Neuroinflammation May Cause Mental Sluggishness

[Wishful]

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/11/191115190337.htm

"These results show quite clearly that there's a very specific part of the brain network that's affected by inflammation," says Dr Mazaheri. "This could explain 'brain fog'."

 

[YippeeKi YOW !!]

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/11/191115190337.htm

"These results show quite clearly that there's a very specific part of the brain network that's affected by inflammation," says Dr Mazaheri. "This could explain 'brain fog'."

Really interesting post , thank you for it !!!

 

[Wishful]

The problem I have with it is that anti-inflammatories don't seem to reduce my brainfog.

Maybe the anti-inflammatories only block part of the inflammatory response, and, of course, not the part that causes brainfog. Maybe they'll do a follow-up study for the effectiveness of anti-inflammatories on brainfog.

 

[Rufous McKinney]

So the 20 young men who were studied...none of them are sick with ME.

They are healthy people, (is that correct?) who they induced fatigue in....and then also served as the controls.

And no females. Nice.

 

[YippeeKi YOW !!]

@ljimbo423
Aha!!! There you are !!! Been looking for you n all the wrong places .....

 

[Wishful]

So the 20 young men who were studied...none of them are sick with ME.

Well, I did post it in general news, rather than ME news. If they can find a mechanism that causes brainfog, maybe it will be easier to look for the same thing in ME and other related disorders.

 

[percyval577]

From the paper

Highlights

•
Typhoid vaccination induced a transient mild inflammatory state.
•
Mild inflammation selectively increased alerting-related alpha suppression.
•
A greater inflammatory response was correlated with more alpha suppression.

News and views in ME/CFS .... Comhaire and Deslypere 2019 say:

In all patients the activity of the high frequency electric waves (Alpha waves in particular) was significantly decreased, whereas slow Theta waves from the cingulate cortex commonly occurred in excess, suggesting continuous activation of the default mode network.

An increase in theta waves was also found in some polio cases, reviewed in comparision to me/cfs in 1998 (I havn´t read already the whole paper). parallels_between_post-polio_fatigue_and_chronic_fatigue.pdf

 

[Rufous McKinney]

Well, I did post it in general news, rather than ME news

I was just- opining into space.

Its fine to discuss that. I think its all informative.

 

[Rufous McKinney]

News and views in ME/CFS .... Comhaire and Deslypere 2019 say:

Just read the abstract.

Is this paper- actually recommending a suite of TREATMENTS for us?

Excuse me? Wow. Need a new thread I guess.

 

[panckage]

The problem I have with it is that anti-inflammatories don't seem to reduce my brainfog.

Me neither. Have you tried putting your head in cold water (eg. Under the tap)? I'm unsure if this is overheating or inflammation but doing this certainly helps my cognition especially when I'm feeling delirious. In cold weather my brain seems to be more functional too

 

[Wishful]

Mmmm, no, I haven't tried chilling my head that way. Spending hours outside in winter (down to -40) hasn't made any noticeable difference. Sticking my head in a bucket of icewater (no tap here) sounds ... unpleasant.

The cerebral hotspots (well, barely measurably warmer than surrounding volumes) were localized, not cooled down by surrounding cooler material, so I don't think the actual temperature is the issue. Chilling the whole brain might worsen the temperature differences, as the inflamed tissue burns more fuel to stay warm, using possibly malfunctioning mitochondria. Head cooling might work for some people, but I think I'll pass on the cold water experiment myself.

Don't want to catch a cold, after all.

 

[Frunobulax]

Me neither. Have you tried putting your head in cold water (eg. Under the tap)?

Doesn't work. Check out this video:

Low dose naltrexone is one of the few antiinflammatories that pass the blood-brain barrier. Antiinflammatory diet is IMO the best long-term solution.

Is this paper- actually recommending a suite of TREATMENTS for us?

Jesus, no less than 3 drugs, none of which are necessary if you switch to keto diet.

Insulin resistence/metabolic syndrome is NOT the cause for ME/CFS (as evidenced by plenty of people on low carb diets with excellent insulin sensitivity), and the best way to treat IR is ketogenic diet (and not drugs).

 

[pattismith]

From the paper



An increase in theta waves was also found in some polio cases, reviewed in comparision to me/cfs in 1998 (I havn´t read already the whole paper). parallels_between_post-polio_fatigue_and_chronic_fatigue.pdf

That's really interesting, those theta waves are typical for drowsiness, so I wonder if theta waves may be a marker for CFS/ME awake patients...

 

[Pyrrhus]

That's really interesting, those theta waves are typical for drowsiness, so I wonder if theta waves may be a marker for CFS/ME awake patients...

I don't know if there's any research on theta EEG waves in ME, but there may be a correlation between fatigue and a lower "peak alpha frequency":
https://forums.phoenixrising.me/threads/hyperacusis.82939/#post-2326452

 

[Wishful]

I don't know if there's any research on theta EEG waves in ME,

Does anyone here have an EEG machine? It's certainly a good project while we wait for the professionals to solve ME. I see some expensive options available, but one or more simple instrumentation amplifiers and a Raspberry Pi or equivalent microcomputer would do it (plus some electrodes).

 

[nyanko_the_sane]

Does anyone here have an EEG machine?

For all your biosensing needs see this site:
https://openbci.com/

For information on software and additional open source tech see this link:
https://github.com/NeuroTechX/awesome-bci

My first foray into this branch of brain science was Neurowave's Necomimi headset.

Not sure how this particular tech can help us though, but it sure is cute.

 

[pattismith]

I don't know if there's any research on theta EEG waves in ME, but there may be a correlation between fatigue and a lower "peak alpha frequency":
https://forums.phoenixrising.me/threads/hyperacusis.82939/#post-2326452

Increased prefrontal theta waves in fibro:

Altered theta oscillations in resting EEG of fibromyalgia syndrome patients - PubMed (nih.gov)

Increased theta waves in ME:

Cognitive impairment in fatigue and sleepiness associated conditions - ScienceDirect

 

[nyanko_the_sane]

Increased prefrontal theta waves in fibro:

Some of this data could indicate the presence of pain, there is quite a bit of pain in Fibro as well as in ME.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5374269/

The most-noticed abnormality is an increase of theta oscillations in chronic pain patients.

Clearly this is all still poorly understood, perhaps we will learn more once brain sensor implants become commonplace.

 

[Wishful]

A good project for some research group might be to get some cheap wearable EEG units made (it's fairly simple electronics) and have volunteers wear them while they do tasks, and build up a database of brain patterns. Then other groups can order some of those units for their patients, to look for differences. I'm sure lots of PWME would volunteer. Maybe it would show some differences specific to ME.

 

[nyanko_the_sane]

A good project for some research group might be to get some cheap wearable EEG units made (it's fairly simple electronics)

The problem with a lot of these open source EEG devices is that the spatial resolution is far too low to get much meaningful data. Even some professional 10/20 systems are too low res. The trick is to increase the number of electrodes. The best approach currently is to use fMRI because it has good spatial resolution, but unfortunately poor temporal resolution.