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New Scientist: Inside the clinic offering young blood to cure ageing

Londinium

Senior Member
Messages
178
Aside from being an interesting, if slightly ghoulish, read in this week's New Scientist, there is an ME/CFS link. Before I get to that, some pretty major caveats:
  • The article is (fairly, in view) pretty sceptical of the claims being made by this clinic and questions whether they are being truly accurate in claiming few side effects / bad reactions;
Not that any of this should be taken at face value. Many of Ambrosia’s claimed improvements could be down to the placebo effect.

I am astonished that my visit has coincided with the first complication of the treatment. There’s an uncomfortable silence as JR and Wright exchange glances. “It’s not the first one,” says Wright. When I press him for more information, he demurs. “You’ll have to talk to Jesse.”
  • Despite calling it a trial, what the clinic is offering cannot really be called that.
The methodology falls short of the normal standards of scientific rigour, so it’s unsurprising that scientists and ethicists have accused Karmazin’s team of taking advantage of public excitement around the idea.”I don’t think the Ambrosia trial can be called a trial at all, since they treat healthy people and they have no clear read-outs,” Wyss-Coray says
  • Indeed, the 'findings' so far were announced at software coding conference, not in a medical journal.
This makes any findings virtually unpublishable, which may explain why Karmazin announced his first results to a room full of technologists at the Silicon Valley Code Conference in May instead of at a medical conference or in a journal. The numbers were as unverifiable as they were impressive.


So, with those caveats/major red flags in mind, there was one bit that caught my eye (emphasis mine):

Karmazin says this could explain his observations during the trial: a woman with chronic fatigue syndrome is now able to get out of bed and live normally;

As far as I can tell, the blood transfusion is actually an infusion of blood plasma. Therefore - with all the methodological problems / other issues aside - this would be the third group that seems to find that something in blood plasma may be linked to ME/CFS. IIRC, Fluge/Mella and Davis have both reported in vitro findings that ME/CFS patients' plasma seems to impede cellular metabolism in healthy cells, and that ME/CFS patients' cellular metabolism ceases to be impaired if placed into healthy controls' plasma.

Given all the problems highlighted, it would be entirely wrong to suggest this is the first confirmation of these findings in vivo (Did the patient in question really have CFS? Did they really recover? Was this placebo effect?). However, I still thought it might be of interest given that it seems to be consistent with the current research focus on blood plasma in ME/CFS.

...plus the article's a pretty good read anyway. Increasingly I find a lot of the 'innovation' in Silicon Valley to be pretty dystopian, and if the rich paying for the blood of the young isn't dystopian I don't know what is...
 

jpcv

Senior Member
Messages
386
Location
SE coast, Brazil
parabiosis.jpg

It´s been done already in laboratory.
 

jpcv

Senior Member
Messages
386
Location
SE coast, Brazil
Aside from being an interesting, if slightly ghoulish, read in this week's New Scientist, there is an ME/CFS link. Before I get to that, some pretty major caveats:
  • The article is (fairly, in view) pretty sceptical of the claims being made by this clinic and questions whether they are being truly accurate in claiming few side effects / bad reactions;



  • Despite calling it a trial, what the clinic is offering cannot really be called that.

  • Indeed, the 'findings' so far were announced at software coding conference, not in a medical journal.



So, with those caveats/major red flags in mind, there was one bit that caught my eye (emphasis mine):



As far as I can tell, the blood transfusion is actually an infusion of blood plasma. Therefore - with all the methodological problems / other issues aside - this would be the third group that seems to find that something in blood plasma may be linked to ME/CFS. IIRC, Fluge/Mella and Davis have both reported in vitro findings that ME/CFS patients' plasma seems to impede cellular metabolism in healthy cells, and that ME/CFS patients' cellular metabolism ceases to be impaired if placed into healthy controls' plasma.

Given all the problems highlighted, it would be entirely wrong to suggest this is the first confirmation of these findings in vivo (Did the patient in question really have CFS? Did they really recover? Was this placebo effect?). However, I still thought it might be of interest given that it seems to be consistent with the current research focus on blood plasma in ME/CFS.

...plus the article's a pretty good read anyway. Increasingly I find a lot of the 'innovation' in Silicon Valley to be pretty dystopian, and if the rich paying for the blood of the young isn't dystopian I don't know what is...


Dystopia is their religion.
 

erin

Senior Member
Messages
885
I thought Tina Turner uses blood transfusion regularly to stay young.

If this works with ME patients now on top of all the negative public opinions, we'll be called "vampires" .

Sorry major brain fog this morning. I'm not very articulate.
 

Helen

Senior Member
Messages
2,243
It was about 20 years ago that I heard, from a reliable source, that one of the very rich here went to the US regularly to get blood tranfusions from young people to postpone his ageing. So clearly a treatment that has been available for a long time.
 

RogerBlack

Senior Member
Messages
902
From memory, more careful experiments of a similar nature failed to find benefits of one-off infusion.

It's not being infused with young blood once that helps - but being connected to the fitter mouses circulatory system, either through elimination of some fatiguing compound, or positive effects.

As to ethical implications - well - I have more mouse-bait to put down today (the traps aren't working in my house properly).
 

Londinium

Senior Member
Messages
178
From memory, more careful experiments of a similar nature failed to find benefits of one-off infusion.

It's not being infused with young blood once that helps - but being connected to the fitter mouses circulatory system, either through elimination of some fatiguing compound, or positive effects.

As to ethical implications - well - I have more mouse-bait to put down today (the traps aren't working in my house properly).


Yes, one of the scientists is quoted as the main effect being down to being connected to the younger mouse's better lungs, kidneys, heart and liver. And, even more grimly, the positive stimulatory effects of being dragged around by a young mouse rather than 'sitting in the corner' like an elderly mouse would normally do.
 

Strawberry

Senior Member
Messages
2,079
Location
Seattle, WA USA
I find this extremely interesting, as I feel one of my possible triggers was a blood transfusion. I never felt the same after that blood transfusion... It was also the reverse, I was young while my donor was old. Although you would think with time, it would wear off. Maybe I should have that daughter of mine give me a pint? :D Ahhh, to be 22 again!
 

Wonko

Senior Member
Messages
1,467
Location
The other side.
I'm surprised this is new news, I thought this "treatment" had been going on for a long, long time - I seem to remember some old black and white footage of something very similar I saw last year somewhere. Rich old people being injected(?) with the blood of the young, parallels were drawn with vampirism ;) - unfortunately, whilst I know exactly where I saw it, on my TV, I have no idea of when, what program or channel, or anything remotely useful, just that I've seen it.
 

RogerBlack

Senior Member
Messages
902
I'm surprised this is new news, I thought this "treatment" had been going on for a long, long time

The original paper 20 years ago (?) got a lot of press at the time, with lots of predictions of clinics doing this for the rich.
 

Mithriel

Senior Member
Messages
690
Location
Scotland
Could be "monkey glands". Before the hormone system was worked out extract of glands was injected as a rejuvenating treatment. It is mentioned in the Dorothy Sayers books so that would be the 20s.

From some of the hint, hint language at the time I think it was popular as a form of viagra ...