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Recommended book: Wings of Death by Chris Busby (Radiation)

SilverbladeTE

Senior Member
Messages
3,043
Location
Somewhere near Glasgow, Scotland
heavy going, factual about how the governments, industry AND science establishment have been lying out their arse and/or just plain blind to the actual risks caused by nuclear contamination, especially the atmospheric nuclear tests of 50s and 60s
Interesting factoid: approx. 77,000 excess neonatal deaths in US as a "bump" in such in many countries followed the wave of nuke tests.
yet folk go off their head about abortion and miss this....

he notes near beginning great rise in autoimmune diseases, "including MS and ME"


most nukes were detonated high above ground, called "self cleaning" as they spread their fallout so high little would fall to earth...instead it was spread all across the entire world where rain would wash it into our bodies one day. Rates of cancer are still spiralling, and governments etc still lie about it.

problem in part is that the standard way of *official" thinking is that such risks from very tiny amounts of these particles cannot be more than the risk from the background Radiation we all get exposed ot and always have.
Wrong, we do not INGEST the "background radiation" and these fallout products are beta and alpha emitters which cause severe damage to cells next to them, and they "Mimic" other elements that our bodies wrongly think are calcium ro such, and deposit them in our bones, thyroid and so on.

I wonder if this is part of the "Glasgow issue" that is a concern in public health, Glasgow has inexplicably higher level of cancer and health problems than lifestyle or poor diet etc can explain...but it also has very high rainfall, so it's reservoirs would likely have been heavily dosed during the bomb test period, AND by the horrible bloody monstrosity: Sellafield.

UK
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Wings-Death-Nuclear-Pollution-Health/dp/1897761031

US
http://www.amazon.com/Wings-Death-Nuclear-Pollution-Health/dp/1897761031
 

alex3619

Senior Member
Messages
13,810
Location
Logan, Queensland, Australia
Interesting.

According to Wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_nuclear_tests_at_Maralinga , which is not a great source but convenient, there were three nuclear test sites in Australia, in 1952 in Western Australia, and 1953 at Emu Field in South Australia, and at Maralinga in South Australia from 1956 - 1963.

Unfortunately the two big ME outbreaks here were in South Australia, Adelaide, in I think 1948 and 1949. However this is also after the first nuclear tests and the two nuclear attacks in Japan that ended World War 2 in the Pacific.

There was also an outbreak in Western Australia though, but I do not recall the year.

Superficially the lack of epidemiology data showing increased cancer in ME (aside from Lymphoma which we are at increased risk for) discredits this theory with respect to ME. However there are no controls ... any control would have absorbed the same radiation. So it could easily be the case that just as only some will get cancer from radiation, only some will get ME. Marty Pall has discussed Post Radiation Syndrome, and shown how similar it is to CFS.

Now to find the date of the Western Australian outbreak ...

PS Where does the 1934 Los Angeles outbreak fit? Clearly, if radiation is involved, its a background risk factor, not a direct cause in many cases.

PPS One list of outbreaks is here: http://www.name-us.org/ResearchPages/ResEpidemic.htm#M.E._Epidemics

The Western Australia outbreaks appear to be 1955. It appears to be between the 1952 and 1953 testing areas.

It is interesting though that ME outbreaks seemed to end .. just as above ground nuclear tests ended. However there was something like a two decade gap between the two.

I also note that many current outbreaks, which are in many ways indistinguishable, go by the name of the pathogen, such as Post Q Fever and Post SARS. So did outbreaks really end, or did we just label them with known pathogens?
 
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SilverbladeTE

Senior Member
Messages
3,043
Location
Somewhere near Glasgow, Scotland
oh I wouldn't think radiation is the singular cause or probably not even a major risk, merely an increased risk factor

person who's body is being damaged by fallout particles maybe more susceptible to infection, infection triggers M.E.
likewise a person who's body is being affected by toxins: pesticides, heavy metals, mould, well any more damage on top wouldn't help as said on other thread, synergies can be a real bugger, but calculating them for REAL effect? ye gods, massive headaches that is, complexity and probabilities out the ass :/

also, all this excess radiation increases rates of mutation which are usually "lethal" for complex life forms, but for single cell ones their massive rate of replication means eventual resistance to it and increased mutations = more infections.
 

SilverbladeTE

Senior Member
Messages
3,043
Location
Somewhere near Glasgow, Scotland
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Grapple

Health effects[edit]
In 2005, a Massey University study in New Zealand concluded that sailors from the Royal New Zealand Navy, Royal Navy and Fijian Navy who observed the tests from nearby ships later suffered adverse health effects from exposure to radiation fallout, including cancer and genetic abnormalities in the veterans' children. A class action lawsuit was filed against the British Ministry of Defence by various veterans' organisations following the publication of the study.[5][6][7]

The Ministry of Defence maintains that few people were exposed to any radiation or contamination at all, and that studies had shown little or no health effects.[8][9] An analysis of illnesses in veterans of Grapple and other weapons tests produced statistics that are hard to interpret. The veterans showed rates of illness that were slightly higher than the control group, but the control group had lower rates of illness than the population as a whole while the veterans had rates that were about the same. Neither of these results has a clear explanation.[10] Reliable statistical analysis of the data is difficult because the samples are fairly small and incomplete.

