Potential of Schisandra chinensis (Turcz.) Baill. in Human Health and Nutrition:

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pamojja

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Rufous McKinney said:
I was advised to NEVER take berberine or metformin. These are drugs refined from chinese herbs and you never take them in this manner. I would "do something else".
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I think this may be important with your, sadly, a whole life lasting ME. I started to use metformin during my health recuperating yearly vacations to a south Indian beach only. Where carbohydrate avoidance simply wasn't rigorously possible. About 170 mg/d in average until now. And some berberine at home (110 mg/d). Both are routinely used at 1 g/d.
 
Mary

Mary

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Violeta said:
Something is changing. Today I took one of the dogs for a walk, weed whacked part of the driveway and the curb, and watered the flowers...in the heat. I thought I would be done for the day, but I took a shower and felt better. Still awake. Of course, tomorrow we'll see if it helps with the PEM.
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Let us know how you are tomorrow if you don't mind! This is very interesting --

Violeta said:
I bought bulk schisandra from Bulk Supplements and make my own capsules. I take about 4 00 capsules of it a day. I just tried putting the powder in ice tea, and it doesn't hurt the flavor. That's much easier than making capsules. But I read that you can take 500 mg per Kg body weight.
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I'm glad to hear that the Bulk Supplements product is helping you. I've found Bulk Supplements to be hit or miss - e.g., several years ago their magnolia bark extract was very potent, great for sleep. And now it barely does a thing, has nowhere near the potency it used to have. I don't quite trust them, they're generally so much cheaper than other brands, but, if it's helping you, I may give it a go!
 
Violeta

Violeta

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Mary said:
Let us know how you are tomorrow if you don't mind! This is very interesting --



I'm glad to hear that the Bulk Supplements product is helping you. I've found Bulk Supplements to be hit or miss - e.g., several years ago their magnolia bark extract was very potent, great for sleep. And now it barely does a thing, has nowhere near the potency it used to have. I don't quite trust them, they're generally so much cheaper than other brands, but, if it's helping you, I may give it a go!
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I will let you know! Usually the day after overdoing it I can hardly move.

I bought this schisandra a while ago. I'll have to see if I can find out exactly when. I have read reviews there about the quality of a product changing.
 
Mary

Mary

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I'm already taking 2 of the ingredients in the Longevity Tea - astragalus root (on as needed basis which is pretty frequently) and eleuthero root. I can vouch that eleuthero root can increase energy, but like everything that increases energy, I have to be careful or it will give me insomnia. But it does seem to be a very good herb.

Schisandra is one of the better ingredients in some sleep formulas I take - if a product includes schisandra, it's more likely to be effective. But I've never tried schisandra on its own and always thought of it in terms of sleep and not energy. So it will definitely be an experiment to try it during the day! (when I decide what to buy) and maybe it wouldn't cause insomnia for me? That will be an interesting experiment
 
Violeta

Violeta

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I am pretty sure alanine, aspartate, and glutamate are biomarkers for ME/CFS. I am trying to get the whole paper to see if it expands on how/why.

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Violeta

Violeta

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@andyguitar,

Conclusion: Our study identified significantly elevated glutamate and N-acetyl-aspartate levels in long COVID and ME/CFS patients compared with healthy controls. No significant differences in brain neurochemicals were observed between the 2 patient cohorts, suggesting a potential overlap in their underlying pathology. These findings suggest that imbalanced neurochemicals contribute to the complex symptoms experienced by long COVID and ME/CFS patients.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38588934/
 
Violeta

Violeta

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I saw a hint about this in the study, but had to do a search.
I don't know if this is happening in ME/CFS, but I'll put it here and when I'm not so tired maybe be able to look a bit further.
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Violeta

Violeta

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  • Downregulation of Alanine and Aspartate Metabolism Pathway: Research using advanced metabolic modeling of muscle tissue samples from ME/CFS patients revealed a significant downregulation of the alanine and aspartate metabolism pathway. This suggests a disruption in how these amino acids are processed and utilized within the muscles.
  • Impaired Pyruvate Dehydrogenase (PDH) Function: The altered alanine metabolism is linked to a potential functional impairment of PDH. PDH is critical for the transition between anaerobic and aerobic energy production, converting pyruvate into acetyl-CoA for the TCA cycle. Impaired PDH activity could lead to reduced energy production via the TCA cycle and contribute to post-exertional malaise (PEM) in ME/CFS.
  • Increased Utilization of Alternative Fuels: The disruption in pyruvate catabolism may lead to increased use of alternative substrates, such as amino acids, to fuel oxidative metabolism via the TCA cycle.
  • Reduced Levels of Amino Acids: Studies have observed reduced levels of amino acids that fuel oxidative metabolism via the TCA cycle in ME/CFS patients, especially in females. This indicates that the body might be drawing upon these reserves to compensate for the impaired PDH function.

Just some stuff to think about. I don't know if there anything one can do about. Unless the impaired PDH function is caused by hypoxia, switching to anaerobic glycolysis, and correcting that would take care of the problem.
 
Violeta

Violeta

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Violeta said:
I will let you know! Usually the day after overdoing it I can hardly move.

I bought this schisandra a while ago. I'll have to see if I can find out exactly when. I have read reviews there about the quality of a product changing.
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Mary said:
Let us know how you are tomorrow if you don't mind! This is very interesting --
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Well, yesterday was interesting. I was able to do more weed whacking in the heat, which includes sweeping up the mess. I didn't feel good when I was done, but just that I was able to do it was amazing to me.

I have to explain that a lot of times I want to do something, but can't make myself do it, due to feeling overwhelmed with everything that it involves. In this case, I have to get the extension cord extended and hook up the weed whacker. Yesterday I had to move my car. Sounds simple, but to me, stuff like that is overwhelming.

I was tired after I did that, took a nap, and got that feeling like I wasn't going to be able to get up. I had to get up, and then was able to stay up for a while. Was functional the rest of the day.

That's very different from what I've been experiencing. I've been having good day/bad day for a long time. And often I can't even figure out what caused the bad day, cause the good days haven't even been that good.
 
Violeta

Violeta

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@perchance dreamer and @Mary, the tea arrived at 5:45 PM. I made 3 cups in a tea pot, and reused the tea bag for a 4th cup.

I started drinking it as soon as it cooled down. I added some sugar. I drank probably 2 cups total. It tastes like astringent regular tea. I like it, and I don't usually like herbal teas.

It seems to clear out my head. I guess that is the brain fog feeling, sort of feels like you have cement in your head or something.

I was drinking it right up until the time I went to bed, and I had some difficulty falling asleep. I drank a cup of milk and then was able to fall asleep and slept well until around 8:00 this morning.

I didn't feel good when I woke up, still had that drugged feeling, but it wasn't as bad as usual. Was able to get moving a little bit easier.
 
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