PSILOCYBIN: More on the mounting evidence in favor of psilocybin for various psych issues, particularly depression

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The article linked below caught my eye because of the numerous references to both psilocybin and micro-dosing LSD as effective treatments for depression, among other psych issues, often infinitely more effective than the toxic loads o’crap that Drs routinely push on their patients, while blithely ignoring the increasingly overwhelming reports regarding both the prescription meds ineffectiveness, and the damages that they leave in their wake.

Oddly, within 30 minutes of reading the article posted below, I came across @hmnr asg ‘s post in a PR thread dedicated to psilocybin, and I post his excellent re-posting from Reddit of the first-hand reporting by a psilocybin experimenter below, along with a link to that thread for additional reading ….

Psychedelic compound found in MAGIC MUSHROOMS 'opens up depressed people's brains' and helps to break the cycle of negative thinking, study suggests
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/science...-compound-opens-depressed-peoples-brains.html

  • Psychedelic compound in magic mushrooms 'opens depressed people's brains'
  • New research found that it made people less fixed in negative thinking patterns
  • Experts say psilocybin may be an alternative approach to depression treatments
  • They say it can help brain to break out of rut in way traditional therapies cannot



A (partial) CFS success story - Magic Mushrooms
ORIGINALLY POSTD BY @hmnr asg on Monday, 04-11-22
https://forums.phoenixrising.me/threads/microdose-psilocybin.87285/page-2#post-2395530

Before jumping in to the "what helped with my CFS" story, I want to provide some brief background. I have CFS, but am also a psychotherapist specializing in trauma and chronic health issues. My own health history is long and tedious, but the short version is: long-term undiagnosed GI parasite for 8 years in my 20s before finally getting a Dx; relief with antiparasitic treatment but developed CFS a few years after (along with SIBO and IBS). My CFS has gotten steadily worse over the past 10 years- I used to be able to hike, go for the occasional bike ride, swim laps in the pool, and so on. Now, I am limited to a 20 minute walk each day, and hit some brutal fatigue spells if I try and overextend at all. I can still (mostly) work, though I've had to reduce my caseload somewhat.


Up until a few months ago, I was in a pretty rough place. I was energetically approaching the "struggling to function" mark. I couldn't do much more than veg on the couch and felt like I was phoning it in with my clients (as well as my family). I was both physically and emotionally fatigued and felt like nothing I was doing was helping. Depression was definitely starting to creep in. I meditate every day and generally live as balanced a lifestyle as I can, but things kept getting worse. I had started therapy myself as a client, which helped some, but it still felt like I was losing the battle. I hadn't been on antidepressants in some years and really didn't want to return- it felt like I was dealing with emotional baggage related to the CFS, not a typical depression, and I didn't want to just numb it away with Celexa.


I know there is some intense debate around CFS as being a psychosomatic or mental health problem, and there are whole host of people feeling incredibly misunderstood and invalidated by approaches that emphasize this. Having seen some miracles from the therapist side in trauma therapy (including major improvement in chronic health conditions), I've developed a working theory that it is both physical and emotional, or at least has components of both. I had noticed that although my physical fatigue had remained about the same over the past year, my sense of emotional and mental fatigue (including brain fog, irritability, shutting down when around people, anxiety, and more) had indeed gotten a lot worse.


Some friends had left us some Magic Mushrooms as a gift, and a few months ago I decided to try some to see if it would help jumpstart me out of my funk. I wasn't really expecting anything in particular. I've read research into psilocybin, Ketamine, and other related treatments that seem to provide some promising preliminary results in terms of mental health treatment. I've had some clients that have informally tried this for themselves and reported (and demonstrated) some improvement. But I wasn't sure what to expect with me.


The Magic Mushrooms trip was a terrible and wonderful experience, both. I took what I thought was a very low dose to see what my lower limit was, but it ended up being more than enough (I'm fairly sensitive to medication in general, so it was probably a "full" dose for my system in particular). I experienced some pretty bad nausea in the beginning, didn't end up throwing up but felt close for about 45 minutes or so. The nausea was the least of it, though- the first few hours were emotional torture. I felt like I was caught in between a nightmare and reality. I experienced waves of terror, hopelessness, grief at the life that my illness had robbed me of. My father died a year or so ago, and somehow this came up as a brutal reminder that I was next in line, and my ability to function and enjoy life would likely only diminish over time. I felt alone and afraid, stuck in my own body, clinging to it and craving relief from it at the same time. I felt like I was letting my family down by being tired all the time and struggling to engage. All of this came up and I felt vulnerable and powerless in the face of it.


