the clonidine should be fine if you are using it infrequently though if you plan on using it daily watch out for rebound effects once you come off it.
I'm still cautiously experimenting with it as it definitely does make me feel more relaxed / better on it and reduces the damn heart thumping a bit.
Recently I have been halving the 25mcg pill and taking one every 3-5 days. After 3 days it should have completely left the system so I figure I wont get dependencies or rebound like I did when I took it for 10 days straight.
I have also subscribed to the clonidine subreddit and there are similar stories on there of rebound after only a week of usage at low dose etc.

I have been toying with the idea of cycling sleep aids throughout the week. Like a very small dose of a benzodiazepine once a week (GABA receptors), clonidine once every 3-4 days (adrenal receptors), 1st generation anti histamines once every 3-4 days (histamine receptors), and long release melatonin once every 2-3 days (melatonin receptors).
Maybe by switching up the receptors like this non will grow tolerant?

 

[Donsboig]

My sleep doctor has prescribed 2mg long-release melatonin and is happy for me to take it every night for the foreseeable. It has really helped me with getting to sleep. I still had issues with waking in the night and not falling asleep again but that seems to have improved. I think the melatonin has been reducing the stress I feel about being able to fall asleep and has made going to bed a much more pleasant and consistent experience

 

[Mary]

I could ask my doctor about a prescription. He might give me a small packet. Can you take those occasionally?

I presume you mean for a benzo prescription. I'm guessing if someone took a benzo no more than once a week they might avoid dependence, though I don't know what the safe limit is for them.

 

[linusbert]

you might wanna try Melatonin. Thats what people use to help jetlag. you can use it to somewhat realign your sleeping schedule. you usually take it like 30 minutes before you want to go to bed / wanna sleep. Usually dose is like 0,5 mg - 3 mg . but up to 5 mg should be safe (whatever "safe" is for cfs folks).

 

[kushami]

I presume you mean for a benzo prescription. I'm guessing if someone took a benzo no more than once a week they might avoid dependence, though I don't know what the safe limit is for them.

Yes, sorry. It would be for something like one night once a month, just to deal with the aftermath of appointments.

 

[kushami]

Does melatonin have a calming effect when you are exhausted and a bit agitated? I don’t get like this often, maybe once a month (after appointments), and need something that will knock me out for a night.

A few things that I’ve tried have helped me get to sleep, but they tend to stay in my system and make me sleep most of the next day as well, which leaves me back at square one of being awake all night.

 

[linusbert]

Does melatonin have a calming effect when you are exhausted and a bit agitated? I don’t get like this often, maybe once a month (after appointments), and need something that will knock me out for a night.

A few things that I’ve tried have helped me get to sleep, but they tend to stay in my system and make me sleep most of the next day as well, which leaves me back at square one of being awake all night.

i dont know, but ki has to say this about it:

Spoiler

Yes, melatonin can have a calming effect in some situations, especially if you’re feeling agitated due to exhaustion or a disrupted sleep pattern. However, melatonin is primarily a hormone that regulates sleep-wake cycles and isn’t a sedative like some sleep medications. It works best if your body’s natural production of melatonin is low, which is often the case after stress, travel, or late-night screen exposure.





Here’s how melatonin might help in your case:


1. Stress-Induced Sleep Trouble: If your agitation and exhaustion are affecting your ability to fall asleep, a low dose of melatonin (e.g., 1-3 mg) might help signal to your brain that it’s time to wind down.


2. Timing Is Key: Take it 30-60 minutes before bedtime in a dark, quiet environment. Bright lights or screens can counteract its effects.


3. Short-Term Use: Melatonin is more effective for short-term sleep issues (like after appointments), but it’s not a strong “knockout” solution like prescription sleep aids.


4. Other Calming Strategies: Since your issue happens rarely, you might also benefit from calming practices like a warm bath, magnesium supplements, or herbal teas with chamomile or valerian, which can complement melatonin’s effects.





If you need a stronger, more immediate effect, consider discussing occasional use of antihistamines (like diphenhydramine) or other over-the-counter sleep aids with your doctor, as they are designed for short-term “knockout” purposes.

 

[Florida Guy]

You can indeed develop a habit using benzos no more than once a week. It will take a while to become a habit. After a while you notice the dose just isnt doing the job it used to do. You either raise the dose or quit and if you quit, you will get reminders to keep taking it in the form of rebound insomnia and perhaps anxiety. What works for me is thc and I add to it some cbn which also induces sleep.

 

[kushami]

You can indeed develop a habit using benzos no more than once a week. It will take a while to become a habit. After a while you notice the dose just isnt doing the job it used to do. You either raise the dose or quit and if you quit, you will get reminders to keep taking it in the form of rebound insomnia and perhaps anxiety. What works for me is thc and I add to it some cbn which also induces sleep.

Hmm, well I don’t want that to happen. (I would take them if I really needed to and with support of a decent doctor. But I’m not at that stage and don’t have a decent doctor at the moment!)

I will look into THC and CBD. Thank you for the suggestion.

 

[Marylib]

Hmm, well I don’t want that to happen. (I would take them if I really needed to and with support of a decent doctor. But I’m not at that stage and don’t have a decent doctor at the moment!)

I will look into THC and CBD. Thank you for the suggestion.

The thing is, either you have an endless supply of benzos or you don't. I know elderly people with ME who would be happy to be on benzos forever if only they could get it. CBN is one of the cannabanoids (sorry my brain can't spell anymore) that help with sleep. It helps me very much but I develop a tolerance and have to go off it for months in order for it to work again. If you are in the US, in a cannabis-friendly state, there is a product called Universal Elixor, that is good. https://mfbotanicals.com/product/universal-elixir/
Edit to say that if you can't get it where you live a friend could send it to you.

 

[Vladimir]

I took 5mg of diazepam once in a while - once in 5-10 days and only if I felt extremely bad by the evening. No signs of dependency after 3-4 months of such approach. I do not take it anymore.

Currently, I take 3-6mg of melatonin. What I found is that it works better if you take 3mg about 4 hours before bed, not right before bed time - this way I feel relaxed and sleepy right by the bed time instead of getting into the bed and waiting for the effect to come.

Also, elimination diet helped a lot, I eat meat, butter, eggs and cucumbers only and ditched diazepam completely.

 

[Florida Guy]

@Marylib I'm glad CBN works for you too. You really need to take it with thc, by itself its not that strong but with thc it becomes very sleepy. Its the combination that makes it work best. Having an endless supply of benzos would be a nightmare because you would eventually be taking huge amounts

Vladimir, many people have found that smaller doses of melatonin work better than the large doses. Your diet is very limited, I hope you are taking a multivitamin. Taking a benzo on rare occasions is no problem but taking it regularly it either stops working or you take more and more