In March 2012, a group of 1,011 British ex-servicemen were denied permission to sue the UK Ministry of Defence by the Supreme Court, on the grounds that too much time had elapsed since they became aware of their medical conditions, under the terms of the Limitation Act 1980.[11
 

SilverbladeTE

Senior Member
Messages
3,043
Location
Somewhere near Glasgow, Scotland
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_nuclear_tests_at_Maralinga#Operation_Buffalo

Operation Buffalo[edit]
Operation Buffalo
Information
CountryUnited Kingdom
Test siteMaralinga
Period1956
Number of tests4
Test typetower, surface, free air drop
Max. yield1.5 - 15 kt
Navigation
Previous test seriesOperation Mosaic
Next test seriesOperation Antler
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Place data as RDF
Operation Buffalo commenced on 27 September 1956. The operation consisted of the testing of four nuclear devices, codenamed One Tree, Marcoo, Kite and Breakaway respectively. One Tree (12.9 kilotonnes of TNT (54 TJ)) and Breakaway (10.8 kilotonnes of TNT (45 TJ)) were exploded from towers, Marcoo (1.4 kilotonnes of TNT (5.9 TJ)) was exploded at ground level, and Kite (2.9 kilotonnes of TNT (12 TJ)) was released by a Royal Air Force Vickers Valiant bomber from a height of 35,000 feet (11,000 m).[11][12][13] This was the first British launching of a nuclear weapon from an aircraft.

The fallout from these tests was measured using sticky paper, air sampling devices, and water sampled from rainfall and reservoirs.[14] The radioactive cloud from Buffalo 1 (One Tree) reached a height of 37,500 ft (11,400 m), exceeding the predicted 27,900 ft (8,500 m), and radioactivity was detected in South Australia, Northern Territory, New South Wales, and Queensland. All four Buffalo tests were criticised by the 1985 McClelland Royal Commission, which concluded that they were fired under inappropriate conditions.[15]

In 2001, Dr Sue Rabbit Roff, a researcher from the University of Dundee, uncovered documentary evidence that troops had been ordered to run, walk and crawl across areas contaminated by the Buffalo tests in the days immediately following the detonations;[16] a fact that the British government later admitted.[17] Dr Roff stated that "it puts the lie to the British government's claim that they never used humans for guinea pig-type experiments in nuclear weapons trials in Australia."[18]
 

JT1024

Senior Member
Messages
582
Location
Massachusetts
Here is a private organization that is not tied to government (HHS/CDC/NIH/etc) or lobby groups (CAA, etc) who have come out to say ionizing radiation is THE cause of ME/CFS. http://www.ncf-net.org/radiation.htm

I always wondered why Rich Von K was so interested in ME/CFS given his lifelong career in physics/nuclear waste disposal. I don't think it was coincidental. Rich was a phenomenally intelligent and compassionate man. I suspect he knew far more than he was able to tell us.
 

alex3619

Senior Member
Messages
13,810
Location
Logan, Queensland, Australia

alex3619

Senior Member
Messages
13,810
Location
Logan, Queensland, Australia
I always wondered why Rich Von K was so interested in ME/CFS given his lifelong career in physics/nuclear waste disposal. I don't think it was coincidental. Rich was a phenomenally intelligent and compassionate man. I suspect he knew far more than he was able to tell us.

Rich, Marty and I were online debating partners for years. Marty also discussed Post Radiation Syndrome is his book. I do not recall Rich even suggesting a radiation link, but then again if such a link existed and he was careful I probably would not have picked up on it - or maybe I just forgot.
 

SilverbladeTE

Senior Member
Messages
3,043
Location
Somewhere near Glasgow, Scotland
Alex
Bikini was American, the Baker test there, 2nd test in the area, was a disaster, first "dirty" bomb, by accident.

No one I'm thinking of was French or British, pretty sure it was French maybe their first h bomb test? read so much and memory banks ain't what they were :p

and like Baker test British 1st bomb test was also "dirty", much as they may deny it, as it was about testing the threat of a smuggled bomb in a ship, which Baker test proved would be horrendously effective.

and the loony French tests on muraroa atoll, ye GODS, what IMEBCILE came up with that, atolls are coral atop volcanic plugs, coral is fragile, alkaline, so the bomb tests cracked it, causing at least one tsunami collapse