I had a general sense to just let go and allow myself to be broken open by the process. It literally felt like I was inwardly fracturing or falling apart. There was nothing graceful or pretty about it. Oh, do I feel like I'm about to throw up all over the floor, okay, let's let that happen if it needs to. Do I feel like I'm about to have a full-on panic attack? Alright, what do I have to lose, welcome it in. I just surrendered over and over. There was no mindfulness or self-compassion technique, there was just trusting the process, and allowing whatever was there to move through me in whatever way it needed to.


Eventually, the storm passed and I emerged into a new place. I felt okay- as in, it's all okay. Me, my illness, my situation, all totally and 100% okay. I felt worlds lighter, like I had dropped suddenly 200 pounds that I had forgotten I was carrying. I was clear and content and totally at ease.



I eventually emerged to join my family and talk and engage a bit. I felt naturally present in a way that I hadn't in a long time, despite my efforts at regular mindfulness and spiritual practice. The emotional fatigue was completely gone, and I felt a deep inner vitality. My mind felt very clear, and I found myself enjoying my lived experience in a new way- even aches and pains were joyful in a way, something to appreciate about being alive.


This sense of ease didn't go away. Six hours after I had taken the dose (well beyond the active period of the trip), I still found myself clear, energized, grateful, and present. Usually I collapse into bed at night, but that night I found myself just wanting to stay awake and simply enjoy being aware and alive. The next day, I had a slight headache, but the newfound sense of emotional vitality was just as strong as it was the day before. It's been a few months now and I still feel worlds better than I did before- some old emotional patterns have started to show themselves, but nothing that has felt close to the dark place I was before.



My physical fatigue improved also after this experience, though not as dramatically as the emotional stuff. Before the trip, I was needing to lie down for an hour or more every day; after, I seem to need to nap once on the weekends but am otherwise okay in a typical day and don't need a rest period. I still need to be mindful about my physical exercise, if I stand for more than an hour at a time or walk for more than 20 or 30 minutes I start to hit a wall, which can bring on a fatigue episode that lasts a few days. That limit hasn't changed since the trip.



There is undoubtedly (in my mind) a physical component to this whole CFS thing, though I do think having CFS or any chronic illness is subtly traumatic. It's bound to create an emotional burden to go along with the physical, something that goes beyond typical stress or anxiety, and that perhaps can amplify the symptoms of the disease itself.



I hope none of this comes across as preachy. I guess I want to offer a perspective that provides some hope for relief. I'll fight anyone who says CFS is a purely emotional or psychosomatic disease, but I'll argue just as hard from the other side- how can you go through something like CFS without there being a major emotional or even traumatic impact? It's not so far fetched to me that the emotional trauma of CFS co-exists with the physical symptoms of the disease. We'd all love to be able to take a pill and make the fatigue go away. But maybe there is a whole other emotional side of the illness that is going unnoticed or appreciated, with untapped possibility for a different kind of relief.


tl;dr: CFS got better with magic mushrooms, particularly mood, emotional energy, mental clarity.
 

Marylib

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My one experience with it - best night's sleep I had in ages. Quite remarkable. One of the supervisors for my experience was a psychotherapist who had herself benefitted from the treatment for various psychological issues and then began growing her own supply to help others. She and her husband were with me throughout. I didn't have nausea or digestive issues and it took a higher dose than they anticipated. They weighed the dried mushrooms on a scale. I did become aware of some 'emotional baggage' by means of watching the images in my mind. Otherwise, it was quite pleasant, especially when sitting outside looking at the trees.
 
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Classical psychedelics from shrooms to lsd and even dmt (the last one I haven't tried full dose of unlike the other two), or mescaline which haven't tried at all, are all really promising for psychological stuff and beautiful or sublime experiences.

However I found that two things make it a bit tricky to try with me/cfs. One , our life being ill is so nightmarish especially if we are in denial, I know I am, that it's almost like we're already in A bad trip. Adding a psychedelic to the mix might be like amplifying the surreal nightmare. Not that psychedelics usually cause bad trips but thsy can amplify existing issues. Sometimes we need to compartmentalize emotion for the sake of energy and psychedelics blow these compartmentalized boxes apart in favor of raw experience at any cost.

Second thought is they tend to have a bit of what's called a body load, where they seem to tire one out a bit and be inherently stimulating. I think they could worsen PEM

I have done psychedelics once since the beginning of my illness before being formally diagnosed with cfs, I had just a post treatments Lyme disease syndrome diagnosis, but I already had mild pem, and it's one of the only somewhat negative trips I had. Not even all bad but not as easy to enjoy or go deep as when I was healthy.

On the other hand some psychedelics seem to help wjth physical stuff not just osych stuff. I remember when I took a small dose of dmt, bc I was scared to do the full dose. My body felt cleansed of all tightness or pain , this was before I was sick but still had some typical issues, it felt like I was much more grounded and had a sense of ease and euphoria.

Dmt is so short lasting when smoked or vaporized that I could see it being worth trying bc even if it's bad ir doesn't last that long

But would be good to have neds for heart rate /calming adrenaline down on hand and benzos and even anti serotonin drugs to totally stop trip.
 
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why has an entire new thread been created when there is already this thread above?
Because burying this article in another thread didn't seem like a good plan in terms of getting information to the people most interested, in the most efficient way....


Thanks for reposting the link to @hmnr asg 's post.

Since you read the intro to this thread, you would have seen that I'd already done that, as well as giving @hmnr asg full credit for his excellent coverage of the subject in that same thread.
 
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hmnr asg

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Because burying this article in another thread didn't seem like a good plan in terms of getting information to the people most interested, in the most efficient way....

Thanks for reposting the link to @hmnr asg 's post.

If you'd read the intro to this thread, you would have seen that I'd already done that, as well as giving @hmnr asg full credit for his excellent coverage of the subject in that sae thread.
@Rufous McKinney

Also, to be fair, that original thread was about microdosing and OP was insistent that we should talk about microdosing. My post probably should have been put in a separate thread since it was about a full dose experience.
 
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Also, to be fair, that original thread was about microdosing and OP was insistent that we should talk about microdosing. My post probably should have been put in a separate thread since it was about a full dose experience.
Yes, I understand that.

I have a general personal concern about thread titles, but since they go on for decades....
 

hmnr asg

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Yes, I understand that.

I have a general personal concern about thread titles, but since they go on for decades....
I understand.

By the way, does anyone know how to get magic mushrooms? i know how to grow them, i even bought this book and read it cover to cover:
https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/1937866289

However, im afraid of going to prison! i would not fare well in there. I cant fight and I couldn't join any of the major gangs in there. Unless there is a CFS Brotherhood in San Quentin, im going to be toast.

Edit: actually i just realized if they send me to solitary confinement my life would almost not change at all! I am practically in solitary confinement in my bedroom now.
 
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i know how to grow them
laugh

There are home kits for producing small scale volumes of mushrooms for human consumption and these kits work fairly well. Some effort to work in a sterile environment, (frigged rigged, as it were)...will be necessary at some point. Spores must be germinate on sterile plates, with proper food/agar. That can then be transferred manually to inoculate small batches and there are methods to minimize contamination.

You can then order spores and you can practice.

Start with edibles you'd sauté with a lovely scrambled egg. In a little butter.
 

hmnr asg

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laugh

There are home kits for producing small scale volumes of mushrooms for human consumption and these kits work fairly well. Some effort to work in a sterile environment, (frigged rigged, as it were)...will be necessary at some point. Spores must be germinate on sterile plates, with proper food/agar. That can then be transferred manually to inoculate small batches and there are methods to minimize contamination.

You can then order spores and you can practice.

Start with edibles you'd sauté with a lovely scrambled egg. In a little butter.
Yes, actually spores are legal to buy in all states except California and Georgia and Idaho.
The rest of the growing process is to reduce the risk of contamination.
Right now you can actually buy pre-sterilized substrates from amazon, like this:
https://smile.amazon.com/Boomr-Bag-Manure-Substrate-Mushrooms/dp/B07TTV73RM/ (and many others)